Hiring of unqualified teachers still continuing

delta_bravo · 14-03-2012 08:12PM #1

I would have thought with the massive supply of teachers this practice would have ended. However I have seen this happen lately where a person has been hired because they had a connection and now have about 15 hours including exam classes for quite common subjects. Person is only finished their BA and has no experience whatsoever.

In my opinion this is something the Teaching Council should be proactively getting involved in and if needs be forcing a schools hand in this matter.

byhookorbycrook · 14-03-2012 09:21PM

INTO have told members not to work with any unqualified teachers.What about secondary?

evolving_doors · 14-03-2012 10:22PM

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

INTO have told members not to work with any unqualified teachers.What about secondary?

Maybe it's just me but anyone ever notice that when there are debates about education in the media the INTO always step up to the plate,

but ASTI.........

...tumbleweed.....

Postgrad10 · 14-03-2012 10:29PM

Hymph ! Will you report the school DeltaBravo? Or get someone else to ?

Laura.Lee · 14-03-2012 10:37PM

delta_bravo wrote: »

I would have thought with the massive supply of teachers this practice would have ended. However I have seen this happen lately where a person has been hired because they had a connection and now have about 15 hours including exam classes for quite common subjects. Person is only finished their BA and has no experience whatsoever.

In my opinion this is something the Teaching Council should be proactively getting involved in and if needs be forcing a schools hand in this matter.

There is an unqualified teacher teaching in my school. Covering an extended sick leave. No PGDE!

highly1111 · 14-03-2012 10:50PM

Laura.Lee wrote: »

delta_bravo wrote: »

I would have thought with the massive supply of teachers this practice would have ended. However I have seen this happen lately where a person has been hired because they had a connection and now have about 15 hours including exam classes for quite common subjects. Person is only finished their BA and has no experience whatsoever.

In my opinion this is something the Teaching Council should be proactively getting involved in and if needs be forcing a schools hand in this matter.

There is an unqualified teacher teaching in my school. Covering an extended sick leave. No PGDE!

It's a shocking disgraceful practise and shame shame shame on those who employ staff (not teachers!) in this manner. It makes a mockery of our profession. The problem is what to do next? Letter of complaint on behalf of the union staff to the BOM? There should be some way an anon tip off can be given to the TC who then contact the school.

Sorry for rant - but this is really a pet hate of mine - I went through absolute hoops to get my registration sorted.

byhookorbycrook · 14-03-2012 11:00PM

TC won't do anything about it, I'd imagine.

Postgrad10 · 14-03-2012 11:07PM

Well make it public some way . Local radio / letter to a newspaper . Anything but don't be passive !

delta_bravo · 14-03-2012 11:38PM

Postgrad10 wrote: »

Well make it public some way . Local radio / letter to a newspaper . Anything but don't be passive !

Its quite difficult when you're only a sub so I don't want to step on senior toes. I'll send an email to the ASTI and see what the story is.

Postgrad10 · 15-03-2012 12:08AM

I understand its difficult for you too.
I'm a sub who can not get subbing. Plenty more like me who don't know anybody who would do anything for that job . Please do what you can to report it .

rainbowtrout · 15-03-2012 12:44AM

Happening in my school too. Principal's son is in doing subbing the last four months. No specific teacher, just whatever needs to be covered on any given day. :mad:

He's doing the dip at the moment, but as it stands is not qualified.

Postgrad10 · 15-03-2012 08:20AM

And I thought people could only be paid if they were registered with the teaching council ? Why did I bother paying their fee then ?

niallers1 · 15-03-2012 11:35AM

Maybe if we stopped hiring so many qualified Teachers as TD's we would not need to hire unqualified teachers for the class room..:rolleyes:

implausible · 15-03-2012 12:34PM

niallers1 wrote: »

Maybe if we stopped hiring so many qualified Teachers as TD's we would not need to hire unqualified teachers for the class room..:rolleyes:

What a ridiculous post!

TDs are not 'hired', they are elected.

There is a huge shortage of teaching jobs and oversupply of teachers at the moment, so your point makes no sense.

niallers1 · 15-03-2012 12:49PM

implausible wrote: »

What a ridiculous post!

TDs are not 'hired', they are elected.

There is a huge shortage of teaching jobs and oversupply of teachers at the moment, so your point makes no sense.

They interviewed for the Job and were hired by the voting public/Taxpayer.

Elected/Hired... Meh..same thing, just a bigger pool of people involved in the interview and selection process.

Anyway, That's off topic .

TheDriver · 15-03-2012 01:01PM

It is true that we are not supposed to be hiring unqualified or retired teachers. VECs won't pay these unless we have fulfilled criteria i.e. advertised and failed to get any.
However I can tell you its bloody hard to find a sub at the moment in certain subjects e..g irish, maths, home ec, french etc.
Also subs love sending in CVs but lots don't answer calls, don't want 1 day here or there etc. So sometimes it is necessary to hire unqualified people.
Its all well and good saying there are loads of teachers out of work but I find it hard to see too many queuing up at my office looking for work to be honest.

doc_17 · 15-03-2012 01:59PM

This proves that the TC is a total waste of money. We pay subs to them each year and the main reason we do this is the threat held over us that only teachers registered will be paid from oireachtas funds. This is the fault of the teaching council - noone else.

TheDriver · 15-03-2012 02:24PM

when the act will be enacted last this year, you will see the non payment taking place.
Unless there is no alternative, always remember that. Try finding a sub irish teacher for the week of the orals.

Postgrad10 · 15-03-2012 03:04PM

I've three friends who are NQT Irish teachers , they didn't get any calls during the orals despite having innondated schools in many counties . Perhaps you didn't look hard enough.

caroline72 · 15-03-2012 03:17PM

Postgrad10 wrote: »

I've three friends who are NQT Irish teachers , they didn't get any calls during the mocks despite having innondated schools in many counties . Perhaps you didn't look hard enough.

It is for the Orals they would be looking for Irish teachers, not the mocks. Orals are held first/second week back after Easter, depending on location of school.

Postgrad10 · 15-03-2012 04:06PM

I made a mistake . Thank you for correcting me .

anndub · 15-03-2012 04:14PM

Just to put the cat amongst the pigeons, one of the best teachers I had in secondary school was unqualified. She just had a passion for and brilliant knowledge of the subject matter. I'd attribute the A I got in my leaving cert to her and not the holder of the PGDE whose maternity leave she was covering.

Postgrad10 · 15-03-2012 04:34PM

That's another topic regarding the suitability of people as teachers which unfortunately can't be tested until they actually teach in the school. I too had an unqualified teacher for my leaving cert and she/ he was an amazing teacher . The problem is that unqualified and unvetted people are getting in instead of the qualified and vetted . It's so wrong .

TheDriver · 15-03-2012 05:35PM

and I agree with you, qualified should get the job first but there are situations where we cannot find anyone else.
Nothing worse than ringing a pile of CVs that people sent the week before and have a litany of excuses such as its not worth coming to you for 1 day etc. Don't people have any idea of the whole "foot in the door" lark

Postgrad10 · 15-03-2012 06:07PM

Well I hope you make a point of never calling them again Thedriver. My friends and I jump at the chance of a day no matter what. I've even known to teach anything including maths and Irish if I have to

Which are not my degree subjects

Anything to be flexible so I might get a call back!

Jimmy Iovine · 15-03-2012 06:15PM

I know a guy who has a pass degree in Irish and he has managed to get into a secondary school from the start of March till the summer holidays.

He has absolutely no teaching qualifications. All he has is connections and a few days here and there doing a spot of subbing.

I'm sure there are plenty of teachers out there that would jump at the chance to get a 3 month stint in a school. Is secondary the same as primary with regard to unqualified subbing? I had assumed it was.

therunaround · 15-03-2012 06:19PM

Iv heard of a number of schools lately in the midlands area who can't get subs. Time to start cold calling schools is now. Ye won't get work on boards. And if people get a day they should take it, might only have 50 quid profit but it's better than sitting on ur arse at home.

TheDriver · 15-03-2012 06:32PM

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

I know a guy who has a pass degree in Irish and he has managed to get into a secondary school from the start of March till the summer holidays.

He has absolutely no teaching qualifications. All he has is connections and a few days here and there doing a spot of subbing.

I'm sure there are plenty of teachers out there that would jump at the chance to get a 3 month stint in a school. Is secondary the same as primary with regard to unqualified subbing? I had assumed it was.

Like I said, I would take on someone with any bit of Irish in their degree as thats the best we can get at the moment.

Crappy Irish > No Irish

P.S. Don't cold call schools, send email or something, particularly if you have rare subjects.
And check educationposts.ie

solerina · 15-03-2012 08:37PM

I have to agree with the Driver. My school advertised for 3 weeks looking for teachers for 3 different people going on maternity leave. Eventually we got people but it took ages leveing classes with no teacher. One of those people is unqualified but in fairness she was the only one available (german national for a german teaching job). The jobs were from Jan onwards so it would have been worth the time to relocate, but not many applied at all !!

TheDriver · 15-03-2012 09:16PM

and I would say the teaching council is very handy because people have all different types of educaton qualifications including british and further afield and people are very cute at persuading you they are "qualified" however are you teaching council registered draws a line under it and asking them for their TC number really shuts them up, its a case of either put up or shut up.
So they have 1 use

kirving · 15-03-2012 09:29PM

In college at the moment, not doing teaching, but Engineering.

Most PhD students we have had lecturing/giving tutorials over the last few years have been excellent, and they were all decent.

As far as I know they didn't also have a teaching degree. As such, I believe that a copped on person, with a degree related to the subject area should be well capable of teaching it at leaving cert level. Speaking of technical subjects really, not sure about languages.

Hiring of unqualified teachers still continuing

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