SEO Value for money

11-11-2009 09:59PM

I've spoken to link8r in person on a number of occasions, heard how he goes about a campaign, and am satisfied that he knows his beans and is a dominant reputable figure in Irish SEO. I've not done business with him (yet), and stand to gain nothing by supporting him.

Badinfluence - I think you posted in good faith, hoping to gain some rep. Probably best to avoid a slagging match - it won't do much to help anyone involved.

HandWS LTD · 12-11-2009 12:59AM

badinfleunce wrote: »

Attack Attack Attack ! May God bless your efforts. You seem like your a distracted, stressed individual. I dont see you offering any free assistance to the poster apart from following on with your inexperienced knowitall attitude. Link juice from Social Media networks are very valuable and many people dont know how to utilise these for business. Its free of course - but the knowledge to maximise your exposure in social media networks is paramount.

By the way Facebook has a page facility for businesses where you can build brand, promote products or services, engage with customers and more. This is hugely valuable in the Internet Marketing Sphere and should not be overlooked.

Submitting content from your site to places like Digg or Reddit gives you links on those sites and, if your article becomes popular, it can get you hundreds more links as other sites pick up, link to and discuss content they found on Digg or Reddit. This is refererred to as "viral content". Yes its Free too.

NOW BEFORE YOU ATTACK ME OR MY BUSINESS AGAIN CONSIDER YOUR TONE AND CHOICE OF WORDS.

I was simply offering a free site audit. FREE! - So get back in your box, relax and enjoy your life.

By the way what does "Social Media is Social Media" mean. Get a grip on yourself. I detest people with this negative attitude. Its like saying "eating your dinner is eating your dinner".............. its just senseless.

Dell (Dell) says it has surpassed $3 million in sales attributed to Twitter, and the online social network, which has yet to make a profit, is watching closely.

http://www.informationweek.com/news/hardware/desktop/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=217801030

Oh and to let you know if you type the key words "Seo Dublin" and "Search engine optimisation dublin" into google you will see we have first page organic indexing after 3 weeks and our linkbuilding which you have been very quick to observe has yet to kick in. Seo as you know takes time and we take time to get it right for ourselves and our clients. It pays off hugely and the longterm ROI(return on investment) is greater than any other form of advertising.

With your attitude its no wonder this country is in the state we're in.

Over and out.

Ok...why say you detest people with negative attitude, while you are being negative with that kind of attitude. Not good for any business? and customers don't like that.

Now....you mentioned 2 of your keywords. They are not even important. Why on earth would people type in "seo dublin"? if i was to search i'd type in seo, seo ireland, search engine optimisation....but dublin?? no. How many hits do you expect to get from that? Best of luck to you.

Please, tone it down for the sake of your business.

badinfleunce · 12-11-2009 05:30AM

HandWS LTD wrote: »

Ok...why say you detest people with negative attitude, while you are being negative with that kind of attitude. Not good for any business? and customers don't like that.

Now....you mentioned 2 of your keywords. They are not even important. Why on earth would people type in "seo dublin"? if i was to search i'd type in seo, seo ireland, search engine optimisation....but dublin?? no. How many hits do you expect to get from that? Best of luck to you.

Please, tone it down for the sake of your business.

Mind your own business!

link8r · 12-11-2009 01:01PM

I guess Social media can be quite complicated - you have to engage, listen and sometimes you might not like what you hear. Maybe its not as easy to just throw in link juice. This is a very interesting case in point maybe?

Lots of SEO companies offer free audits. I just didn't want to tout here and I'm not going to try. I think I'll post on the feedback thread about sub-dividing the SEO/Internet Marketing into groups for newbies, people who want to learn/discuss, and one for more excited members to be able to debate. I think its good to sub divide, it gives a focus to what context we're replying in.

Very Interesting conversation.

badinfleunce · 12-11-2009 02:55PM

link8r wrote: »

I guess Social media can be quite complicated - you have to engage, listen and sometimes you might not like what you hear. Maybe its not as easy to just throw in link juice. This is a very interesting case in point maybe?

Lots of SEO companies offer free audits. I just didn't want to tout here and I'm not going to try. I think I'll post on the feedback thread about sub-dividing the SEO/Internet Marketing into groups for newbies, people who want to learn/discuss, and one for more excited members to be able to debate. I think its good to sub divide, it gives a focus to what context we're replying in.

Very Interesting conversation.

Pointless if you ask me.

link8r · 12-11-2009 04:29PM

The query was about your claims about social media and was it valid? You can't just get up in arms because someone queried you or asked you a question. Well you can but I dont see what you've solved.

Why can't you just engage, discuss, debate? Are you saying that debate has no place in public forums?

SEO is a purely online creation/industry. Where else are we going to discuss it? Universities? Dail? Concerts?

I assume you're new to the industry (? - you dont seem to have a profile excpet for your site, I haven't really tried to look you up either, I'm assuming) - so you've waded in and then complained when we asked questions? We were just supposed to sit back and say, wow - this guy ranks we should take notes on €100 audits? I'm really hoping you'll actually answer the questions

"hate the game, not the player" - springs to mind

badinfleunce · 12-11-2009 06:32PM

link8r wrote: »

The query was about your claims about social media and was it valid? You can't just get up in arms because someone queried you or asked you a question. Well you can but I dont see what you've solved.

Why can't you just engage, discuss, debate? Are you saying that debate has no place in public forums?

SEO is a purely online creation/industry. Where else are we going to discuss it? Universities? Dail? Concerts?

I assume you're new to the industry (? - you dont seem to have a profile excpet for your site, I haven't really tried to look you up either, I'm assuming) - so you've waded in and then complained when we asked questions? We were just supposed to sit back and say, wow - this guy ranks we should take notes on €100 audits? I'm really hoping you'll actually answer the questions

"hate the game, not the player" - springs to mind

"Hate the player for playn' the game" - springs to mind

You keep drawing this forum down.

To answer your questions: this is a forum, open to opinions, interaction on whatever level, and debates.

I never insist on somebody being banned. It just creates a furore. The removal of my web address - fine, and move along as the mod and most others have done addressing the post in question.

Seo for 100 euros is not going to achieve anything. But pointing the poster in the right direction and the use of web 2.0 to build networks espacially if ,as the poster mentioned , he has a large network could certainly develop possibilities and expose his site. I think you misunderstood my post when I mentioned
"If you have a lot of contacts we can utilise the likes of social media marketing to drive traffic to your site. There are also possibilities of monetising the site with affiliates that will bring in extra revenue. Plenty of avenues to investigate and ways to build juicy links."

I wasnt purporting that the links be spammed in Social networks. Never even mentioned that. I was just trying to give this guy a start.

Anyway, must go now, and to Shanley who started the post best of luck with your efforts. If you post your site address maybe we can all have a look and give our two penny bit on it without attacking each other along the way or calling for each other to be banned.:)

Sully · 12-11-2009 11:01PM

Mod Note:

Stop acting like kids and grow up for god sake. I would prefer you took your head to head "im better then you" ****e elsewhere. This is not a debate forum for businesses to debate what each business offers customers. This forum is for fair, honest, no spam/shameless plugging (even if its free) discussion and assistance on SEO and Internet Marketing.

link8r · 13-11-2009 10:29AM

Sully wrote: »

Mod Note:

Stop acting like kids and grow up for god sake. I would prefer you took your head to head "im better then you" ****e elsewhere. This is not a debate forum for businesses to debate what each business offers customers. This forum is for fair, honest, no spam/shameless plugging (even if its free) discussion and assistance on SEO and Internet Marketing.

I never said I'm better than anyone Sully, in all fairness. I'm debating SEO as far as I'm aware. I really didn't want my business brought into it and from reading back I didn't. I did establish why I might be entitled to an opinion but that wasn't a "I'm better than you comment"

badinfleunce · 14-11-2009 06:01AM

Sully wrote: »

Mod Note:

Stop acting like kids and grow up for god sake. I would prefer you took your head to head "im better then you" ****e elsewhere. This is not a debate forum for businesses to debate what each business offers customers. This forum is for fair, honest, no spam/shameless plugging (even if its free) discussion and assistance on SEO and Internet Marketing.

Fair point - Accepted.

HandWS LTD · 14-11-2009 11:53PM

Well done Sully. It was getting ridiculous.

DaveyByrne · 16-11-2009 10:26AM

link8r wrote: »

Hi Davey,

No but a big Yes. Intersite linking is a cornerstone of the Google ranking system. It remains so. The last videos and updates released by Google and the posts on their site re-iterate this. Linking between sites and the authority given is based on relevance.

Google cannot really, as a computer system, evaluate content. It needs humans to help. PageRank is very much alive (internally) and toolbar PageRank (tbPR) - the pagerank we see on toolbars/publicly is really dubious and its function/purpose is under question [by google] and whether or not it should be stopped.

PageRank is also a measurement of how popular a site is - or how good the content is - because if people are linking to it, then it's a way of measuring its importance. Even if people don't like the content, its still a measurement of significance if they link to it.

By taking the links, where they are from, what they say and what sites they come from - and then by examining the content on those sites, Google can develop a position or place for the site by phrases/words and geo location.

So, in-links still remains key - but by building proper content (and, not by burying search phrases like other people have done, to "fool" the search engines) is a great way to have people link to you.

Hope that helps

Thanks for that link8r

I hope you don't mind if I pick your brains on these items... but I've two more questions:

URL Structure

A friend (guru who works on the BBC's iPlayer project) of mine recently suggested that the URL structure doesn't matter in SEO. So he's saying that something like

http://mysite.ie/products.php?prodid=2343234

is no better or worse than

http://mysite.ie/shoes/clogs/black/clogs-natural-style.php

So where do ye all stand on that one?

Sitefinity SEO

Anyone got experience of doing SEO for sitefinity crm? I'm just wondering if I should go and rewrite the url's and do some deep-down ASP.net work on it to ensure that the pages are optimised...

HandWS LTD · 16-11-2009 10:43AM

Let me just say one thing DaveByrne. ALL SEO's are divided. And that's a fact. You will never get them all on agreeing to the same thing.

I have tested both on 2 different sites....and both work the same. Both get good ranking. It all depends on the seo work done. My prefered way is to use the second link you provided. Others will have different opinions with which i will not be against.

link8r · 16-11-2009 11:03AM

DaveyByrne wrote: »

Thanks for that link8r

I hope you don't mind if I pick your brains on these items... but I've two more questions:

URL Structure

A friend (guru who works on the BBC's iPlayer project) of mine recently suggested that the URL structure doesn't matter in SEO. So he's saying that something like

http://mysite.ie/products.php?prodid=2343234

is no better or worse than

http://mysite.ie/shoes/clogs/black/clogs-natural-style.php

So where do ye all stand on that one?

Sitefinity SEO

Anyone got experience of doing SEO for sitefinity crm? I'm just wondering if I should go and rewrite the url's and do some deep-down ASP.net work on it to ensure that the pages are optimised...

Some URL's are definitely bad, if it contains session ID's. Google often strips certain parameters out to when it stores a URL.

Just to note some facts from Google:

/clogs/black - these indicate folders. Google knows that a "/" indicates a path - more of these and your end file is more paths away from your home page

The "?" mark indicates to Google that this is a dynamic page - which isn't a hard and fast rule either.

Just because 1 thing can have an influence, doesn't mean you have to do it. You can definitely rank either way. I don't use mod_rewrites and it hasn't held me back. That doesn't mean it does or doesn't work. All things in context.

I think that the page name can definitely be an influencer in both conversion and ranking and here's why:

1. Google talk about them a lot
2. Google talk about Authority being highest on the home page and diluted down the further away you go
3. The URL is shown to the user. Long URLs (like long descriptions) get concatenated and I dont think this looks well in results (as a personal opinion). So I think if the URL makes better sense to the user (some read them), then thats going to be important to you and to Google

My 2c !

link8r · 16-11-2009 11:16AM

HandWS LTD wrote: »

Let me just say one thing DaveByrne. ALL SEO's are divided. And that's a fact. You will never get them all on agreeing to the same thing.

I have tested both on 2 different sites....and both work the same. Both get good ranking. It all depends on the seo work done. My prefered way is to use the second link you provided. Others will have different opinions with which i will not be against.

I totally agree with you

. We all have different experiences with SERP's and techniques and combinations. Both do work but obviously when you test one method on one domain, and the other on another, its very hard to create an exact scientific environment where all things can be measured.

But I have seen cases where URL changes have made a positive effect, if even in the absence of seeing something else.

DaveyByrne · 16-11-2009 04:49PM

Ok, thanks for that guys - i'll let you know how I fare. I'm working on a project for an industry leading company in ireland who's website is absolutely nowhere for key phrases, so it should be straightforward.

+1 on the page name - I definitely agree with that one

DaveyByrne · 17-11-2009 08:16AM

Google unveil a new look 'google translate'. IMO they are up to their ears in semantic analysis and natural language processing as part of their indexing... I think this is the real new frontier in SEO... lucky I have a degree in Applied Computational Linguistics

Comments?

link8r · 17-11-2009 09:03AM

I think the semantic web and indexing by content is still a bit utopian. People want this and many people already think its happening/happened. And it really hasn't. I've seen so much auto-spun content rank well.

IMHO - We're not yet able to build computers that can rate content. For example, I couldn't judge content about architecture, quite a few sports, medical information.

Content written in one language and then put through translation software would not, in my book, count as "good" content. In the absence of learning French, yes I can get the general idea of whats being written but I'm sure you'll agree, a company would be better in investing in proper content for their target audience. Which is what you want to see by seeing a move to a "semantic web"

Google and Bing WebMaster blogs have both re-iterated how important links are and will remain - I dont think we should try to convince ourselves otherwise until that happens.

Right now - both are important. A very good video by Mr Cutts says that if you have 1000's of pages and only a handful of links, Google will probably only read a few pages and that makes a lot of sense.

HandWS LTD · 17-11-2009 11:58AM

Google translations are not that good at all so i think they'll will still be lacking behind there. A good one is translation2.paralink.com

Sully · 17-11-2009 12:20PM

Someone tell me the link with Google translate and the topic of "SEO Value for money"?!

HandWS LTD · 17-11-2009 12:31PM

should be a new thread.

link8r · 25-11-2009 10:42PM

Shanley wrote: »

Another thing id like to add about my site is if I search google for 'atm locations galway' its coming up as second on the list but when i search the more important terms such as I havent a clue where I am, (not in top 10 pages anyways)

Just found myself on page 14, the website is only active since Oct 2nd, will this get any better by itself?

Age is a big factor but presumable the other 100 odd domains above you will also age too, although not at the same rate. It depends on the Authority-Relevance dynamic - if you are more relevant, then age increased authority will lift you but I wouldn't hold my breath.

I don't mean to come across short - I'm just trying to give honest feedback. I think SEO is a understanding a complex model with lots and lots of factors. We dont even know how many factors there that are new this year.

I think people try to oversimplify SEO - 15 things to do, or top SEO tips or if you do x,y and z you'll rank. It's a model or an engine.

analogy: You can just pump more petrol into an engine, it will just flood. You can't make a car go faster by adding more cylinders, you have to keep the relationship over the cylinders, firing sequence, timing belt, cooling system, car weight etc.

I think most seo's/online marketeers/[insert your description here] sigh when people try to break it into over simplistic terms - like you have to have W3C validation. Its like saying you'll be the best driver if you can design the best car engine in the world. The two are mutually exclusive. Really, you just need skill and a car and a licence. A licence alone doesn't make you a driver - you need a car. Having more licences and no car doesn't help. The guy who runs the traffic dept. for Dublin Corporation uses a bicycle (good example).

Maybe some other people have some different views but thats mine.

kdaly100 · 26-11-2009 08:52AM

Re: ATM Locations Galway. I can rank for that in a day if I want with on-page alone. Nobody searches for it. Look at Google Keywords Tool and you will see why. The level of search is non-existent.

My well battered post on this is that I rank #1 on Google for Banana Picking Cork but that is no great shakes as there is no search traffic. However trying to rank worldwide for Banana Shakes will take some more work as the traffic is high.