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Giant Fox caught in Kent

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    #212
    everypenny
    Registered Users Posts: 255 ✭✭everypenny


    Discodog wrote: »
    Yes but they weren't shot & great care was taken to protect pet cats.

    Can't imagine MACT1RE or everpenny doing this.

    Euthanasia refers to the practice of ending a life.

    According to the house of lords in england, the precise definition of euthanasia is "a deliberate intervention undertaken with the express intention of ending a life"

    The method of ending this life is not stated. So in fact both of us do.


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    #213
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Cats are rather off topic but it has clarified the situation.

    This is what MACT1RE posted in Hunting

    "That's been up in the A&P forum for well over 24hrs and no one has batted an eyelid including your sparing partner DISCODOG who also posted in the same topic. I for one think its useful to know the mentality of the people you're debating with."

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056141098&page=7

    Well maybe people here also need to know the mentality of posters who think it perfectly acceptable to shoot cats.


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    #214
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    If this is what you mean can you elaborate. Cats can move huge distances so how is location relevant in making sure that you are not killing a pet ?.

    How can you identify a feral cat because I don't think that I could & certainly not sure enough to shoot it ?. Just because it acts feral doesn't mean that it is not just a scared pet.

    Example one:

    I’m in a farmer’s field. There are farmyards ever 3 or 4 fields from me. I see a cat, it has no collar but looks clean, healthy, well fed and is heading in the direction of a nearby farm yard.
    I leave it be.

    Example two:

    I’m in the middle of a large Coillte forest lett on the side of a mountain. I see a cat, it has no collar and looks diseased, skinny, unhealthy.
    I shoot it.

    These examples are not exhaustive and I would always error on the side of caution. As I said before I am a cat owner, I do not go out hunting for cats.

    And when we get pulled for being Way Off Topic, I hope you will admit to directing us here.


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    #215
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    everypenny wrote: »
    Euthanasia refers to the practice of ending a life.

    According to the house of lords in england, the precise definition of euthanasia is "a deliberate intervention undertaken with the express intention of ending a life"

    The method of ending this life is not stated. So in fact both of us do.

    That's for human euthanasia :D. The Vet will of used the standard injection method as the cats were trapped first.


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    #216
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    Yes but they weren't shot & great care was taken to protect pet cats.

    "For the protection of people and other animals that frequent the island, the feral cats were caught and euthanised humanely," said Sandy Alcorn, a corncrake field worker with Birdwatch Ireland.
    "We took photographs of all the pet cats and provided them with collars before we started to catch the feral cats in humane traps and euthanise them," she said.
    A vet has since made two trips to the island to neuter the domestic cat population.

    Read more: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/cat-cull-on-donegal-island-14578232.html#ixzz1Ale7voBj


    Can't imagine MACT1RE or everpenny doing this.

    I can't imagine you doing it either. Or the government coughing up the dosh to have it do country wide. So in the mean time at least I take the initiative we the need arises. What are you doing?


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    #217
    EGAR
    Registered Users Posts: 2,874 ✭✭✭EGAR


    This is ridiculous. Feral cats were once or descended from pet cats. So who is responsible for them being brought to Ireland and allowed to become feral: humans. Yes, they are an introduced species but if you want to go down that path then consider this: no animal has caused more havoc and created more trouble for nature then Man, who btw is also an introduced species to the island now known as Ireland.

    TNR is the only way forward to control feral cat colonies. And not just feral cats should be neutered/spayed.

    I have got seven cats, each single one of them was feral before coming here. I have also got a healthy songbird population around here as I am a responsible cat owner and keep them in at certain times of the day etc.

    I have TNR'd quite a few cats and am still doing it.

    Again, education is the key not ham-fisted methods like some trigger happy "person" going around shooting cats.

    Reminds me a bit of the badger culling saga..:rolleyes:


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    #218
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    MACT1RE wrote: »
    Example one:
    I’m in the middle of a large Coillte forest lett on the side of a mountain. I see a cat, it has no collar and looks diseased, skinny, unhealthy.
    I shoot it.

    And when we get pulled for being Way Off Topic, I hope you will admit to directing us here.

    So poor Tiddles had better not be in a forest & starving. I can think of someone here who has rescued pet cats from exactly this type of situation. The facts are that you cannot be sure that you are not shooting a pet.

    Btw Check back & you will see that it was you who first mentioned cats & used your pet cat to illustrate that you like animals & balanced it against hunting.


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    #219
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    Well maybe people here also need to know the mentality of posters who think it perfectly acceptable to shoot cats.

    See, now your just trying to put words in my mouth and that my friend is the lowest form of debate.;)

    What i said was;
    MACT1RE wrote: »
    Yes, I would shoot a feral cat without hesitation as they are one of the most disease ridden creatures ever inflicted on the Irish country side and are a direct result of human negligence and misguided sympathy.

    I also said I am a cat owner myself.

    I stand by both statments.


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    #220
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Discodog wrote: »
    So poor Tiddles had better not be in a forest & starving. I can think of someone here who has rescued pet cats from exactly this type of situation.

    Must be telepathy EGAR :D


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    #221
    Whispered
    Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    Can you shoot in coilte forests? Are they marked? We walk with the dog through coilte forests, I didn't realise you can shoot there. :eek:

    If you saw a dog, looking starved and lost in a forest, would you shoot that too?


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    #222
    EGAR
    Registered Users Posts: 2,874 ✭✭✭EGAR


    I live right next to a Coillte forest and there will be hell to pay if my cats were shot. Literally.


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    #223
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    MACT1RE wrote: »
    See, now your just trying to put words in my mouth and that my friend is the lowest form of debate.;)

    Just following your example in Hunting :D You had better edit that before I use the "my friend" bit in the hunting forum. The lads wouldn't like to think that I was a friend of yours.


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    #224
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    Btw Check back & you will see that it was you who first mentioned cats & used your pet cat to illustrate that you like animals & balanced it against hunting.

    Yes and it was you who first mentioned shooting them.


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    #225
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    Just following your example in Hunting :D

    When did I put words in your mouth in the hunting forum?


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    #226
    everypenny
    Registered Users Posts: 255 ✭✭everypenny


    @ Discodog If it was a PET cat it wouldn't be in the middle of a coilte woods starving and in need of rescue.
    I also don't see the difference in the method of euthanasia. So you're saying its ok to give a cat a lethal injection as on tory island but not to shoot it? I've seen the results of both on animals and i promise you my way is quicker.
    @ Egar i agree education is the key. You start a national wide programme that teaches people to neuter pets and a nation wide program that TNR's them or performs injective eutanasia like Discodog advocates and i'll stop.

    Until that time i'm gonna stand by my right to reduce an alien, wild species that is doing damage to other animals in the countryside.
    This is one of those tangents that has gone way off topic. I reccomend that it be brought back onto topic.
    Namely, should vets be allowed to hunt.


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    #227
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Whispered wrote: »
    Can you shoot in coilte forests? Are they marked? We walk with the dog through coilte forests, I didn't realise you can shoot there. :eek:

    Yes you can, under license from Coillte.


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    #228
    Whispered
    Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    Are they marked or anything? How do you avoid running into a hunter? (as a walker I mean not as a fellow hunter)


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    #229
    EGAR
    Registered Users Posts: 2,874 ✭✭✭EGAR


    Whispered wrote: »
    Can you shoot in coilte forests? Are they marked? We walk with the dog through coilte forests, I didn't realise you can shoot there. :eek:


    AFAIK Coillte actually pays guys to hunt goats on their land. There is an old thread when I had a huge run in with some of those idiots and shots were actually fired whilst I was walking with my son and dogs in the forest. I will see if I can find it.

    They paid dearly for that.


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    #230
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    MACT1RE wrote: »
    When did I put words in your mouth in the hunting forum?

    "That's been up in the A&P forum for well over 24hrs and no one has batted an eyelid including your sparing partner DISCODOG who also posted in the same topic. I for one think its useful to know the mentality of the people you're debating with."

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showt...6141098&page=7

    You were trying to portray me as agreeing with some very extreme views weren't you ?.


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    #231
    ISDW
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭ISDW


    everypenny wrote: »
    @ Discodog If it was a PET cat it wouldn't be in the middle of a coilte woods starving and in need of rescue.
    I also don't see the difference in the method of euthanasia. So you're saying its ok to give a cat a lethal injection as on tory island but not to shoot it? I've seen the results of both on animals and i promise you my way is quicker.
    @ Egar i agree education is the key. You start a national wide programme that teaches people to neuter pets and a nation wide program that TNR's them or performs injective eutanasia like Discodog advocates and i'll stop.

    Until that time i'm gonna stand by my right to reduce an alien, wild species that is doing damage to other animals in the countryside.
    This is one of those tangents that has gone way off topic. I reccomend that it be brought back onto topic.
    Namely, should vets be allowed to hunt.

    No, that is not the topic, re-read the beginning of the thread.


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    #232
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Whispered wrote: »
    Are they marked or anything? How do you avoid running into a hunter? (as a walker I mean not as a fellow hunter)

    A licensed hunter, usually deer stalking from Sep 1st to Feb28th, is obliged to put up signs which can be downloaded from the Coillte website at the entrances to forest trails stating that firearms are in use. Stalking is usually limited to between an hour before sun-up and 11:00 am. If you see these signs, you should not enter the forest.


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    #233
    everypenny
    Registered Users Posts: 255 ✭✭everypenny


    EGAR wrote: »
    AFAIK Coillte actually pays guys to hunt goats on their land. There is an old thread when I had a huge run in with some of those idiots and shots were actually fired whilst I was walking with my son and dogs in the forest. I will see if I can find it.

    They paid dearly for that.
    So you know, i would be a huge advocate of safety when it comes to firearms, as would all the shooters and hunters i know. I feel i can safely speak for the ones i know in saying that at no point would we ever condone the firing of ammunition in the vicinity or around other people.

    There has been many a day that i have been out shooting and have stopped because of people in the area. I would rather miss 1000 days hunting then have an accident on my hands.

    At no stage would i fire a shot unless i knew where it was going to land ie ensuring that a propper backround was in place, so as to ensure that other people in the area,, property or livestock was not put at risk.

    In regards to walking in the countryside, you are perfectly safe. If you wish to wear bright colours as is advised in america then do. I personally used to put them on my dog when out running to make it easier that he be seen by traffic, the same principal would apply here.


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    #234
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    MACT1RE wrote: »
    A licensed hunter, usually deer stalking from Sep 1st to Feb28th, is obliged to put up signs which can be downloaded from the Coillte website at the entrances to forest trails stating that firearms are in use. Stalking is usually limited to between an hour before sun-up and 11:00 am. If you see these signs, you should not enter the forest.

    Don't take your guide dog to the forest or accidentally miss the signs.


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    #235
    EGAR
    Registered Users Posts: 2,874 ✭✭✭EGAR


    FAO Whispered: http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055208362&highlight=coillte+goats
    Until that time i'm gonna stand by my right to reduce an alien, wild species that is doing damage to other animals in the countryside.

    Alien and WILD? And it's your RIGHT? Ah, now we are coming closer to showing true colours ;). The cat is a domesticated species, not a wild one. No animal (apart from humans) causes more damage to the environment than the cow (but then who would want to give up their steak, hm?).

    One cannot educate the ignorant and I suspect strongly that we have an element of enjoyment in all that. Shame.


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    #236
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    You were trying to portray me as agreeing with some very extreme views weren't you ?.

    I was simply making an observation that you had no problem continuing to post. But maybe I was mistaken, did you report the post yourself?


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    #237
    MACT1RE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭MACT1RE


    Discodog wrote: »
    Don't take your guide dog to the forest or accidentally miss the signs.

    Why?


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    #238
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    MACT1RE wrote: »
    I was simply making an observation that you had no problem continuing to post. But maybe I was mistaken, did you report the post yourself?

    I didn't even see it but I very rarely report posts - I don't mind being insulted.


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    #239
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,857 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    MACT1RE wrote: »
    Why?

    Because according to you & everypenny it is our responsibility to make sure that we don't get shot when walking in woods that we own.


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    #240
    everypenny
    Registered Users Posts: 255 ✭✭everypenny


    EGAR wrote: »
    FAO Whispered: http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055208362&highlight=coillte+goats



    Alien and WILD? And it's your RIGHT? Ah, now we are coming closer to showing true colours ;). The cat is a domesticated species, not a wild one. No animal (apart from humans) causes more damage to the environment than the cow (but then who would want to give up their steak, hm?).

    One cannot educate the ignorant and I suspect strongly that we have an element of enjoyment in all that. Shame.
    Any animal bred in the wild for two generations is considered wild. Any animal that was once tame and is now wild is considered feral. Cows are domesticated animals.

    Cows that have been left to breed in the wild, ie: after a farmer dies and cows breed for a generation or two in the wild, are not. And have been subject to government culling before.

    Yes, my right. It is my legal right to shoot a non protected species with the appropriate licensed firearm on lands i own or have permission to both shoot on and at animals i have permission to shoot at.

    Again i'm stating facts here. I'm leaving emotion out of it.

    If i were to bring emotion in to it i would mention my neighbours emotions at arriving one day to his chicken coup and the chickens that were torn apart but not eaten by a feral cat. I know it was a cat because we caught him in there at it.

    He shot the cat as he would a fox. I would have done the same.


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    #241
    everypenny
    Registered Users Posts: 255 ✭✭everypenny


    Discodog wrote: »
    Because according to you & everypenny it is our responsibility to make sure that we don't get shot when walking in woods that we own.
    Whoa!!!!!!!! I never said that and don't like having words being put in my mouth at all.... What i said was that i as a shooter would always make sure that my shot was safe.
    As such i said that people would be safe walking in woods. I stated "If you wish to wear bright colours...." as advice and stated how i did this with my dogs. It was advice on a common sense theme and one i assume anyone would take when walking at night in case of traffic and is also a good idea when out walking in hills or countryside for both a shooting reason and for the fact that if you have an accident you can be found easier.
    At no stage whatsoever did i state that it was your responsibility that you didn't get shot at all. I resent that accusation.

    My entire, unedited quote is below...

    "So you know, i would be a huge advocate of safety when it comes to firearms, as would all the shooters and hunters i know. I feel i can safely speak for the ones i know in saying that at no point would we ever condone the firing of ammunition in the vicinity or around other people.

    There has been many a day that i have been out shooting and have stopped because of people in the area. I would rather miss 1000 days hunting then have an accident on my hands.

    At no stage would i fire a shot unless i knew where it was going to land ie ensuring that a propper backround was in place, so as to ensure that other people in the area,, property or livestock was not put at risk.

    In regards to walking in the countryside, you are perfectly safe. If you wish to wear bright colours as is advised in america then do. I personally used to put them on my dog when out running to make it easier that he be seen by traffic, the same principal would apply here. "


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