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Using a Cable router with DSL broadband and modem?

  • 03-02-2011 01:01PM
    #1
    DavyD_83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,992 ✭✭✭


    :confused::confused:
    Hi,
    At the moment I have Eircom Broadband with the standard Netopia wireless Modem Router.
    The range on it is just not doing the job and won't cover the whole house.

    Decided to buy a Wireless N Router in the hope of increasing range.
    Got to the shop and figured I'd be better off with a Cable Router (probably wrong) on the basis that if/when I upgrade to cable broadband the router won't become useless.

    I asked the guy in the shop if it would work like this and would give me the increased range I was hoping for, he said yes (lie/wrong??).

    Went with the Linksys E1000 in the end, but when I connected it to Netopia, range and speed seem to be the same as before.

    Any advice? Is there a simple way to make this work?

    Or should I just bring it back and get myself a DSL Wireless N router or modem router?

    Any help appreciated..
    Thanks
    Dave


Comments

  • #2
    RogueFaye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29 ✭RogueFaye


    now i don't know HOW you're setting up this router in the hope of achieving extra range, if you're not doing anything special than just connecting The linksys via cable to your netopia and let the Linksys broadcast then i wont be suprise that you gain little to nothing since the only obivously advantage you got was an upgraded wireless signal from Wireless G to a Wireless N protocal.Dispise what they would advertise in the box, wireless N doesn't always offer a longer range.
    To effective increase the range, you can do 3 things.
    1. Increase the Milliwatt power output of your router, There are 2 ways to do this as i would explain in 1a and 1b.
    1a. If you're modem is capable of running a 3rd party Firewire such as DD-WRT , a typical Router would broadcast anywhere from 15-30Mw of power, DD-WRT would let user manually adjust up to 251mw,but this max setting would more than likely fry your router, common sense and risk apply if trying this solution.
    1b,a more simplier solution and one which I'm currently using, is to get a Wireless G signal booster, I bought mine off ebay for around 50e, HERE is the exact one i'm using for over a year.YOu just connect your antennas out socket into this box and it will boost your signal anywhere from 500mw to 1000mw which should cover any house.Legal limit is 2000mw as this is classified as Military class power.
    2. Get a Wireless gateway/extender. Its like a router but you place it somewhere before you lose your signal,its like daisy chained if u know what i mean.You just have to setup the gateway/extender so it connects to your netopia wirelessly in bridged form,You get them in Peats for 69e.
    3. The last solution, might be easier and cheapest, but limited in effectiveness, get a bigger Antennas for you router. Typical router comes with 2-5dbi antenass, You can pickup a cheap 12dbi for like 10e in Ebay. 12dbi is like...a feet long :)
    Any other question, feel free to ask :)


  • #3
    DavyD_83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,992 ✭✭✭DavyD_83


    RogueFaye wrote: »
    now i don't know HOW you're setting up this router in the hope of achieving extra range, if you're not doing anything special than just connecting The linksys via cable to your netopia and let the Linksys broadcast then i wont be suprise that you gain little to nothing since the only obivously advantage you got was an upgraded wireless signal from Wireless G to a Wireless N protocal.Dispise what they would advertise in the box, wireless N doesn't always offer a longer range.

    Hi Faye,
    Thanks for the response.
    So, yep, I wasn't planning on doing anything special, and had just hoped that having N wireless from the linksys woulod boost my range. I think we had a similar setup in my parents house that seemed to do the job (different setup though, so maybe it was just luck).
    Obviously as you've said this doesn't happen in reality; my mistake :(

    Thanks for the options, I'll look into them properly over next few days, sounds like any of them should be a better solution for me.

    Now to see if I can return the Linksys....
    Dave


  • #4
    dub45
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,454 Mod ✭✭✭✭dub45


    Have you turned of dhcp in the netopia?

    Also is the wireless card n?

    If not it will just be a g network.


  • #5
    Owen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,678 ✭✭✭✭Owen


    I actually tried that today. I've a Dovado UMR 3g router from when I had o2 broadband which works fine with my UPC Cable Modem - and a friend wants to buy that, so I tried using my old Netopia DSL modem with the UPC Cable Modem. Googled how to do it, stumbled across a few threads here saying to disable DHCP, but nothing happened. I could see the Netopia fine, but nothing got through to the UPC modem.


  • #6
    dub45
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,454 Mod ✭✭✭✭dub45


    PaintDoctor wrote: »
    I actually tried that today. I've a Dovado UMR 3g router from when I had o2 broadband which works fine with my UPC Cable Modem - and a friend wants to buy that, so I tried using my old Netopia DSL modem with the UPC Cable Modem. Googled how to do it, stumbled across a few threads here saying to disable DHCP, but nothing happened. I could see the Netopia fine, but nothing got through to the UPC modem.

    We are talking about two different things here.

    If you are using the netopia as a dsl modem/router (with say eircom) and then add another router then you will be duplicating the router functions.

    However the netopia is not intended for use with the likes of a upc modem.


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  • #7
    Owen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,678 ✭✭✭✭Owen


    Sorry, you're correct in that. My brain's not working. I'd read through so many old boards threads today regarding that, and thought this was another one.

    Feel free to pretend I wasn't in this thread ... :o


  • #8
    Snowbat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,065 ✭✭✭Snowbat


    RogueFaye wrote: »
    Legal limit is 2000mw as this is classified as Military class power.
    LOL WUT

    The legal limit in Ireland for 2.4 GHz wi-fi is +20 dBm. That's about 60 mW transmit power when using the type of antenna normally supplied (~2.1 dBi gain).


  • #9
    DavyD_83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,992 ✭✭✭DavyD_83


    dub45 wrote: »
    Have you turned of dhcp in the netopia?

    Also is the wireless card n?

    If not it will just be a g network.

    I read somewhere that I should turn off DHCP on the Netopia alright; tried it and everything stopped working. :confused:

    Wireless card on the comp I can't reach at the moment is N, still can't reach it. Card on my laptop appears to be G.
    Wii, is between my laptop and computer and picks up a very weak signal sometimes - not sure what level of connectivity in a wii.


  • #10
    RogueFaye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29 ✭RogueFaye


    Snowbat wrote: »
    LOL WUT

    The legal limit in Ireland for 2.4 GHz wi-fi is +20 dBm. That's about 60 mW transmit power when using the type of antenna normally supplied (~2.1 dBi gain).

    Sorry I was a bit misleading with the figures. I should add that the Wifi adapters we get outside with output up to 1kw, would only be legal in Ireland if using a Direction point to point antennas, and indeed our typical antennas are bi-directional. Just out of curiousity, how is one to measure or even enforce you to use a directional antennas?
    I do have a 16dbi antennas and 500wm adapter , I'm not saying i'm using it TOGETHER :rolleyes:
    2k adapters, strange, a few years ago you couldn't get them Anywhere unless in singapore or taiwan, now you can get them off ebay. They would be totally illegal no matter what antenas u pair them with....


  • #11
    RogueFaye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29 ✭RogueFaye


    DavyD_83 wrote: »
    I read somewhere that I should turn off DHCP on the Netopia alright; tried it and everything stopped working. :confused:

    Wireless card on the comp I can't reach at the moment is N, still can't reach it. Card on my laptop appears to be G.
    Wii, is between my laptop and computer and picks up a very weak signal sometimes - not sure what level of connectivity in a wii.

    your netopia is doing the PPPOE handshake and using DHCP, your wireless N router was connecting to it via a cable and gets it internet connection from the DHCP fed source, it isn't establising the PPPOE itself, the Netopia is spoon feeding it and acts as a gateway. Once you stop the DHCP on the netopia, your wireless N is not getting an IP or finding the gateway hence no network.
    It doens't help if your router is N if you don't have a N network card, N device working in G mode is actually worst in practice, since your PC is N but laptop not, just for experimental purpose, go into your Wireless N router and configure it as N only, not Mix or N+G , see if your desktop is picking up anything.


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  • #12
    dub45
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,454 Mod ✭✭✭✭dub45


    RogueFaye wrote: »
    your netopia is doing the PPPOE handshake and using DHCP, your wireless N router was connecting to it via a cable and gets it internet connection from the DHCP fed source, it isn't establising the PPPOE itself, the Netopia is spoon feeding it and acts as a gateway. Once you stop the DHCP on the netopia, your wireless N is not getting an IP or finding the gateway hence no network.
    It doens't help if your router is N if you don't have a N network card, N device working in G mode is actually worst in practice, since your PC is N but laptop not, just for experimental purpose, go into your Wireless N router and configure it as N only, not Mix or N+G , see if your desktop is picking up anything.

    Surely if you stop the dhcp on the netopia the netopia will simply at as a modem and the router should then kick in? Alternately you could turn off the dhcp in the new router and just use it as an N wireless point. You should also be turning off the wireless in the netopia to avoid confusion.


  • #13
    RogueFaye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29 ✭RogueFaye


    dub45 wrote: »
    Surely if you stop the dhcp on the netopia the netopia will simply at as a modem and the router should then kick in? Alternately you could turn off the dhcp in the new router and just use it as an N wireless point. You should also be turning off the wireless in the netopia to avoid confusion.

    WRONG, turning off DHCP only stops the netopia assigning IP address, it will NOT serve as a modem only,That is why in the forum there are Guides in how to configure your netopia as Modem only.it will still handshake the PPPOE and it's still connected to the internet. The clients would be able to get a connection from the Netopia by inputing manual settings in their Tcp/ip properties.
    The router will also NOT automatically kick in, I'm pretty sure his current router is set to Dynamic IP routing, He will need to set it as PPPOE and type in Username and Password. His Router woulnd't be set to PPPOE already,If he already had it as PPPOE it wouldn't work at all since the Netopia is on the PPPOE link already and the Router wouldn't route from the Dynamic IP.


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