All Primary / Secondary Masters Courses - Post Q's Here Please

readystudypass · 21-09-2010 10:11AM

VonLuck wrote: »

A friend of mine mentioned that there was a part time course you could do while teaching (possibly substitute teaching? I'm not sure). Is there any truth to that?

Yes. Dublin City University do a 2 year part-time Graduate Diploma in Education.

dory · 21-09-2010 11:46AM

VonLuck wrote: »

I have an honours degree in engineering from DIT which I believe allows me to do a H.Dip in Mathematics, Physics and Computer Science.

I am not very familiar with the whole process but do I have to do a full time year long H.Dip course to become qualified to teach? A friend of mine mentioned that there was a part time course you could do while teaching (possibly substitute teaching? I'm not sure). Is there any truth to that?

Also, is it possible for me to teach Technical Drawing? From my course I believe I have much more experience in drawing than I do in all the aspects of physics but it isn't listed... Is there any way around this or was it necessary for me to have done a 3 year course in something else?

Thanks.

You have to chose two subjects. So maths and Physics. No one cares if you're qualified for computers or not. No in my school was ever qualified.

The Part-Time is mostly for people who have been teaching in a school for a few years and would now like to be qualified without quitting their job. You can't really just decide to do it as you'd have no guarantee that come September you'd have a job. In fact, it'd be highly unlikely someone would hire you if you're unqualified and there's a surplus of unemployed qualified teachers.

JohnMearsheimer · 21-09-2010 07:24PM

readystudypass wrote: »

I'm vaguely familiar with the H.Dip in History in UCC and I believe the modules are taken from the 2nd and 3rd year of the undergraduate degree. Because you already have a degree that requirement is satisfied for the Teaching Council. The next requirement is have you covered the required number of credits in an undergraduate degree as outlined by the Teaching Council. Obviously, yes you would, if you choose the appropriate modules related to the Leaving Cert syllabus. In the vast majority of cases only an undergraduate degree will be recognised. However there is precedent for a Higher Diploma being recognised (The H.Dip in Theology in NUI Maynooth allows qualified teachers of other subjects to teach religion).

It would be foolish to do the H.Dip in History in the hope that the Teaching Council will listen to the case outlined above, and it is unlikely they will give you a definite answer before you present the completed qualification. However I believe where a higher diploma consists of undergraduate modules, the case is strong. I'm not that familiar with the modules offered but I believe if you chose 12th century history, then that module could not be counted because it does not cover the period examinable under the Leaving Certificate. The emphasis on undergraduate modules is emphasised by the fact that if you in your situation were to manage to get into a Masters in History it would be completely useless to you in terms of being recognised by the Teaching Council as a qualification to teach history.

As an alternative, would you consider the BA at www.oscail.ie . It is fully recognised by the Teaching Council to teach history (and english if you choose the literature modules). Degree holders also get some exemptions. It's distance learning with occasional face2face tutorials.

That's all I have to offer I'm afraid.

Thanks Ready, you've given me a bit to think about. I emailed the Teaching Council to ask them about the H Dip in History and mentioned that they recognise the H Dip in Theology for the purpose of teaching religion (albeit for qualified teachers). I hope they'll at least consider it if I take the correct modules. Cheers for the heads up about DCU. I spent 6 years in college and I'm not keen to go back and start again but never say never

. We really need a leaving cert politics subject in ths country!

readystudypass · 21-09-2010 08:21PM

JohnMearsheimer wrote: »

Cheers for the heads up about DCU. I spent 6 years in college and I'm not keen to go back and start again but never say never . We really need a leaving cert politics subject in ths country!

I have heard of degree holders talking about taking just the history modules (4 out of 6) with Oscail in order to satisfy Teaching Council requirements. I don't know if they were just hoping it would work out for them but it seems to satisfy the eligibility requirements. Again, never attempt to prejudge the TC.

Politics was supposed to be introduced for Leaving Cert in the coming years but has probably been put on the back burner now due to financial constraints.

JohnMearsheimer · 21-09-2010 10:42PM

readystudypass wrote: »

I have heard of degree holders talking about taking just the history modules (4 out of 6) with Oscail in order to satisfy Teaching Council requirements. I don't know if they were just hoping it would work out for them but it seems to satisfy the eligibility requirements. Again, never attempt to prejudge the TC.

Politics was supposed to be introduced for Leaving Cert in the coming years but has probably been put on the back burner now due to financial constraints.

Thanks again Ready. Do you mean they just took 4 history modules at 15 credits each (60 in total) in the 1st year of the BA and left it at that or took 4 history modules each year for 3 years (180 credits) for the full BA award? I presume the latter.

My background is politics and international relations so I would really like to teach history and is ties in quite well with what I studied. I did a lot of Cold War history during my masters and covered European unity during my degree. I know these are on history syllabus (I know they represent only a small part of the history course). I wonder if the Teaching Council would recognise any of that if I went down the history road.... I suppose I can ask them. It's a shame politics has been put on the back burner given its impact on our day to day lives. I remember my CSPE teacher in school was not qualified to teach the subject but that was back in 1999. Are CSPE teachers these days generally politics/sociology grads?

readystudypass · 21-09-2010 11:45PM

JohnMearsheimer wrote: »

Do you mean they just took 4 history modules at 15 credits each (60 in total) in the 1st year of the BA and left it at that or took 4 history modules each year for 3 years (180 credits) for the full BA award? I presume the latter.

Not the latter. There are only 6 modules (90 credits) of history available with Oscail anyway.

I mean they were thinking about taking just 4 modules at 15 credits each and leaving it at that. The Teaching Council requires that history (mainly Irish and European) covers a minimum of 30% of the degree over a minimum of 3 years.

30% of 180 credits is 54 so it seems you are covered there with 60 0scail credits.

The 'over a minimum of 3 years' requirement could be taken to mean that some modules must be taken in the 3rd (or 4th for some degrees) year of the degree. This requirement would seem to be met by the fact that in Oscail Level 1 courses are prerequisites for higher level modules. So if you were to pursue this, to be honest, risky strategy, you could only do HIS 1 in your first year. Then you would do for example 2 more modules the following year, totalling 30 credits. In the 3rd year you would do a 15 credit module.

Alternatively you could do HIS 1 in year 1 for 15 credits and 45 credits in year 2 providing you were able to cover the relevant material as Oscail alternate some modules every second year. The TC may say you did nothing in year 3 but you could argue you did the module that others have done in year 3.

Oscail used to allow students wishing to beef up their degrees for the Teaching Council register for individual modules without registering for the entire BA. I presume they still allow this.

I wouldn't get too excited about the chances of the above working out smoothly for you but it's an avenue to be explored. I don't know the outcome of the people I heard about interpreting the Teaching Council regulations as I have outlined.

readystudypass · 21-09-2010 11:57PM

JohnMearsheimer wrote: »

I did a lot of Cold War history during my masters and covered European unity during my degree. I know these are on history syllabus (I know they represent only a small part of the history course). I wonder if the Teaching Council would recognise any of that if I went down the history road

I think they should recognise every 5 credits of history gained in an undergraduate degree or module studied independently that is part of an undergraduate degree in History. So undergraduate European Unity - Yes.

I would hold out little hope of anything you studied in your masters being recognised. Seems bizarre but there you go.

readystudypass · 22-09-2010 12:03AM

JohnMearsheimer wrote: »

I remember my CSPE teacher in school was not qualified to teach the subject but that was back in 1999. Are CSPE teachers these days generally politics/sociology grads?

Ten years on I have heard of teachers qualified in other subjects e.g French, Maths being given CSPE.

22-09-2010 12:44PM

Hopefully this is the right thread ..I was wondering if any of you guys could please help me with this - Say you've been accepted onto a PGDE course and can't find a school to undertake the teaching placement, what happens then? do you lose your place on the course? thanks for your help

implausible · 22-09-2010 01:09PM

68508224 wrote: »

Say you've been accepted onto a PGDE course and can't find a school to undertake the teaching placement, what happens then? do you lose your place on the course?

Well, you can't complete the PGDE or get qualified without teaching practice, so it would be pointless doing it. I don't know about losing your place, I'm sure they'd give you time to find one. It shouldn't be that difficult to get a school - it's a free teacher after all. The only problem I can imagine is that there might be a school that has a few PGDE students already, if so, you may have to go a bit further afield.

peanuthead · 24-09-2010 09:31PM

68508224 wrote: »

Hopefully this is the right thread ..I was wondering if any of you guys could please help me with this - Say you've been accepted onto a PGDE course and can't find a school to undertake the teaching placement, what happens then? do you lose your place on the course? thanks for your help

Lecturers on the PGDE courses have lots of connections in lots of schools nationwide so you won't be stuck for TP. Always best to source it for yourself though.

addda · 26-09-2010 04:43PM

I was just looking at the business degrees that are under points quota and Commerce in UCD isn't listed. Does anyone know if that means it's not under quota or is it a mistake?

delta_bravo · 26-09-2010 05:21PM

Just a query here with all the jobs shortages etc. If you do the H.Dip equivalent in the UK to teach in Ireland you need to do the History of Irish Education exam and probably a load of paperwork and hassle from the TC; what is the process for the reverse? If you have a PGDE from Ireland and want to teach in the UK?

ALH-06 · 30-09-2010 08:02AM

Hi all,

I'm thinking of undertaking the PGDE starting next September, to qualify as a second-level teacher. My subject would be history.

I've done a bit of reading into the different university options in Ireland, but would really like to hear your opinions / about your experiences as well. So whichever course you have done, or are thinking of doing in the future, any comparative information on the different courses available would be great.

Here's what I've ascertained so far: (open to correction, of course)

UCD:
Quite a gruelling and demanding course that stipulates each day be shared between school (teaching practice) and university commitments. Everyone I've talked to about it bemoans the large workload and stress involved!

I studied in UCD for 4 years and loved it, but I think that for personal reasons and also the above factor, it's time for me to look somewhere else...

Trinity:
My preference at this stage, as I'm from Dublin and am not too keen on the UCD option as it stands. I understand that PGDE students spend separate days at university and school, which I would deem preferable. The course is supposed to be a lot less demanding than it's UCD counterpart, in terms of overall workload.

But would also seem that Trinity is the most subscribed-to course in the country. Together with the interview-based assessment, I'm presuming this makes it very difficult get offered a place?

Maynooth NUI
Operates a separate university day / teaching day timetable, like Trinity. Other than that, I've got no info on how the course is supposed to compare to others, or even the stipulations regarding school candidature. Must PGDE students teach at a local school, in or around the Maynooth vicinity? How would the course / workload compare?

Galway NUI
Unique from aforementioned courses in that the teaching practice comes in the form of 2 singular blocks during the year, together numbering 13 weeks. This time is spent exclusively in the school, while the rest of the academic year is spent in university. Seems like a good alternative to have, though I would still probably prefer the split week timetable of Trinity and Maynooth.

Other than that, no info about this course. I like Galway and wouldn't mind living there at all, but it'd be a more costly option than Dublin probably. Any feedback on the course, anyone?

UCC / UL:
Haven't looked into these courses yet!

So, any opinions / details / impressions / experiences would be really helpful, to every prospective HDipper.

Thanks everyone...

Lord TSC · 30-09-2010 08:49AM

Maynooth NUI
Operates a separate university day / teaching day timetable, like Trinity. Other than that, I've got no info on how the course is supposed to compare to others, or even the stipulations regarding school candidature. Must PGDE students teach at a local school, in or around the Maynooth vicinity? How would the course / workload compare?

There's a radius you've got to be inside, but it's pretty broad. I did mine in Balbriggan and I know people who did their placement in Drogheda, which is just over an hour away by car.

As far as the workload, I'm not sure how they compare. NUIM doesn't have exams at Xmas and I think the others do. To counter that though, NUIM has a block teaching period in Jan. where you spend 3 weeks in a school fulltime.

In terms of days in school (just for general info), last year it was...
NUIM: Monday and Friday in school.
Trinity: Monday morning, Thursday morning & all day Friday.
UCD: Every morning, with lectures in the afternoon.

After that, I'd say check out the Q&A topic thats stickied up the top of the board

Toto Wolfcastle · 30-09-2010 04:28PM

Thread merged with PGDE thread.

Gaeilgeoir · 30-09-2010 11:00PM

I intend to apply to do the PGDE next year & would appreciate some advice on my second subject. I have a BA in Irish and Irish Folklore, a Postgraduate Diploma in Accounting and a MA in Irish.

I suppose business would probably be my most likely second subject. As it's the minor subject could I choose to do History or CSPE (I studied politics for 1 year of my BA)?

delta_bravo · 01-10-2010 07:27AM

From your information there Gaeilgeoir you are probably only able to teach Irish. To teach a subject it must have taken up 30% of your credits in an undergraduate degree so that would exclude any first year subjects

Gaeilgeoir · 01-10-2010 11:17AM

It's my understanding that you can teach any subject up to Junior Cert level without having a degree in that subject. In order to apply to the PGDE I will have to name a second subject, are you saying I can't apply at all? I would have thought the Postgrad Diploma would count for something, as it's actually a highel level of qualification than a degree.

delta_bravo · 01-10-2010 10:04PM

Gaeilgeoir wrote: »

It's my understanding that you can teach any subject up to Junior Cert level without having a degree in that subject.

Anyone can teach any subject with the new Education Bill. There is no such thing as being qualified to teach something to Junior Cert level (bar Science->Phys/Chem/Biol and Business->Econ/Acc/Bus). You are either qualified to teach something or you are not

Gaeilgeoir wrote: »

In order to apply to the PGDE I will have to name a second subject, are you saying I can't apply at all? I would have thought the Postgrad Diploma would count for something, as it's actually a highel level of qualification than a degree.

You will need to ask individual universities how to manage with just 1 subject. You could perhaps do ICT. Definitely inquire with the Teaching Council what you are registered to teach and contact the colleges if/when you get a place on the course.

I doubt your postgrad diploma entitles you to teach. Look carefully at the PAC site here for specific subject recognition

ACCOUNTING

Applicants must provide officially certified evidence of satisfactory achievement in primary degree studies (or equivalent) as outlined hereunder:

* The study of Accounting as a major subject in the degree extending over the last three years and of the order of 30% at a minimum of that period.
* Details of the degree course content to show that the knowledge, skills and understanding required to teach Accounting to the highest level in post-primary education have been acquired.
* Details of degree course content where studies were modular or in a related subject area require specific assessment to determine equivalence.
* Degree studies in Accounting must have been supported by relevant Information and Communications Technology (ICT) methodology and practice.
* Explicit evidence of satisfactory achievement in the Accounting courses with at least an overall Pass result in the examinations of Accounting.

Recognition to teach Accounting at the highest level in post-primary education also confers recognition to teach Business Studies at Junior Certificate level.

Additional information (i) where greater clarity is requested or (ii) which would otherwise more fully support the application must be provided as required.

Gaeilgeoir · 01-10-2010 10:46PM

I checked it out today & it looks like I'll be ok to do the PGDE in Trinity. Had planned on going to UCD but they insist you have two subjects. So will have to take my chances with the harder application process in Trinity!

awny · 02-10-2010 11:56AM

Gaeilgeoir wrote: »

I checked it out today & it looks like I'll be ok to do the PGDE in Trinity. Had planned on going to UCD but they insist you have two subjects. So will have to take my chances with the harder application process in Trinity!

Gaeilgeoir you should still be able to apply for UCD. My degree allows me to teach Maths and Applied Maths. I rang UCD about it last year and they said they dont do Applied Maths as a second subject. So they asked me what I covered in my first year of college, I said accounting and computer programming. So the course director told me to put either ICT or accounting for my second subject. You could give them a buzz to confirm it, but youll prob be able to do one of your first year subjects as your second subject for UCD!

Random_Fate · 06-10-2010 02:35PM

Quick question everyone

I found this course - a Higher Diploma in Mathematical Studies. Link here.

I was wondering if anyone had done this course and applied to the Teaching Council to see if it qualified you to teach Maths?

My current ''teachable'' subjects would be quite poor and if this course was approved, it would make becoming a teacher a more viable prospect.

raver85 · 06-10-2010 11:23PM

Hi

Ok I have a degree in Tourism Management and really want to get into teaching tourism at a plc level. I have looked at the teachers council website and cant find out how to apply or even where to apply other than going through the pdge route but I cant see tourism as a subject on it.

If anyone could give me some pointers I would really appreciate it.

Thank you

readystudypass · 07-10-2010 12:17AM

raver85 wrote: »

Hi

Ok I have a degree in Tourism Management and really want to get into teaching tourism at a plc level. I have looked at the teachers council website and cant find out how to apply or even where to apply other than going through the pdge route but I cant see tourism as a subject on it.

If anyone could give me some pointers I would really appreciate it.

Thank you

The secondary PGDE only covers subjects up to the leaving cert. PLC subjects would not be covered.

ALH-06 · 10-10-2010 10:22AM

Can anyone tell me what the current fee is for the PGDE? And how one might qualify for a Higher Education grant?

Are you still assessed on your parent's salary if you're over 25?

sunflower3 · 10-10-2010 08:49PM

Hi

Can anyone tell me what the current fee is for the PGDE? And how one might qualify for a Higher Education grant?

Are you still assessed on your parent's salary if you're over 25?

Fee for NUIM this year is around €6,500.

For information on grants etc., go to www.studentfinance.ie. Its a great website

ALH-06 · 11-10-2010 03:56AM

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

There's a radius you've got to be inside, but it's pretty broad. I did mine in Balbriggan and I know people who did their placement in Drogheda, which is just over an hour away by car.

As far as the workload, I'm not sure how they compare. NUIM doesn't have exams at Xmas and I think the others do. To counter that though, NUIM has a block teaching period in Jan. where you spend 3 weeks in a school fulltime.

In terms of days in school (just for general info), last year it was...
NUIM: Monday and Friday in school.
Trinity: Monday morning, Thursday morning & all day Friday.
UCD: Every morning, with lectures in the afternoon.

Thanks for the info. What's the actual course itself like in Maynooth? Any idea how the workload would compare to other HDip courses?

And a general question relating to all HDip courses - At what stage in the application process do you need to acquire / confirm a school for teaching practice?

Lord TSC · 15-10-2010 01:06PM

ALH-06 wrote: »

Thanks for the info. What's the actual course itself like in Maynooth? Any idea how the workload would compare to other HDip courses?

And a general question relating to all HDip courses - At what stage in the application process do you need to acquire / confirm a school for teaching practice?

You don't go looking for a placement until you've been accepted onto the course. Or...well, I suppose you could go looking earlier but you don't have to and I'd imagine no school would make a full commitment until they were sure you got it.

As for the workload, I'm not 100% sure. On the one hand, the Maynooth one doesn't have exams at Xmas and only have 3 in the summer, as compared to the other courses which have exams at both times iirc. On the other, Maynooth have the three week block teaching period in Jan. which requires a fair bit of work in terms of lesson plans. Likewise all the courses have various essays and assignments.

As for what the course is like....I won't be too negative. There are bits of the Maynooth PGDE I found to be stupid, illogical and a waste of time (Oh hai DiViAte), and I wasn't alone in that view, but there were others who didn't share the same concerns. It seems to depend what tutors and that you get.

PsychoSue · 18-10-2010 10:56PM

Gaeilgeoir wrote: »

It's my understanding that you can teach any subject up to Junior Cert level without having a degree in that subject. In order to apply to the PGDE I will have to name a second subject, are you saying I can't apply at all? I would have thought the Postgrad Diploma would count for something, as it's actually a highel level of qualification than a degree.

I studied Bio, Chem, Maths Phys and Maths in 1st year!!
Bio, chem and maths in 2nd yr
Bio and Chem in 3rd
Bio in 4th

I did my PGDE In UCD 2 years ago, My 2 subjects were science and maths! UCD knew I did maths for 2 years of my degree n they let me do it, so Im assuming its ok! I was told I didnt have to do it, that I could have just done the science pedegogy (because this covers science and Bio/Chem for me, so they would have been my 2 subjects, so maybe this makes a difference). Simply I choice to do it in a bid to increase my employability. When I said this I was told I could have done ICT (I have the ECDL and lots of other experience) A post grad in accounting and u cant teach maths???? Defo ask the college about it also ask about doing ICT!!

If you did it for ur degree u can apply to do it in the PGDE, having covered the subject for 30% of ur degree only comes into it for registration with the TC.
If ur only registered with the TC for 1 subject it doesnt matter because once ur in a school u can be asked to teach ANYTHING. I only have spanish for my LC and was teaching LCA spanish for the last 3 months of the school term last year.

Im not registered with the teaching council to teach maths. But I AM teaching it now to 5th yrs. In the science pedegogy I did the Biology assignment, I didnt do the Chemistry assignment because I was doing the maths assignment YET Im registered with the TC to teach Chemistry aswell as Biology!! Id be teaching chem but the school doesn't offer it, atm:) anyway!!!

raver85 wrote: »

Hi

Ok I have a degree in Tourism Management and really want to get into teaching tourism at a plc level. I have looked at the teachers council website and cant find out how to apply or even where to apply other than going through the pdge route but I cant see tourism as a subject on it.

If anyone could give me some pointers I would really appreciate it.

Thank you

Ur best bet would be to check out the fetac and itec websites. I have a science degree and Im qualified to teach anatomy and Physiology to adult beauty students.

ALH-06 wrote: »

Can anyone tell me what the current fee is for the PGDE? And how one might qualify for a Higher Education grant?

Are you still assessed on your parent's salary if you're over 25?

I paid €6500 2 years ago I was 25, living with my partner, paying a mortgage, bills etc, my partners weekly wage after tax was €500 and I DIDNT qualifiy for ANYTHING!!

Mature candidate = any1 over 23.

Mature dependant candidate = candidates who lived with their parents from Oct 1st the year BEFORE entering the course and WILL be assessed on their own + their parents income of the PREVIOUS tax year....

Mature independant candidate = are candidates over 23 who live separately from their parents from October 1 of the year preceding the year of entry to the course. They are assessed on their own income.

All Primary / Secondary Masters Courses - Post Q's Here Please

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