Is David Norris Toast?

oppenheimer1 · 31-07-2011 05:36PM

David Norris wrote:

“Well, Fuad was jailed for eighteen months for working in Israel without a permit and I managed to get that reduced and get him out” he responds. “Then Ezra said he wanted to have that relationship formally recognised under the law so they would been protected. So I said ‘I will write letters on your behalf, in this matter as well, but it’s not practical to pretend our relationship is the same as it was.’ And it wasn’t. So I told him ‘it is one thing to be a complacent Latin American spouse but it is another thing to expect me to turn into a 56 year old mistress. And I’m not going to.’ And so it ended.”

Are there more letters where he attempted to influence the courts in another jurisdiction?

http://joejacksonjournalist.com/2010/09/06/david-norris-the-joe-jackson-interview/

HarryPotter41 · 31-07-2011 05:40PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Are there more letters where he attempted to influence the courts in another jurisdiction?

http://joejacksonjournalist.com/2010/09/06/david-norris-the-joe-jackson-interview/

Seeing the inflated opinion he has of himself it would not surprise me in the least if there were.

Roanmore · 31-07-2011 06:02PM

Peleus wrote: »

Ok i only read the full 8 pages there and i can see why people take issue with it. I'd like to hear in full what he has to say on the matter. And i hope the pasts of the other candidates get investigated and criticised equally.

Gay Mitchell and Michael D. Higgings have put themselves forward for election on many of occasions and their records are there for all to examine, both have run in very competitice constituenticies where if there was any big story in their past it would surely be out by now.
David Norris has only ever gone for election as a Senator on the Trinity panel where he has never been subjected to much scrutinity, the one time he has put himself before the public all these stories start to appear. Did he think he was going to get an easy run just because he was running for President?

MadsL · 31-07-2011 06:07PM

Did he think he was going to get an easy run just because he was running for President?

He may not get a run at all. He seems to have come under unprecedented levels of scrutiny and opposition to him having a crack at the presidency.

Jeboa Safari · 31-07-2011 06:13PM

MadsL wrote: »

He may not get a run at all. He seems to have come under unprecedented levels of scrutiny and opposition to him having a crack at the presidency.

No he hasn't, if anything the media have been very soft on him

hotmail.com · 31-07-2011 06:14PM

Mitchell voted against the publication of MEP expenses. That's going to destroy his campaign when it gathers pace.

latenia · 31-07-2011 06:17PM

MadsL wrote: »

He may not get a run at all. He seems to have come under unprecedented levels of scrutiny and opposition to him having a crack at the presidency.

No worse than Brian Lenihan IMO

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Lenihan,_Snr#The_Lenihan_tape

Roanmore · 31-07-2011 06:22PM

MadsL wrote: »

He may not get a run at all. He seems to have come under unprecedented levels of scrutiny and opposition to him having a crack at the presidency.

Think back to 14 years ago, Mary McAleese, Adi Roche and the Nally guy (sorry can't remember his name) all had stories about them dragged up when they declared their intention to run. It's not a new thing, in fact go back a further 7 years and the Brian Lenihan story broke.
A lot of David Norris supporters seem to think nothing negative should be said about him.
I'd have no problem with David Norris as president but he's running for a high profile office, stories like this are bound to leak.

anymore · 31-07-2011 06:48PM

gambiaman wrote: »

Also, I don't buy that Norris never thought of this incident during the HLB post-mortem yet in the Sindo he says he compartmentalised it because it was so painful / it happened so long ago / nobody knew this was coming.

He was embroiled in a controversy pertaining to pedarasty and implicitly mentioning an older man with a younger boy and yet in the aftermath of this and amidst the post-mortem, which I presume is to ensure there are no more landmines for his campaign, doesn't remember the Ezra incident which is specifically about an older man with a younger boy?

If Jackson is giving Norris even more of a grace period for him to come clean on the other secret issues, he shouldn't hold his breath and do the public a service as a so-called journalist and release the stories.
Or stop calling himself a journalist.

At this point the HLB article shoud be reread in view of the fact that Norris was aware of the 1992 incident and had tried to influence the court sentence. It is also posssible that HLB is deserving of apologies ?

zuroph · 31-07-2011 07:12PM

anymore wrote: »

At this point the HLB article shoud be reread in view of the fact that Norris was aware of the 1992 incident and had tried to influence the court sentence. It is also posssible that HLB is deserving of apologies ?

HLB deserves no apologies. She twisted words to suit her agenda.

JonathanAnon · 31-07-2011 07:14PM

zuroph wrote: »

HLB deserves no apologies. She twisted words to suit her agenda.

Well I wouldnt put it that strongly, but she certainly didnt help the objectivity by the particular way that she paraphrased and took certain quotes out of context..

anymore · 31-07-2011 07:36PM

zuroph wrote: »

HLB deserves no apologies. She twisted words to suit her agenda.

Would you feel that the publicising the Court case might influence you to re-evaluate the article ?

anymore · 31-07-2011 07:37PM

JonathanAnon wrote: »

Well I wouldnt put it that strongly, but she certainly didnt help the objectivity by the particular way that she paraphrased and took certain quotes out of context..

Specifically, what quotes ?

zuroph · 31-07-2011 07:48PM

anymore wrote: »

Would you feel that the publicising the Court case might influence you to re-evaluate the article ?

not at all. its a seperate issue, and he's quite clear in what he says.

anymore · 31-07-2011 07:54PM

zuroph wrote: »

not at all. its a seperate issue, and he's quite clear in what he says.

I would have thought perhaps that many people would have thought other wise. I

anymore · 31-07-2011 08:08PM

Harry Angstrom wrote: »

I wonder would Joe Jackson be so keen to sit on these controversies if they involved a priest?

I can never take that guy seriously when I hear him speak with that affected mid-Atlantic accent of his. Where was he born? Dublin or Detroit? :rolleyes:

Listening to all this stuff emerging over the past few days, I think a few journos should now be apologising to Helen Lucy Burke after she was torn to shreds by the media a few months ago.

I absolutely agree you regarding HLB. My memory of her from the eighties is that she upset an awful lot of people in the Tourist industry in ireland by telling some home truths about the Irish Hotel/ restaurant industry. many felt she was far too harsh but I dont know if this is true or not. Then again many apparently felt she was too hard here as well. Well clearly she raised matters that were worthy of discussion.

tayto lover · 31-07-2011 08:23PM

zuroph wrote: »

HLB deserves no apologies. She twisted words to suit her agenda.

Did she not give D. Norris two opportunities to amend his own words before printing in fairness. Collaborated by John Waters today i believe. Or is he twisting David's words too ?

zuroph · 31-07-2011 08:25PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Did she not give D. Norris two opportunities to amend his own words before printing in fairness. Collaborated by John Waters today i believe. Or is he twisting David's words too ?

Waters confirms that HLB told him she did. that's all. she read him only certain sections of the text. We've been over this.

take everything · 31-07-2011 08:34PM

Roanmore wrote: »

Think back to 14 years ago, Mary McAleese, Adi Roche and the Nally guy (sorry can't remember his name) all had stories about them dragged up when they declared their intention to run. It's not a new thing, in fact go back a further 7 years and the Brian Lenihan story broke.
A lot of David Norris supporters seem to think nothing negative should be said about him.

I think what this whole thing ironically highlights is our still immature attitude to things like homosexuality etc. So-called progressive types were so anxious to gloss over any possible issues surrounding DN for fear of being homophobic instead of disregarding his sexuality and dealing with the issue. He should be treated like anyone else in this situation, no more, no less.
His sexuality is irrelevant. The pussyfooting by the "progressives" pisses me off no end though.

Callan57 · 31-07-2011 08:42PM

Regrettably I think David Norris should withdraw his candidacy now .... it is sad & perhaps unfair but I think at this stage he is actually doing damage to the campaign for gay rights.

HarryPotter41 · 31-07-2011 08:47PM

zuroph wrote: »

HLB deserves no apologies. She twisted words to suit her agenda.

If you listen to the John Waters interview with Eamon Dunphy David Norris was given the opportunity to clarify if what he said were the actual words he wanted to use. he said they were, hardly twisting of anything then.

JonathanAnon · 31-07-2011 09:39PM

anymore wrote: »

Specifically, what quotes ?

I was talking more generally about how HLB represented her case on Liveline.. But some of the subjective sections of the article are mentioned..

She first of all said that "David Norris went to Thailand on a holiday".. she left it open to a planting a seed in people's minds that he possibly went on a sex holiday.. (She was pulled up on this during the interview and it was clarified that he was actually there on EU work)..

Also on this program she quoted from her own article saying "He did not appear to endorse any minimum age or endorse my protest that a child was not capable of informed consent"... which was HLB paraphrasing what Norris said and effectively drawing her own conclusions as to what he meant (rather than quoting him verbatim).

Dont get me wrong, I think HLB was right to raise the issue.. And I would share her worries about our potential President having such views.. I just think she compromised her objectivity by colouring the article with her own opinions rather than sticking with the cold facts of what he had said..

Judgement Day · 31-07-2011 09:57PM

Isn't the simple fact this - if you aspire to a job with a high public profile you need to have been squeaky clean in your past life or it will always come back to bite you! I feel sorry for David Norris as he seems a genuinely decent person, as well as being head and shoulders above the other declared candidates, but he needs to quit now. I only hope that when he does withdraw the media will leave him alone.

I see that he is now 12/1 with Paddy Power http://www.paddypower.com/bet/politics/other-politics/next-irish-president?ev_oc_grp_ids=33552

Roanmore · 31-07-2011 10:24PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Isn't the simple fact this - if you aspire to a job with a high public profile you need to have been squeaky clean in your past life or it will always come back to bite you! I feel sorry for David Norris as he seems a genuinely decent person, as well as being head and shoulders above the other declared candidates, but he needs to quit now. I only hope that when he does withdraw the media will leave him alone.

I see that he is now 12/1 with Paddy Power http://www.paddypower.com/bet/politics/other-politics/next-irish-president?ev_oc_grp_ids=33552

I think this is a very good post, having said that I don't think you should be squeaky clean, you know the saying "A person who who never made a mistake etc.", however the internet age has made election campaigns seem like minefields. Somebody else mentioned earlier that Gay Mitchell voted against MEP's expensenes being made public and that it would destroy it, I don't think so, it will hurt him for a day or two but something else will come up after about somebody else.
As I said earlier Gay Mitchell and Michael D. have been through election campaigns that have been dirty, most of their secrets are out.

Shea O'Meara · 31-07-2011 11:22PM

Peleus wrote: »

I'm 21 years old and I have little interest in politics. But when I saw Norris was running for presidency I was happy that maybe we'll have a guy in power who actually gives a **** about us.

Look at the government system we have in place. The world's politicians seem to be all cheats and liars nowadays. I don't know why but i trust Norris' character. I know he's honest and most importantly intelligent. We need more people like him around. I don't see why we are singling him out like this and dragging his name down? How about instead of looking for the bad in people like David Norris, we support them and see how great they can be.

There are alot more unsavoury characters in the Dail.

That's a slippery slope and how FFail stayed in/got away with it for so long. You need hold people to certain standards, once you find yourself making excuses or drawing comparasons to others deemed worse..you've already been let down and should move on.

MadsL · 31-07-2011 11:36PM

From supporters FB page

Today's newspaper articles regarding David Norris and his character reference letters from 1997 for his former partner have led to the resignation of a number of the Senator's campaign team. As the administrator of this unofficial supporters page with no formal links to the Norris campaign I have not been privy to the internal operations of the Norris campaign. In light of the recent developments I want to reiterate that this supporters page has always been and continues to be a venue for supporters of David Norris. In that spirit I wanted to give you the opportunity to inform yourself of the facts of this issue and decide where you stand in relation to your support for David Norris so I have provided a link to the article in the Sunday Independent http://www.independent.ie/national-news/revealed-full-details-of-norris-mercy-plea-2836065.html

There is also a link to the letters in question which are character references supplied by David Norris to his former partner's legal team - http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0730/norrisletter.pdf

The letters detail David Norris' opinion of Mr Ezra Yizhak, raises concerns about the nature of trial he was subject to and offers insight into how similar trials would be treated in Ireland. In the letters David Norris makes it clear that he respects the processes of the Israeli courts and that he does not wish to interfere with these processes but rather he wanted to provide his services as a personal friend of Mr Yizhak, his knowledge of similar cases and asking for leniency in respect of the excessive sentencing handed to Mr Yizhak.

In my capacity as administrator of this page I want to allow you to get the facts of this issue and make your own decision on whether you still support David Norris in his bid for the Presidency of Ireland. I am going to post a poll asking you just that. The response to this poll will help me understand how you are feeling in your support. It will also send a message to the wider public about the level of support David Norris still has.

At this point I wish to acknowledge the contribution of Duirmuid, the founder of this page who through his own drive to see positive change in Ireland created one of the most successful political Facebook pages in the country. His energy, drive and caring nature have been an education to me. For his own reasons which he has posted on the wall of this page he has handed full ownership of this page over to me and which I humbly thank him for.

Finally as administrator I wish to thank the members of this page for their energy, enthusiasm and sense of civic responsibility in the wish for a better Ireland in respect of the Presidential race. My primary concern has been and continues to be to the members of this page. As a supporter of David Norris I reiterate that I wish to see him on the ballot paper in Octobers Presidential election so the Irish people can decide if he should hold the position as First Citizen.

Ronan

Administrator

.

PomBear · 31-07-2011 11:36PM

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=9021

Wonder if/when this will make headlines

Wolfe Tone · 31-07-2011 11:38PM

PomBear wrote: »

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=9021

Wonder if/when this will make headlines

Thats a bit different tbf, he wanted the man taken off of death row.

MadsL · 31-07-2011 11:40PM

PomBear wrote: »

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=9021

Wonder if/when this will make headlines

round about now.....

Roanmore · 31-07-2011 11:43PM

PomBear wrote: »

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=9021

Wonder if/when this will make headlines

So what is your opinion of it?

Is David Norris Toast?

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