Failure to stop for unmarked police vehicle

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 08:10AM #1

Hi,

Is it an offence in this country to fail to stop for an unmarked police vehicle? I've learned over the weekend that in the UK, it is not an offence if you fail to stop for an unmarked vehicle.

It kind of makes sense you often see a pursuit situation in the UK the unmarked vehicle will most likely make way for a marked vehicle, obviously there are a multitude of reasons why the marked vehicle would lead the pursuit, but maybe this offence is one of them?

Any ideas what the situation is in Ireland?

source · 05-10-2009 10:20AM

If you see blue lights behind you and hear a siren, PULL OVER!!!! it's simple as that. Failure to stop when requested to by a member of An Garda Siochana is an offence. it doesn't matter what they're driving.

Hooch · 05-10-2009 10:23AM

CTU_Agent wrote: »

Hi,

Is it an offence in this country to fail to stop for an unmarked police vehicle? I've learned over the weekend that in the UK, it is not an offence if you fail to stop for an unmarked vehicle.

It kind of makes sense you often see a pursuit situation in the UK the unmarked vehicle will most likely make way for a marked vehicle, obviously there are a multitude of reasons why the marked vehicle would lead the pursuit, but maybe this offence is one of them?

Any ideas what the situation is in Ireland?

As poster above it is an offence here no matter what you driving. Failure to stop is failure to stop.

On the pursuits issue, here if an unmarked car starts the pursuit then it must allow the marked to take over once it joins. And once an advanced driver arrives he must take over the pursuit.

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 10:26AM

Fair point. However blue lights and sirens are easily available and fitted to any car should you wish to.

With the increase in tiger kidnappings in this country it is a understandable if you do not feel safe stopping for an unmarked police vehicle.

biko · 05-10-2009 10:33AM

Well you can keep driving and wait to be stopped by a marked car and take your chances with the judge.
If you're female alone in the car the judge will probably believe you.

sgthighway · 05-10-2009 10:39AM

nice guy always wrote: »

On the pursuits issue, here if an unmarked car starts the pursuit then it must allow the marked to take over once it joins. And once an advanced driver arrives he must take over the pursuit.

So marked Puntos and Yaris' move away from any pursuits or at least you hope;)

timmywex · 05-10-2009 10:41AM

Marked police cars lead pursuits for the simple reason that theyre marked! Much easier for the joe ublic to see, it all comes down to safety

robbie_998 · 05-10-2009 10:42AM

it is an offense

in the uk the reason why the marked car is in front is so other road users can see clearly whats going on and where the siren is coming from rather than just a normal looking car speeding down the road.

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 11:01AM

in the UK though, it is not an offence. You can keep going and unless they stop you or you stop, there is no offence committed if you fail to stop and the following car is unmarked.

Beruthiel · 05-10-2009 11:15AM

foinse wrote: »

If you see blue lights behind you and hear a siren, PULL OVER!!!! it's simple as that. Failure to stop when requested to by a member of An Garda Siochana is an offence. it doesn't matter what they're driving.

As a woman, unless it is very obviously a Garda car, I'm not sure I would be at all comfortable stopping for a car with no markings on it and only a blue light.
I don't consider the blue light to mean much as many types of companies/vans have them.

seamus · 05-10-2009 11:16AM

It is an offence, though law enforcement agencies themselves recommend for women that if you're unhappy or unsure, then continue driving at a moderate pace until you reach a bright/public place where there are plenty of people and then pull over. Lock your doors and demand the Garda identifies himself (with I.D.) before you unlock it or open the window.

They also recommend ringing the emergency services, who can verify that the reg is that of a Garda vehicle.

Hooch · 05-10-2009 11:17AM

CTU_Agent wrote: »

Fair point. However blue lights and sirens are easily available and fitted to any car should you wish to.

With the increase in tiger kidnappings in this country it is a understandable if you do not feel safe stopping for an unmarked police vehicle.

They are very easy to get, but a Garda Badge is alot harder. Stop.......keep window up.....ask for badge. Or ring the local Garda Station and ask them is their an unmarked car trying to make a stop.

Magnus wrote: »

Well you can keep driving and wait to be stopped by a marked car and take your chances with the judge.
If you're female alone in the car the judge will probably believe you.

This happens everyday of the week for me and I have prosecuted several for failing to stop. Their excuse was I didnt think you were a Garda. I have lost none is court....even the night stops with women aboard the only eventually stop when you overtake them and block the road!!!

The legislation is very very clear in this. It is not an excuse to "believe" the Garda is not a Garda. When you see blue lights you should stop. It could be a HSE doctor in a response car.....or a Garda going to an Armed incident......or just a Garda looking to speak to you for running that stop sign.

Hooch · 05-10-2009 11:18AM

seamus wrote: »

It is an offence, though law enforcement agencies themselves recommend for women that if you're unhappy or unsure, then continue driving at a moderate pace until you reach a bright/public place where there are plenty of people and then pull over. Lock your doors and demand the Garda identifies himself (with I.D.) before you unlock it or open the window.

They also recommend ringing the emergency services, who can verify that the reg is that of a Garda vehicle.

Great minds and all that!

Hooch · 05-10-2009 11:19AM

Beruthiel wrote: »

As a woman, unless it is very obviously a Garda car, I'm not sure I would be at all comfortable stopping for a car with no markings on it and only a blue light.
I don't consider the blue light to mean much as many types of companies/vans have them.

Report them. Only light they may have shown to the front is the yellow/white headllights and yellow/white spot/fog lights in fog or falling snow.

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 11:23AM

seamus wrote: »

It is an offence, though law enforcement agencies themselves recommend for women that if you're unhappy or unsure, then continue driving at a moderate pace until you reach a bright/public place where there are plenty of people and then pull over. Lock your doors and demand the Garda identifies himself (with I.D.) before you unlock it or open the window.

They also recommend ringing the emergency services, who can verify that the reg is that of a Garda vehicle.

It is an offence in Ireland it would seem, but NOT in the UK. The advice from UK police is to go to a public place, ask for indentification etc etc, but there is no actual offence for failure to stop for unmarked vehicle in the UK - From the horses mouth.

source · 05-10-2009 11:25AM

Beruthiel wrote: »

As a woman, unless it is very obviously a Garda car, I'm not sure I would be at all comfortable stopping for a car with no markings on it and only a blue light.
I don't consider the blue light to mean much as many types of companies/vans have them.

As a woman you might get away with that if it came to a prosecution, however if you fail to stop, you'll know pretty fast that it's a real Garda Car, as quite a few more cars will join in the chase.

Also it is illegal for private vehicles to have blue lights, only emergency vehicles can have these, if you see a vehicle with blue lights, (only a few people are stupid enough to have these) contact the Gardai with the reg of the car who will investigate the person for posing as a member of An Garda Siochana.

maglite · 05-10-2009 11:28AM

http://www.10tv.com/live/content/local/stories/2009/05/15/story_officer.html?sid=102

I would assume it woudl be ok to ring 112 and ask for clarification as to whether that is a garda or not. If Some nice guy then brings you to court for failure to stop you can shop you did not act irrationaly and have "proof" you intended to stop.???

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 11:34AM

maglite wrote: »

http://www.10tv.com/live/content/local/stories/2009/05/15/story_officer.html?sid=102

I would assume it woudl be ok to ring 112 and ask for clarification as to whether that is a garda or not. If Some nice guy then brings you to court for failure to stop you can shop you did not act irrationaly and have "proof" you intended to stop.???

Dont know if calling 112 in this case would constitute a valid emergency, maybe phoning the local station would be a better idea...

source · 05-10-2009 11:34AM

Of course it is okay to ring and clarify, pull over, make the call, let the member know what you're doing and ask for ID. If the person is an impersonator then they will be out of there fairly quickly. If they're real then they will show you their id and wait for you to clarify. then speak with you about whatever the original stop was for.

Also if you have done something to break the law, and see blue lights behind you then it's probably best to think Garda instead of impersonator.

ivabiggon · 05-10-2009 01:40PM

foinse wrote: »

Also it is illegal for private vehicles to have blue lights, only emergency vehicles can have these, if you see a vehicle with blue lights, (only a few people are stupid enough to have these) contact the Gardai with the reg of the car who will investigate the person for posing as a member of An Garda Siochana.

look if your a criminal intent on going out to commit a serious crime of kidnapping or hi jacking a loan female driver then stupidity in respect of blue light doesn't really come into it, also not everyone diving to and from work would have the phone number of the local station, and do you really think a gaurd on the other end of the public office phone would look into a reg check in the time you are being pursued, eh don't think so, pretty shaggged if you ask me the villian will stop you and be gone with either way,
should invest in some of those cars in s/ africa that burn the hijackers if they come near the car

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDrzMGdYWZc

Kimbot · 05-10-2009 01:46PM

nice guy always wrote: »

As poster above it is an offence here no matter what you driving. Failure to stop is failure to stop.

On the pursuits issue, here if an unmarked car starts the pursuit then it must allow the marked to take over once it joins. And once an advanced driver arrives he must take over the pursuit.

There are many reasons why I wouldn't stop tho.

About 4 years ago me and one of the lads were driving down the M50, he was driving and behind us we seen blue flashing lights and heard a siren. They drove right up our rear and start flashing their headlights. We were about to pull in when they overtook us and got on front of us. Next thing we knew they were throwing bangers out the rear windows at the car!!

They weren't coppers and god only knows what would have happened had we pulled in for them. We reported the car but don't know what happened beyond that.

Bottle_of_Smoke · 05-10-2009 01:55PM

seamus wrote: »

It is an offence, though law enforcement agencies themselves recommend for women that if you're unhappy or unsure, then continue driving at a moderate pace until you reach a bright/public place where there are plenty of people and then pull over. Lock your doors and demand the Garda identifies himself (with I.D.) before you unlock it or open the window.

They also recommend ringing the emergency services, who can verify that the reg is that of a Garda vehicle.

I don't think they should say that's just for women. A man alone is hardly going to be more able to defend himself than a women if the guys know what they're doing.

civdef · 05-10-2009 02:22PM

in the UK though, it is not an offence. You can keep going and unless they stop you or you stop, there is no offence committed if you fail to stop and the following car is unmarked.

You sure about this? The constable has to be in uniform to stop a vehicle under Sec. 163 of the Road Traffic Act, wasn't aware of anything regarding vehicle markings or lack thereof.

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 02:32PM

civdef wrote: »

You sure about this? The constable has to be in uniform to stop a vehicle under Sec. 163 of the Road Traffic Act, wasn't aware of anything regarding vehicle markings or lack thereof.

the constable in uniform refers to what is neccessary for a stop to be legal, but if you refuse to stop, where the pursuier is unmarked there is no offence commited.

I was watching road wars or brit cops or something on Friday and an unmarked police vehicle was chasing a guy on a bike who refused to stop. The suspect then dropped his phone turned round and stopped to get it. The cops grabbed him and seached him under a suspicion of theft from a motor vehicle charge,and let him go as there was no other evidence of a crime having been commited they then explainined that it wasn't an offence to fail to stop for an unmarked police car and guy on bike was on his way !!

johnny_adidas · 05-10-2009 02:43PM

isn't there something about if you really dont feel safe to pull over, to drive to the nearest station and confirm there? maybe it was something i read on a uk site before.
if you are contemplating not stopping for them, i doubt u'd pull over to make a call, (which if they indeed turned out to be the gardai, they'll could probably use as another offence)

civdef · 05-10-2009 02:55PM

With all due respect to Road Wars, it's hardly the last word on the English legal system.

If the constable is in uniform you have to stop. Failure to stop is an offence and it doesn't matter what vehicle the constable was driving.

deadwood · 05-10-2009 03:00PM

civdef wrote: »

With all due respect to Road Wars, it's hardly the last word on the English legal system.

No, this is.

CTU_Agent · 05-10-2009 03:02PM

correct. certainly road wars and programmes like it arent exactly factual documentaries so to speak, but it was the officer himself that said it wasnt an offence not the sky commentator.

Sure if you are driving it may be difficult sometimes to see if the constable is in uniform or not

Hooch · 05-10-2009 03:13PM

johnny_adidas wrote: »

isn't there something about if you really dont feel safe to pull over, to drive to the nearest station and confirm there? maybe it was something i read on a uk site before.
if you are contemplating not stopping for them, i doubt u'd pull over to make a call, (which if they indeed turned out to be the gardai, they'll could probably use as another offence)

As I said make the call while driving to the station! Section 3 Road Traffic Act 2006 has an exemption covering use of mobile phones to call the Emergency Services.

Mad_Max · 05-10-2009 03:25PM

nice guy always wrote: »

As I said make the call while driving to the station! Section 3 Road Traffic Act 2006 has an exemption covering use of mobile phones to call the Emergency Services.

Would it not p*ss off the Garda whose trying to stop you if you keep going and then whip out the phone? Surely they wouldn't know that you're calling and driving to the local station.

Just wondering if it would lead the Garda pursuing to do something to stop the car.

Hooch · 05-10-2009 03:28PM

Mad_Max wrote: »

Would it not p*ss off the Garda whose trying to stop you if you keep going and then whip out the phone? Surely they wouldn't know that you're calling and driving to the local station.

Just wondering if it would lead the Garda pursuing to do something to stop the car.

I think your p*ssing the member off quite enough by not stopping to care about what he thinks of you on the mobile phone!!

Failure to stop for unmarked police vehicle

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