Starting a Website

SomethingElse · 10-03-2010 01:00AM

SomethingElse wrote: »

I'm surprised nobody here recommended wordpress.

I was being sarcastic. The majority of people here are just interested in selling their professional services, so why would they recommend something that might help me to do it on my own?

Bob_Harris · 10-03-2010 01:10AM

SomethingElse wrote: »

I was being sarcastic. The majority of people here are just interested in selling their professional services, so why would they recommend something that might help me to do it on my own?

Actually nobody can "sell" themselves here, it's against the rules.

What you got was good free advice which in the long term you may, or may not, regret not considering in a more reasoned manner.

You should really come back with the finished result. At the very least posting a link here will help generate traffic and search engine indexing.

If you can get wordpress to look like anything other than a Web2.0 fad blog then fair play to you.

Liam Byrne · 10-03-2010 11:57AM

SomethingElse wrote: »

I was being sarcastic. The majority of people here are just interested in selling their professional services, so why would they recommend something that might help me to do it on my own?

Why would they recommend anything ? You asked about Dreamweaver compatibility.

And in my defence, I did - apparently - offer "the answer" that you wanted, without trying to sell "professional services". I'm also not that unique on boards in doing so, with lots of advice from Tony on the Satellite forum (just an example, because there's lots of people that do).

Add in the fact that part of your reason for posting here would have been to get advice from experts, and can you see the issue with having that attitude ? If we were only interested in selling professional services, there would be no free professional advice whatsoever......we'd have posted "ring a pro for a consultancy, and get charged a fee".

Can I ask you if your new business that you're doing the site for will involve anything that you could offer free advice for ? And would you do that ?

Would you do it partially in the hope that if someone was biting off more than they could chew that they might remember who gave them free advice ?

Because while I'd love to have enough money to help loads of people out with various things free of charge, we all have to make a living, so any altruistic ideals would partially factor that in - it's human nature and it's required in order to be able to pay for a house, food, etc.

Liam Byrne · 10-03-2010 12:04PM

Nulty wrote: »

You can get Dreamweaver shipped for €435 (Best I've found).

Dreamweaver is a LOT more than just a html editor/WYSIWYG editor. The FTP, snippets, related files, template updates, support, extensions etc. It's amazingly useful and if you plan to build many websites it worth the money.

I'm not sure how to answer this without seeming to name-drop! :P

I've been involved with Dreamweaver in a couple of serious ways over the years - books, extension writing, training and more - and I used to swear by it.

I still do, for people with very little experience who want to get stuff done.

But when you're building many websites you end up finding better ways of doing things with include files and less bloated scripts.

cormee · 10-03-2010 12:22PM

SomethingElse wrote: »

I was being sarcastic. The majority of people here are just interested in selling their professional services, so why would they recommend something that might help me to do it on my own?

I've just re-read the thread and not one person has tried to sell you their services, some have been giving you sound advice - you have little or no web experience so get a professional to do it for you - ignore that advice if you want, at the end of the day it's your business so it's your decision.

Have a read of the other threads where the OP actually specifies they are looking for a CMS and you'll see WordPress mentioned repeatedly. WordPress is great software and most people here are advocates, and no, it's not putting web designers out of business, if anything it's helping us produce standards-compliant, usable and SEO friendly websites in a fraction of the time it would normally take, and given that most designers will charge a set price for building a site (rather than charging by the hour) it's a win-win situation for both us and our customers.

cormee · 10-03-2010 12:40PM

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I'm not sure how to answer this without seeming to name-drop! :P

I've been involved with Dreamweaver in a couple of serious ways over the years - books, extension writing, training and more - and I used to swear buy it.

I still do, for people with very little experience who want to get stuff done.

But when you're building many websites you end up finding better ways of doing things with include files and less bloated scripts.

I know it's off topic but I find this is exactly what Dreamweaver is perfect for - productivity, given that a lot more people are on broadband and faster computers than they were a few years ago bloated code isn't that big a concern on a brochure site or the likes. It's not ideal from an SEO point of view but the time I save by using Dreamweaver to create the pages more than covers the time it takes to manually strip down the code.

On anything more complex than a brochure site I'm happy to use the dw code view, it has a few shortcomings but Dreamweaver's other features - associated files, live view, live code, browser compatibility checks, link checker, server debug,compatibility with other Adobe products etc - make up for it.

At the end of the day the business of web design is about productivity as well as other factors like bloated code.

mahamageehad · 10-03-2010 02:07PM

SomethingElse wrote: »

I was being sarcastic. The majority of people here are just interested in selling their professional services, so why would they recommend something that might help me to do it on my own?

I think that this is very unfair. Again I'm only building my first website and I have three or four different threads on boards asking advice about various problems I ran into on the way. Nobody ever told me to give up and contact the professionals and nobody ever charged me for their advice. This is more than likely because i asked specific questions that I wanted the answer to. Not just...I'd like to build a website tell me how.

I have found people on both the design and development forums extremely helpful and honest, and their advice is invaluable.

Not kissing ass but someone needed to say it!

nellyshark · 10-03-2010 03:32PM

Just to get this thread back on topic, has the OP any questions regarding the redirect of the existing site? If you do please ask and give some detail to what you want? Failing any further question I would like to see this thread closed

Chet Zar · 10-03-2010 03:42PM

mahamageehad wrote: »

I think that this is very unfair. Again I'm only building my first website and I have three or four different threads on boards asking advice about various problems I ran into on the way. Nobody ever told me to give up and contact the professionals and nobody ever charged me for their advice. This is more than likely because i asked specific questions that I wanted the answer to. Not just...I'd like to build a website tell me how.

I have found people on both the design and development forums extremely helpful and honest, and their advice is invaluable.

Not kissing ass but someone needed to say it!

+1 it's just a case of a poster being too proud to admit he doesn't know what he's at.

ocallagh · 10-03-2010 04:40PM

What a farce of a thread... sick of this 'cowboy industry' tone that seems to linger in practically every business related thread on this forum. It nearly always emanates from individuals and small companies with very little experience who reckon they can get it done cheap themseslves..

If you want to dabble in it yourself then fire away, you might get lucky. However if you (representing a company) come looking for advice, don't be surprised and certainly don't make snide comments or remarks if people recommend you get a developer. It is the best advice for you and your company given your clear lack of experience.

Chet Zar · 10-03-2010 05:25PM

ocallagh wrote: »

What a farce of a thread... sick of this 'cowboy industry' tone that seems to linger in practically every business related thread on this forum. It nearly always emanates from individuals and small companies with very little experience who reckon they can get it done cheap themseslves..

If you want to dabble in it yourself then fire away, you might get lucky. However if you (representing a company) come looking for advice, don't be surprised and certainly don't make snide comments or remarks if people recommend you get a developer. It is the best advice for you and your company given your clear lack of experience.

Funny stuff....funny how 0% of the same people would ever contemplate fixing their own pipes or rigging up their electrical system at home - but when it comes to something as complex as web design/dev anyone who knows a bit about what html is reckons they can sign up for Wordpress and crack out a lovely looking site!

And I'm saying that as a n00b!!

ocallagh · 10-03-2010 06:40PM

Exactly, if web design was such a doddle then all these companies have made a grave error and should fire their HR team, install wordpress and give it a bash themselves

http://www.irishjobs.ie/ShowResults.aspx?Recruiter=Company&Keywords=web+design&I7.x=31&I7.y=10

Nulty · 10-03-2010 06:58PM

I have learned html, css and am pretty proficient in Dreamweaver. I'm learning php now and using includes myself.

Anyone who thinks they can decide to build a decent website from scratch needs a year or twos experience. Especially if it any way big, or needs to be professional. Theres just no way you sit down and go "I'll give it a go"

If you want to build one yourself CMS is the way to go, otherwise you'd better set the next *year aside to learn how to build websites.

*At Least

cats.pyjamas · 10-03-2010 07:25PM

jeeze the guy only wanted some advice...... I really don't see the problem with someone trying to learn a new skill, you just spent three pages calling him an idiot and saying how great ye are....amazing. ..and he admitted he did not know anything about web development, hence the name of his thread.

I find it fascinating how on many web design forums I have read where web developers consider themselves higher beings because the know how to code. Someone wants help give them a break

lostprophetsie · 10-03-2010 07:28PM

cats.pyjamas wrote: »

jeeze the guy only wanted some advice...... I really don't see the problem with someone trying to learn a new skill, you just spent three pages calling him an idiot and saying how great ye are....amazing. ..and he admitted he did not know anything about web development, hence the name of his thread.

I find it fascinating how on many web design forums I have read where web developers consider themselves higher beings because the know how to code. Someone wants help give them a break

He was given advice, if you are reading the same thread as me? The problem was his dig at web designers who he feels were keeping the holy grail from him (Wordpress)

*Edit, had a quick read back through the entire thread and cannot see where the OP was called an idiot?

sheesh · 11-03-2010 09:15PM

SomethingElse wrote: »

I was being sarcastic. The majority of people here are just interested in selling their professional services, so why would they recommend something that might help me to do it on my own?

I'm genuinely miffed by that comment I spent over 5 mins writing answering your questions as you asked them in good faith. The reason i suggested you pay someone was that there was a transfer of domain and content involved. In the original post you mentioned a second site and you didn't appear to have much technical expertise. I wouldn't be using an obscure username like 'sheesh' If i was looking for sales contacts.

to be frank I have no interest in doing your self designed 5 page website that will probably drag on over a month for about €200

I was honestly trying to help

Again good luck with website

Starting a Website

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