Laws Regarding Split Shifts And Shift Changes

purpletele32 · 11-08-2011 12:19PM #1

Hi there,

My dad a one day week at the minute. He has been in the job 7 years but the business has changed hands recently and we get the feeling the new owners want me out because of his age.

They havent approached him regarding this but they are making life difficult for him. Since taking over they have changed his hours. He always worked a 6 hour day but that has been changed to an 8 hour split shift.

My questions are as follows

Can an employer change the number of hours an employee works unconditionally. The contract dosnt specifically mention this. Whilst 6 to 8 isnt a big jump, could they change him to full time hours (knowing at 63 he couldnt work such a schedule and hence force him out under a constructive dismissal type scenario)
He works 3 hours, has a 2 hour break and then works another 5 hours, thus making it a 10 hour day. Should he be made work the 2nd 5 hours without a break?

Thanks for any advice?
Mark

mitty87 · 11-08-2011 01:16PM

http://www.citizensinformationboard.ie/publications/providers/booklets/entitlements_employmentrights/publications_entitlements_employmentrights8.html

wmpdd3 · 12-08-2011 08:58AM

purpletele32 wrote: »

Hi there,

My dad a one day week at the minute. He has been in the job 7 years but the business has changed hands recently and we get the feeling the new owners want me out because of his age.

They havent approached him regarding this but they are making life difficult for him. Since taking over they have changed his hours. He always worked a 6 hour day but that has been changed to an 8 hour split shift.

My questions are as follows
Can an employer change the number of hours an employee works unconditionally. The contract dosnt specifically mention this. Whilst 6 to 8 isnt a big jump, could they change him to full time hours (knowing at 63 he couldnt work such a schedule and hence force him out under a constructive dismissal type scenario)

He works 3 hours, has a 2 hour break and then works another 5 hours, thus making it a 10 hour day. Should he be made work the 2nd 5 hours without a break?

Thanks for any advice?
Mark

He is def entitled to a 15 min break during the 5 hr shift.

Is he in the hotel trade, can he contact the union?

He should put it in writing that he under stands the business needs but wants his old hours and is open to any suggestions the business may have to achieving this.

Also he should keep a diary of new arrangements the new company bring in.

Has anyone else had their working week changed?

Could he live on a 25 hour week, 5 x 5 hr shifts, could he suggest this to them?

If he has a solicitor, I would have a quick consolation just to highlight to them that the issues he is having.

Also try the citizen's information center just in case they have any other ideas.

purpletele32 · 12-08-2011 09:44AM

Hi Wmpdd3,

Thanks for your reply. The main problem with the 5 hour shift is that the workload takes an extra 45 minutes to an hour to complete(unpaid pay) meaning it is almost 6 hours without any sort of break. The work he is in is bar/restaurant work so its not dissimilar to the hotel trade. He isnt part of a union however.

Most other staff have had their hours changed and seem to be unhappy but when it comes to approaching management nobody seems interested.

wmpdd3 · 12-08-2011 09:02PM

Might be time for them all to join a union, though that's not the answer to everything. Is it just one manager / owner or is there a manager you could approach in a non threatening way?

Really its just what your father or a group of employees in the place can negotiate.

I used to do that sort of work in a hotel. There were many shifts like that with no real break, it just meant lost man hours lost to sneeky cigs and general slacking off, it never works.

DizzyOC · 02-06-2016 01:25PM

Hi folks,

The wife has been rostered a split-shift as follows, is it legal? 0445 - 1000 and then 1800 - 2230 later in the day.

I'm a great man for grinding through the Organisation of Working Time Act but, for the life of me, I can't find something governing the split-shifts and their limitations. Are there laws on how split-shifts should work?

I can understand lunch/dinner splits in restaurants but crazy-early to a late shift seems a touch abusive to me. She works in the airport for a company that is brutal - I mean really brutal - and we have been through legal wrangles before, but I just can't find concrete info on the dreaded 'splits'.

Any feedback welcomed. Thanks.

EDIT: She's working 0445 - 1000 the day before and is off the day after, if it helps.

ted1 · 02-06-2016 01:29PM

DizzyOC wrote: »

Hi folks,

The wife has been rostered a split-shift as follows, is it legal? 0445 - 1000 and then 1800 - 2230 later in the day.

I'm a great man for grinding through the Organisation of Working Time Act but, for the life of me, I can't find something governing the split-shifts and their limitations. Are there laws on how split-shifts should work?

I can understand lunch/dinner splits in restaurants but crazy-early to late shift seems a touch abusive to me. She works in the airport for a company that is brutal - I mean really brutal - and we have been through legal wrangles before, but I just can't find concrete info on the dreade 'splits'.

Any feedback welcomed. Thanks.

EDIT: She's working 0445 - 1000 the day before and is off the day after, if it helps.

If she finishes at 23:30 and starts at 04:45 then that is illegal as she must have 11 hour between shifts

Organisation of working act, 1997 paragraph 11

DizzyOC · 02-06-2016 01:33PM

Hi ted1, thanks for coming back.

We've actually been down that road already and have won it - she has the 11 hours either side of this particular shift... the slightly different issue here is the dramatic spread across the day of the two halves of this shift, and if that's legal.

I can't find laws governing split shifts anywhere.

Mrs OBumble · 02-06-2016 03:13PM

FWIW, I've never heard of any laws governing split shifts.

DizzyOC · 02-06-2016 03:16PM

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

FWIW, I've never heard of any laws governing split shifts.

Unusual, is it not, that a practice as common as this - and as open to abuse as this - can go so unregulated? I can't believe that rostered hours like that are not considered to be abusive in any way.

Mrs OBumble · 02-06-2016 05:19PM

DizzyOC wrote: »

Unusual, is it not, that a practice as common as this - and as open to abuse as this - can go so unregulated? I can't believe that rostered hours like that are not considered to be abusive in any way.

It is odd, I agree. But usually laws are made to fix problems, and maybe no one's complained about this particular problem before. Try you TD, perhaps.

Not sure if I'd call it abusive. It's a pain for sure - worse of a pain if you have to travel a long way to get to work. But if she's always off the following day, then it might be a choice of getting that last few hours or not. Many workers would prefer to get the hours.

DizzyOC · 02-06-2016 05:23PM

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It is odd, I agree. But usually laws are made to fix problems, and maybe no one's complained about this particular problem before. Try you TD, perhaps.

Not sure if I'd call it abusive. It's a pain for sure - worse of a pain if you have to travel a long way to get to work. But if she's always off the following day, then it might be a choice of getting that last few hours or not. Many workers would prefer to get the hours.

Fair and balanced comments, thank you. Will have to take it away and think a little more. Appreciate you coming back on this.

LegacyUser · 17-08-2018 02:46PM

Hi. In currently working in a restaurant. Just wondering is it illegal for them to make me come in at 3pm. Take my break immediately and then have to work to close (anywhere between 10.30/12 that night) with no further breaks.. they have also now implemented a split shift. 1-3pm // back at 5-f (typically between 10:30-12). Is this also illegal? Any help would be appreciated on this matter as I feel like they are taking the absolute Mick these days under new management

LegacyUser · 17-08-2018 02:47PM

Hi. In currently working in a restaurant. Just wondering is it illegal for them to make me come in at 3pm. Take my break immediately and then have to work to close (anywhere between 10.30/12 that night) with no further breaks.. they have also now implemented a split shift. 1-3pm // back at 5-f (typically between 10:30-12). Is this also illegal? Any help would be appreciated on this matter as I feel like they are taking the absolute Mick these days under new management

Laws Regarding Split Shifts And Shift Changes

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