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Will the leaving cert be enough to join?

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Comments

  • #32
    00MARTZ00
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 195 ✭✭00MARTZ00


    im in a similar situation left school after the junior cert got a trade which is level 6 i think! would b great if thats enough.


  • #33
    Marshall987
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 100 ✭✭Marshall987


    yes according to the AGS website level 5 is enough.

    I wonder would i be better off doing a level 5 course instead of going back doing a full two years leaving cert.


  • #34
    echo.lima
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 66 ✭✭echo.lima


    Marshall987 wrote: »
    yes according to the AGS website level 5 is enough.

    I wonder would i be better off doing a level 5 course instead of going back doing a full two years leaving cert.


    You`d be better off doing a level 5 it`d be alot less of a pain in the ass :cool:


  • #35
    Marshall987
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 100 ✭✭Marshall987


    echo.lima wrote: »
    You`d be better off doing a level 5 it`d be alot less of a pain in the ass :cool:


    Do you think it would be harder to get in though with a level 5 i was looking at this course http://www.lcfe.ie/courses.php?cID=295 its emergency care personal.

    And its half the time of the leaving cert.


  • #36
    genericguy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,831 ✭✭✭genericguy


    i'm planning to apply during the next recruitment drive. i'm in the middle of a Ph.D. in genetics, which I doubt will come in handy on the street. however, I have to say I'm astonished by the number of people who are saying the leaving cert is irrelevant - i mean jesus christ, just because calculus won't help you disarm and arrest a robber doesn't make it pointless. I personally wouldn't like to think that the people on the streets responsible for my well-being and safety hadn't been bothered/able to pass the leaving cert.

    the LC is not by any stretch of the imagination a high standard of education, and while i'd be the first to admit that someone with less education and better interpersonal skills than myself should be chosen by AGS, to say that a basic qualification in reading and writing is unnecessary is fcuking ludicrous in my opinion.


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  • #37
    echo.lima
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 66 ✭✭echo.lima


    Marshall987 wrote: »
    Do you think it would be harder to get in though with a level 5 i was looking at this course http://www.lcfe.ie/courses.php?cID=295 its emergency care personal.

    And its half the time of the leaving cert.

    I doubt it`d be harder to get in with a level 5 and I dont think your choice of course would make a difference either. People of all sorts of backgrounds join the Garda.


  • #38
    Shield
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 9,819 CMod ✭✭✭✭Shield


    Good post.

    I'll also chip in my 0.02c and say that the Leaving Cert standard of education isn't just about the actual subjects and grades themselves per se, it's about learning how to learn as well.

    Anyone who has done LC Maths at ordinary level with be familiar with the bell curve.

    The bell curve in this case is the number of people who sat the test (from bottom to top) and the grades measured in points (from left to right).

    I don't think it's unreasonable for any employer to want people to the right half of the bell curve.

    AGS as an employer are willing to accept people to the left of the bell curve down to a certain level.

    No employer wants people who got all Es and Fs, and I feel (personal opinion, not as a mod) the educational requirements are easy to obtain. 5 D3s at ordinary level is all that's needed, and unless you have a diagnosed learning disability, there is no reason you should not be able to at least attain those grades in ordinary level LC.

    If you can't get the minimum LC grades to get into AGS (bear in mind I'm talking about this century), then it tells a story of what you were like as a 5th and 6th year student, and it tells a story of the amount of study you clearly didn't put in.

    I don't mean to offend anyone, but if you think about the LC as a Review of you as a person having finished your secondary schooling, wouldn't you want that Review to be as positive and glowing as possible? Yes? Then work for it like we all did. We might not have enjoyed it, but we still did it, and so should you if you want a career in AGS.
    genericguy wrote: »
    i'm planning to apply during the next recruitment drive. i'm in the middle of a Ph.D. in genetics, which I doubt will come in handy on the street. however, I have to say I'm astonished by the number of people who are saying the leaving cert is irrelevant - i mean jesus christ, just because calculus won't help you disarm and arrest a robber doesn't make it pointless. I personally wouldn't like to think that the people on the streets responsible for my well-being and safety hadn't been bothered/able to pass the leaving cert.

    the LC is not by any stretch of the imagination a high standard of education, and while i'd be the first to admit that someone with less education and better interpersonal skills than myself should be chosen by AGS, to say that a basic qualification in reading and writing is unnecessary is fcuking ludicrous in my opinion.


  • #39
    spudz21
    Closed Accounts Posts: 216 ✭✭spudz21


    Marshall987 wrote: »
    yes according to the AGS website level 5 is enough.

    I wonder would i be better off doing a level 5 course instead of going back doing a full two years leaving cert.

    Where does it say on the Garda website that level 5 is enough?:confused:

    The educational requirements are clearly set out as below:

    What are the educational requirements?

    Candidates must have obtained in the Leaving Certificate:
    • A grade not lower than B3 at Foundation Level or D3 at another level in Mathematics, and
    • A qualifying grade in 2 languages, 1 of which must be English or Irish, as follows:
      English: a grade not lower that D3 at Ordinary Level
      Irish: a grade not lower than C3 at Foundation Level or D3 at another level
      Other language: a grade not lower than D3 at Ordinary Level, and
    • A grade not lower than D3 at Ordinary Level, in not less than 2 other subjects
    Or
    The Merit Grade in the Applied Leaving Certificate
    Or
    Like Grades in another examination, which, in the opinion of the Minister for Justice, Equality & Law Reform, is not of a lower standard than the above.


  • #40
    Marshall987
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 100 ✭✭Marshall987


    spudz21 wrote: »
    Where does it say on the Garda website that level 5 is enough?:confused:

    The educational requirements are clearly set out as below:

    What are the educational requirements?


    Candidates must have obtained in the Leaving Certificate:
    • A grade not lower than B3 at Foundation Level or D3 at another level in Mathematics, and
    • A qualifying grade in 2 languages, 1 of which must be English or Irish, as follows:
      English: a grade not lower that D3 at Ordinary Level
      Irish: a grade not lower than C3 at Foundation Level or D3 at another level
      Other language: a grade not lower than D3 at Ordinary Level, and
    • A grade not lower than D3 at Ordinary Level, in not less than 2 other subjects
    Or
    The Merit Grade in the Applied Leaving Certificate
    Or
    Like Grades in another examination, which, in the opinion of the Minister for Justice, Equality & Law Reform, is not of a lower standard than the above.


    According to the www.nqai.ie The leaving cert is level 4-5 of the framework, The same as a level 5 fetac course.


  • #41
    spudz21
    Closed Accounts Posts: 216 ✭✭spudz21


    Marshall987 wrote: »
    According to the www.nqai.ie The leaving cert is level 4-5 of the framework, The same as a level 5 fetac course.

    I've never heard of a fetac being accepted in place of the leaving cert though.....:confused:

    You would probably need to check with Garda HQ, but my understanding is you have to have the leaving


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  • #42
    WalterMitty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,582 ✭✭✭WalterMitty


    i missed irish in the leaving cert due to illness and it was my only ordinary level subject so i didnt bother doing it next year. I have an accountancy degree and am part qualified accountant. I wasnt able to apply last time as had no Irish language yet i see chinese gardai on streets now:confused:

    Anyway will i be able to get in with just a degree and no irish or foreign language in leaving cert?


  • #43
    Shield
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 9,819 CMod ✭✭✭✭Shield


    You see Chinese Gardai on the streets because they speak English and another language.

    Read this post for further information.


  • #44
    Marshall987
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 100 ✭✭Marshall987


    Too get a final answer in all this i emailed the appointments offfice in dublin.

    Asking what other qualifications would do instead of having a leaving cert.

    This is what i was told.Not surprised i must say.


    Grades which are equivalent to those outlined at a., b. and c. above in at least five subjects (including mathematics and two languages at least one of which must be either Irish or English) in another examination or assessment of a kind that is, in the opinion of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, not of a lower standard than the above. A combination of two or more examinations or assessments is permitted.

    The following are among the qualifications which are considered as acceptable alternatives to the Leaving Certificate Examination:

    Matriculation of a recognised university;
    A General Certificate of Education (Advanced Level);
    NCEA / HETAC National Certificate;
    NCEA / HETAC National Diploma

    Applicants wishing to present alternative qualifications should note that the alternative qualification must still contain grades in Mathematics and two languages, one of which must be Irish or English.

    Applicants holding international or other qualifications are advised to contact the National Qualifications Authority of Ireland to ascertain if the qualification(s) they hold can be recognised as being broadly comparable to one of the above qualifications.


  • #45
    spudz21
    Closed Accounts Posts: 216 ✭✭spudz21


    Marshall987 wrote: »
    Too get a final answer in all this i emailed the appointments offfice in dublin.

    Asking what other qualifications would do instead of having a leaving cert.

    This is what i was told.Not surprised i must say.


    Grades which are equivalent to those outlined at a., b. and c. above in at least five subjects (including mathematics and two languages at least one of which must be either Irish or English) in another examination or assessment of a kind that is, in the opinion of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, not of a lower standard than the above. A combination of two or more examinations or assessments is permitted.

    The following are among the qualifications which are considered as acceptable alternatives to the Leaving Certificate Examination:

    Matriculation of a recognised university;
    A General Certificate of Education (Advanced Level);
    NCEA / HETAC National Certificate;
    NCEA / HETAC National Diploma

    Applicants wishing to present alternative qualifications should note that the alternative qualification must still contain grades in Mathematics and two languages, one of which must be Irish or English.

    Applicants holding international or other qualifications are advised to contact the National Qualifications Authority of Ireland to ascertain if the qualification(s) they hold can be recognised as being broadly comparable to one of the above qualifications.

    Well I learnt something new there, but I suppose you still need the subjects.
    It's good ya got a definite answer!
    Best of luck with it:D


  • #46
    pretentiouslad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 109 ✭✭pretentiouslad


    I'm sure that this post will rub a few people up the wrong way...

    But, regarding Garda recruitment, hypothetically speaking, surely if there are 300 people applying for 100 places then obviously not everyone will get in... and let's say that 50 people out of the 300 have a 3rd level degree, and 50 people barely scraped 140 points in the leaving cert, then which 50 are almost a certainty to be given the nod?

    I'm not saying that leaving cert results are a reflection of intelligence, but if someone gets 500 points and another person gets 200 points the first person has clearly worked harder than the latter and i'm sure that AGS would opt for a harder working candidate at the end of the day...

    of course there are exceptions to this, but I'm speaking in general terms...

    and i don't think it's stupid for AGS to expect candidates to have a basic education under their belt... what these posters have been focusing on is mainly how education won't help you apprehend someone, but that's only one aspect of the job!


  • #47
    da__flash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 430 ✭✭da__flash


    pretentiouslad wrote: »
    I'm sure that this post will rub a few people up the wrong way...

    But, regarding Garda recruitment, hypothetically speaking, surely if there are 300 people applying for 100 places then obviously not everyone will get in... and let's say that 50 people out of the 300 have a 3rd level degree, and 50 people barely scraped 140 points in the leaving cert, then which 50 are almost a certainty to be given the nod?

    I'm not saying that leaving cert results are a reflection of intelligence, but if someone gets 500 points and another person gets 200 points the first person has clearly worked harder than the latter and i'm sure that AGS would opt for a harder working candidate at the end of the day...

    of course there are exceptions to this, but I'm speaking in general terms...

    and i don't think it's stupid for AGS to expect candidates to have a basic education under their belt... what these posters have been focusing on is mainly how education won't help you apprehend someone, but that's only one aspect of the job!

    well yes in certain situations this maybe true but the job may not be suited to the person who got 500 points where as the person who got the 200 points could make the best member of AGS, this is what the interview is to determine everyone is different at the end of the day ;):cool:


  • #48
    Scan Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 101 ✭✭Scan Man


    I'm currently sitting the Leaving Cert, and should meet the grade no problem as I'm flat out at Higher Level subjects, but would like to get through third level before going through the recruitment process.

    Would a third level qualification in criminal justice or law be of an advantage during the recruitment process? While it would take three years, the idea is that I would have a lasting qualification if things didn't work out, but also during the three years of college I would have got experience by volunteering in Civil Defence and maybe taking a Security job to make it easier to sell myself at interview stage.

    (I won't comment on some of the posts in this thread re: Leaving Cert, except to say that "psni" and "genericguy" have said what needs to be said, except to say that it's no wonder when I say I want to be a Garda, you get a funny luck and a joke about only having to take a test in "p***ing in a bottle".)


  • #49
    cushtac
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭cushtac


    pretentiouslad wrote: »
    But, regarding Garda recruitment, hypothetically speaking, surely if there are 300 people applying for 100 places then obviously not everyone will get in... and let's say that 50 people out of the 300 have a 3rd level degree, and 50 people barely scraped 140 points in the leaving cert, then which 50 are almost a certainty to be given the nod?

    Most Gardaí I know, including those recruited in the last few years, do not have a degree.
    pretentiouslad wrote: »
    I'm not saying that leaving cert results are a reflection of intelligence, but if someone gets 500 points and another person gets 200 points the first person has clearly worked harder than the latter and i'm sure that AGS would opt for a harder working candidate at the end of the day...

    Essentially you are saying that, and the number of points you get in your leaving does not indicate what sort of a worker you are.
    pretentiouslad wrote: »
    and i don't think it's stupid for AGS to expect candidates to have a basic education under their belt... what these posters have been focusing on is mainly how education won't help you apprehend someone, but that's only one aspect of the job!

    Speaking as someone who actually does the job, I'd point out that it's the biggest aspect of the job.


  • #50
    TheNog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,160 ✭✭✭TheNog


    pretentiouslad wrote: »
    I'm sure that this post will rub a few people up the wrong way...

    But, regarding Garda recruitment, hypothetically speaking, surely if there are 300 people applying for 100 places then obviously not everyone will get in... and let's say that 50 people out of the 300 have a 3rd level degree, and 50 people barely scraped 140 points in the leaving cert, then which 50 are almost a certainty to be given the nod?

    I'm not saying that leaving cert results are a reflection of intelligence, but if someone gets 500 points and another person gets 200 points the first person has clearly worked harder than the latter and i'm sure that AGS would opt for a harder working candidate at the end of the day...

    of course there are exceptions to this, but I'm speaking in general terms...

    and i don't think it's stupid for AGS to expect candidates to have a basic education under their belt... what these posters have been focusing on is mainly how education won't help you apprehend someone, but that's only one aspect of the job!

    I couldnt disagree with you more. Having a college degree does not make a person a better worker nor does it mean that person is more intelligent in any way.

    I have see first hand with college graduates at my aptitude and interview who bragged of the courses they had done etc etc but not one of them made it passed the interview. Even in the Garda college I know of one college graduate who came number 1 in the recruitment process, left a few months after starting Phase 4.

    The aptitude and interview is based on communication skills, life experience and above all else common sense. These skills cannot be learned from a book or a lecture. Granted college courses are designed for specific areas in the workforce but not in the role of a Garda.

    In all this job is suited to some people and not to others. It requires a type of dedication that is not present in most employment areas of the workforce. I know this because I spent 13yrs working in various jobs in the private sector. This job can embrace you, love you, chew you up and spit you out all at the same time.


  • #51
    ForeverYoung90
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭ForeverYoung90


    Just a quick question.To qualify for increments do you need to have obtained a degree ie.3/4 years or will a higher certificate be accepted(2 years)?
    Sound.
    ps.I have neither!:pac::cool:


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  • #52
    standtwo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33 ✭standtwo


    hey guys dont want to get into a debate, but i have a question.


    i have a FETAC level 6 award and an ok leaving, in september ill be in the last year of my degre. only problem is that i failed maths in the leaving.

    in my FETAC course we did ''maths and statistics' witch we were told was equivilent to the leaving.

    my question is does my FETAC count as ''equivelent in the opinion of the minister'' or do does having higher education trump the leaving or am i back to do leaving maths next year?

    if so can i apply ina advance or would i need the maths done,

    Thanks

    Stand Two


  • #53
    Shield
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 9,819 CMod ✭✭✭✭Shield


    Unfortunately, we don't know what his opinion is. That seems to be one of the biggest grey areas in the requirements.
    standtwo wrote: »
    hey guys dont want to get into a debate, but i have a question.


    i have a FETAC level 6 award and an ok leaving, in september ill be in the last year of my degre. only problem is that i failed maths in the leaving.

    in my FETAC course we did ''maths and statistics' witch we were told was equivilent to the leaving.

    my question is does my FETAC count as ''equivelent in the opinion of the minister'' or do does having higher education trump the leaving or am i back to do leaving maths next year?

    if so can i apply ina advance or would i need the maths done,

    Thanks

    Stand Two


  • #54
    standtwo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33 ✭standtwo


    Cheers PSNI,

    best course of action is probly to get on to the recruitment office and see what they think.


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