Students attack Leinster house with Mars Bars

muffy · 04-11-2010 02:24AM

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

The "rent-a-mob" group, as you say were to prime cause of the violence, I agree. I do however believe that the other LY, SWP, etc.. should have expected the militant thugs to show up, given that there was a huge amount of people there and word spreads fast. They should have just remained in the main protest. You have to see though that given the scale of the events today, the Dof sit-in was bound to be fairly unproductive. They should have done that on another day.

Au contraire, I would say it was a lot more productive than listening to some USI people fannying about, but then I'm a little radical in my politics. These militant people seem to show up at everything, like the SWP...I had a problem with them before, apparently they used to high jack anti war marches. I think today they were needed, I do think people need to distinguish between the SWP/Labour Youth, etc, and the group of very angry thugs.

PanchoVilla · 04-11-2010 02:26AM

K-9 wrote: »

Answer my question first.

Is the protest of 2 taxi men in anyway comparable that went on today?

Answer that and we can then address the next point.

The students didn't attack anyone yet were dragged away by Gardaí.

The taxi drivers didn't attack anyone yet were left until an injunction to force them to leave could be served.

Killer Pigeon · 04-11-2010 02:27AM

muffy wrote: »

Au contraire, I would say it was a lot more productive than listening to some USI people fannying about, but then I'm a little radical in my politics. These militant people seem to show up at everything, like the SWP...I had a problem with them before, apparently they used to high jack anti war marches. I think today they were needed, I do think people need to distinguish between the SWP/Labour Youth, etc, and the group of very angry thugs.

I mean unproductive in the sense that the media, etc., were too caught up in main protest, it would have gone unnoticed. It's the opposite now of course, for all the wrong reasons.

Des Carter · 04-11-2010 02:28AM

PanchoVilla wrote: »

The students didn't attack anyone yet were dragged away by Gardaí.

The taxi drivers didn't attack anyone yet were left until an injunction to force them to leave could be served.

What he said!!!

K-9 · 04-11-2010 02:30AM

PanchoVilla wrote: »

The students didn't attack anyone yet were dragged away by Gardaí.

The taxi drivers didn't attack anyone yet were left until an injunction to force them to leave could be served.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

So you see 2 taximen in the Taxi Regulators office as directly comparable to what went on today?

Killer Pigeon · 04-11-2010 02:31AM

K-9 wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something?

Where did they attack the Guards?

This is exactly the thing I'm trying to get at, we need to distinguish LY, SWP for the 'rent-a-mob' after this mess so that the former's name will not be in vain and viewed as 'thugs', 'hooligans' or 'trouble makers' in the future. I think someone should have really go onto liveline about this.

Des Carter · 04-11-2010 02:35AM

K-9 wrote: »

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

So you see 2 taximen in the Taxi Regulators office as directly comparable to what went on today?

In terms of the DoF sit-in, YES

What went on outside is a completely seperate issue.

Im talking about the students inside the building who caused no violence and were peaceful being dragged out by gardai while the two taximen who done the exact same thing werent touched and only left after they received an injunction.

K-9 · 04-11-2010 02:36AM

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

This is exactly the thing I'm trying to get at, we need to distinguish LY, SWP for the 'rent-a-mob' after this mess so that the former's name will not be in vain and viewed as 'thugs', 'hooligans' or 'trouble makers' in the future. I think someone should have really go onto liveline about this.

And I'm completely with you on that one.

In one scenario, the 2 taxi men had a peaceful protest, the Guards acted very professionally and had no problem with the protest.

The other scenario, A few morons, who'll attack the Guards given any chance, we all know the types, ruin it for everybody else. The protest was going on grand, the point was made and a few Neanderthals ruined it for the vast majority of peaceful, law abiding people.

muffy · 04-11-2010 02:37AM

K-9 wrote: »

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

So you see 2 taximen in the Taxi Regulators office as directly comparable to what went on today?

People peacefully holding a sit in occupation of a government building? Pretty much the same, except as you can see from the videos posted, these people were flung out onto the streets by gardai. I have to point out, the sit in began apx one hour before things turned violent, maybe more. They never stormed the building, more walked in and sat down.

PanchoVilla · 04-11-2010 02:37AM

K-9 wrote: »

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

So you see 2 taximen in the Taxi Regulators office as directly comparable to what went on today?

I've already directly compared them so that pretty much answers your question. Perhaps you could explain how they are not directly comparable?

K-9 · 04-11-2010 02:38AM

muffy wrote: »

People peacefully holding a sit in occupation of a government building? Pretty much the same, except as you can see from the videos posted, these people were flung out onto the streets by gardai. I have to point out, the sit in began apx one hour before things turned violent, maybe more. They never stormed the building, more walked in and sat down.

2 men as against how many? 50/60 people?

You don't see the distinction? No?

PanchoVilla · 04-11-2010 02:39AM

K-9 wrote: »

2 men as against how many? 50/60 people?

You don't see the distinction? No?

Where exactly do you get 50-60 people? Last I heard it was 10-15.

Tigger · 04-11-2010 02:39AM

problem is the protest should have self policed the can throwing buinding invading agenda having fools

i predicted that thius would happen

the garda are trained to deal with things as they present
even if the majorty didn't throw cans etc some did and thats what the garda saw

weve seen it many times before

were they right to batton charge ? i donno but a crowd is judged by its worst not its best behaved

EvilMonkey · 04-11-2010 02:40AM

Des Carter wrote: »

In terms of the DoF sit-in, YES

What went on outside is a completely seperate issue.

Im talking about the students inside the building who caused no violence and were peaceful being dragged out by gardai while the two taximen who done the exact same thing werent touched and only left after they received an injunction.

Gardai ask student to leave students refuse, Gardai have every right to use force to remove them.

Taximen situation different method was used.

What's the problem?

K-9 · 04-11-2010 02:40AM

PanchoVilla wrote: »

I've already directly compared them so that pretty much answers your question. Perhaps you could explain how they are not directly comparable?

2 people aren't a mob.

If you can't see the distinction, which is so obvious, I don't think I can help you on that one.

Des Carter · 04-11-2010 02:41AM

K-9 wrote: »

2 men as against how many? 50/60 people?

You don't see the distinction? No?

If they are not being abusive/violent then NO

If you need an injunction to move 2 people out then you should need an injunction to move 50 people out.

PanchoVilla · 04-11-2010 02:43AM

K-9 wrote: »

2 people aren't a mob.

If you can't see the distinction, which is so obvious, I don't think I can help you on that one.

10-15 people sitting on the ground in the DoF is not a mob either. Care to try again?

Adriatic · 04-11-2010 02:43AM

I was coming from the march and got caught up in the riot and decided to stay to see what the fuss was about, I didn't even know what the building was nor did any students I asked for that matter, got some great photos though, I'll post them soon, got threatened with a baton too because I was on steps up from the street thinking it was OK, most of my photos have people grinning away like it's mad craic even though there's a riot squad and garda on horseback approaching them.

When I post my photos a lot of it will make sense, they were tossing people out of the building who got in there.

Augmerson · 04-11-2010 02:47AM

Adriatic wrote: »

most of my photos have people grinning away like it's mad craic even though there's a riot squad and garda on horseback approaching them.

When I post my photos a lot of it will make sense, they were tossing people out of the building who got in there.

Beware, some people may not want those photos up. I don't give a feck though, post them up and link!

Tigger · 04-11-2010 02:49AM

PanchoVilla wrote: »

10-15 people sitting on the ground in the DoF is not a mob either. Care to try again?

acually i think 3 or more is a public order offence thats why the taxi guys did 2 (its 12 )

here is he act
passed when i was 19 i rember shouting it down as evil at the time

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1994/en/act/pub/0002/index.html

it gives the garda free reign in these situations and is a carbopn copy of thatchers act of 1986

K-9 · 04-11-2010 02:52AM

PanchoVilla wrote: »

Where exactly do you get 50-60 people? Last I heard it was 10-15.

I read it on Breaking News.

Now, if you have video evidence it was 10-15, I'm open to seeing it. After all, there is plenty of video evidence today, surely somebody must have evidence of 10-15 people?

I'm sure YouTube have evidence of this conspiracy at this stage.

I'd say, in general, there does seem to be the usual, "what about my rights?" types on threads like this. When "what about your responsibilities?" are pointed out, they just indulge in whataboutery.

smellslikelemon · 04-11-2010 02:52AM

So annoyed about all the feckin people drinking at the march today.
If they wanted to do a "deadly sesh liek" they should have gone to a pub and stayed there for the day.
Made a mockery out of the people there that gave a damn.

I mean, one or two people swigging out of cans wasn't that bad, it was the idiot with the traffic cone on his head, taking swigs from a bottle of vodka and endangering the people around him (in a big crowd that is a danger just in case you think I'm being a prude about it).

K-9 · 04-11-2010 02:53AM

PanchoVilla wrote: »

10-15 people sitting on the ground in the DoF is not a mob either. Care to try again?

Right back at you. Evidence?

Des Carter · 04-11-2010 02:55AM

Tigger wrote: »

acually i think 3 or more is a public order offence thats why the taxi guys did 2

here is he act
passed when i was 19 i rember shouting it down as evil at the time

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1994/en/act/pub/0002/index.html

it gives the garda free reign in these situations and is a carbopn copy of thatchers act of 1986

Didnt bother opening the link but Ill take your word for it.

I guess theyll know better the next time and only send two in - and when those two are walking out after receiving their injunction 2 more should run in straight away and keep doing this.:pac:

jdooley28 · 04-11-2010 03:02AM

conno3001 wrote: »

I was at the protest today. Great stuff all around, didn't spot any trouble at all to be frank. I just stuck with the main crowd and did the usual march. Got in town at 11:30am with the SU crowd and left at 3:30pm when the main protest officially finished.

I was surprised to find anything about rioting or anything similar when I checked the news online at home though.

As far as the actual "minority" protest/rioting goes if people want to have a sit-down outside a public building on a public road fair enough, I wouldn't expect them to the batoned. To the above poster about the accusations of a video of the sit-down being shopped I say this: "lol". However doing it inside a building is taking the piss a bit and I would expect some degree of action if the crowd hasn't moved on. To the so called protesters stirring **** and throwing things and I'm sure there was a few even if it was 0.1% of the crowd, feck off somewhere else.

As far as drinking and drunk protesters goes, can't say I spotted any, however I did spot two people with cans drinking and they didn't seem very pissed. They did happen to be culchies also, which is irrelevant tbh but since it was discussed earlier I might as well mention that.

This has been my first proper protest and I can say I will be going to any future ones that will be planned in relation to the education budget and fee's.I also thought the national and ITT SU did a brilliant job imo.

Ah lad if its irrelevant why mention it? You had a good post going until then, comments like that make you sound like an idiot

K-9 · 04-11-2010 03:04AM

Tigger wrote: »

acually i think 3 or more is a public order offence thats why the taxi guys did 2

here is he act
passed when i was 19 i rember shouting it down as evil at the time

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1994/en/act/pub/0002/index.html

LOL!

So therein lies the distinction!

Tigger · 04-11-2010 03:08AM

so i read it through
its 12
12 is enough to be a riot not 3

K-9 · 04-11-2010 03:11AM

Tigger wrote: »

so i read it through
its 12
12 is enough to be a riot not 3

But there was only 10-15.

They better get counting then!

Resorting to technicalities!

_Whimsical_ · 04-11-2010 03:21AM

I am sick of student protests. The only cause they mobilize themselves on mass for is to solely protect their own personal immediate interests.

The truth is that if they cared about the state of education in Ireland or feared that the less financially able will be squeezed out of 3rd level system they'd be marching FOR a reintroduction of means tested fees. Fair means testing, where those whose parents are earning in excess of let's say €150,000 combined payed for their education, would put a huge amount of money back into the system and would help insure those who genuinely can't afford college now could do so. It would also help prevent the country lurching further down the economic toilet. Right now ordinary workers who can hardly afford a roof over their heads not to mention send their kids to college are paying tax so the richest people in Ireland can send their children to 3rd level. It just stinks.

The 2500 fee introduced means everyone shares the burden....whether they can shoulder it or not,if people are squeezed out because they can't pay it'll be just tough look. At the end of the day the government is not reintroducing full means tested fees only because they know they'd decimate their voting support in the middle or upper classes. Ultimately it's only to keep the greens and ff getting their ministerial salaries.

Tigger · 04-11-2010 03:27AM

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

I am sick of student protests. The only cause they mobilize themselves on mass for is to solely protect their own personal immediate interests.

The truth is that if they cared about the state of education in Ireland or feared that the less financially able will be squeezed out of 3rd level system they'd be marching FOR a reintroduction of means tested fees. Fair means testing, where those whose parents are earning in excess of let's say €150,000 combined payed for their education, would put a huge amount of money back into the system and would help insure those who genuinely can't afford college now could do so. It would also help prevent the country lurching further down the economic toilet. Right now ordinary workers who can hardly afford a roof over their heads not to mention send their kids to college are paying tax so the richest people in Ireland can send their children to 3rd level. It just stinks.

it dosen't have the same ring

whdda we want?; a fair system based on our parents abality and willingness to pay
whendawewant it?; at an agreed time after debate betwen the relevant bodies and all stakeholders

Students attack Leinster house with Mars Bars

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