Cross-party talks on budget dead in the water.

Duiske · 20-10-2010 10:14PM #1

The prospect of cross-party support on multi-billion euro spending cuts has been effectively killed off after talks between Taoiseach Brian Cowen and the opposition failed to reach consensus.

Labour and Fine Gael vowed to come up with their own budget plans after the two-hour meeting with Mr Cowen and Green Party leader John Gormley.

Both opposition parties said there would be no further meetings between the leaders.

Looks like the cross-party talks are already doomed. I really wish someone would come straight out and say what the hell is going on.
Not sure if there would have been any real advantage ( from a political pov) to the opposition parties going down the cross-party route anyway, but could this mean that the situation is even more dire than anyone thought, and they don't want to touch it ?

Brussels Sprout · 20-10-2010 10:21PM

I would have liked to have been a fly on the wall of that meeting. It'd be interesting to hear what they say to each other when there aren't any microphones around.

zootroid · 20-10-2010 10:28PM

I didn't hold out much hope for it to be honest. I think Cowen is too stubborn, and too "tribal" for want of a better word to be taking advice from other political parties. And I think FG and Labour are probably thinking "why the hell should we help you?"

But the main reason they failed is ideological differences between the three main parties.

Head The Wall · 20-10-2010 10:30PM

Duiske wrote: »

Cross-party cuts deal 'killed off'

Looks like the cross-party talks are already doomed. I really wish someone would come straight out and say what the hell is going on.
Not sure if there would have been any real advantage ( from a political pov) to the opposition parties going down the cross-party route anyway, but could this mean that the situation is even more dire than anyone thought, and they don't want to touch it ?

It's only postulating by the parties in Govt to show that they are trying to do whats the best for the country.

The reality is none of them wanted a part of it, but the country wanted them to want to do the dishes and they were like, why would I want to want to do the dishes

P. Breathnach · 20-10-2010 10:47PM

zootroid wrote: »

I didn't hold out much hope for it to be honest. I think Cowen is too stubborn, and too "tribal" for want of a better word to be taking advice from other political parties. And I think FG and Labour are probably thinking "why the hell should we help you?"

But the main reason they failed is ideological differences between the three main parties.

I agree with your comment about Brian Cowen: many people seem to have forgotten how deeply tribal he is.

But if FG and Labour were thinking as you suggest, I would think less of their leaders. They should be thinking of helping us, and not about whether Cowen should be helped or not. I think that some sort of consensus is needed -- not full agreement on everything that might be in the budget, but some agreement on its general shape. That's what we need to have in place so we can fund our borrowing requirement at a reasonable (or less unreasonable) price.

I don't think there are profound ideological differences between the parties. I think the reason no worthwhile progress was made is that the party leaders are giving more weight to electoral advantage than they are giving to addressing our needs. The opposition leaders probably feel that working towards any cross-party consensus might cost them votes -- and they might be right.

Permabear · 20-10-2010 10:55PM

This post has been deleted.

Head The Wall · 20-10-2010 11:02PM

They probably don't trust FF and I wouldn't blame them.

Byron85 · 20-10-2010 11:21PM

zootroid wrote: »

But the main reason they failed is ideological differences between the three main parties.

The Peoples Front of Judea syndrome I think you refer to.

zootroid · 20-10-2010 11:31PM

P. Breathnach wrote: »

I agree with your comment about Brian Cowen: many people seem to have forgotten how deeply tribal he is.

But if FG and Labour were thinking as you suggest, I would think less of their leaders. They should be thinking of helping us, and not about whether Cowen should be helped or not. I think that some sort of consensus is needed -- not full agreement on everything that might be in the budget, but some agreement on its general shape. That's what we need to have in place so we can fund our borrowing requirement at a reasonable (or less unreasonable) price.

I don't think there are profound ideological differences between the parties. I think the reason no worthwhile progress was made is that the party leaders are giving more weight to electoral advantage than they are giving to addressing our needs. The opposition leaders probably feel that working towards any cross-party consensus might cost them votes -- and they might be right.

Agree with you there.

On my point about ideological differences, I think FG would be the most aggressive in dealing with the deficit, and Labour the least, with FF in the middle. I think Labour would mainly go for tax increases, while FF would look for the soft targets such as cutting capital expenditure which would keep the unions placated. FG would cut wages, pensions and numbers employed across the public sector.

20-10-2010 11:39PM

Duiske wrote: »

could this mean that the situation is even more dire than anyone thought, and they don't want to touch it ?

That along with what others have said, Cowen is too stubborn, he's a man you cannot deal with at all, it's either his way or no way. God help us all with this coming budget, I seen enough today on the news when members of the UK parliament were making fun of Brian Lenihan and his mess with budgets.

irishh_bob · 21-10-2010 09:34AM

zootroid wrote: »

I didn't hold out much hope for it to be honest. I think Cowen is too stubborn, and too "tribal" for want of a better word to be taking advice from other political parties. And I think FG and Labour are probably thinking "why the hell should we help you?"

But the main reason they failed is ideological differences between the three main parties.

agree with your 1st paragraph , disagree with your second , we dont do idealogy in this country and i include labour who are to public servants what fianna fail are to everyone ( when they can afford it )

irishh_bob · 21-10-2010 09:37AM

hellboy99 wrote: »

That along with what others have said, Cowen is too stubborn, he's a man you cannot deal with at all, it's either his way or no way. God help us all with this coming budget, I seen enough today on the news when members of the UK parliament were making fun of Brian Lenihan and his mess with budgets.

thiers nothing worse than arrogance and stuborness from a weak and talentless person , i can handle the likes of michael o leary being arrogant but not cowen

Cross-party talks on budget dead in the water.

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