Liverpool vs. Madrid Redux

Mr Alan · 11-03-2009 12:35AM

the dog on the street is wrong, he likes to control games, but its not negative, we create just as many chances as anyone else.

Boggles · 11-03-2009 12:35AM

Mr Alan wrote: »

Sunderland? Stoke?

75% possession against Stoke, 21 shots.

72% possession against Sunderland 31 shots.

Oh and vital stat that makes teams champions, United won both games.

ButcherOfNog · 11-03-2009 12:36AM

It was never a peno, but the way Henzie threw up his arm as the ball came off his shoulder, in real time, made it look terrible suspicious, pull your arms in, not flail them about you eejit. I can see why the peno was given. But it was never a peno

One of the best performances I've seen from Liverpool under Rafa, really ripped into Real and made them look terribly poor.

kryogen · 11-03-2009 12:38AM

Mr Alan wrote: »

but us having scored 3 less than Utd, with our top scorer out all year means we're negative

thought Lucas did well when he came on tonight.

Kuyt was excellent too

A. Gerrard hasnt been out all year

B. are you really gonna try argue the point that benitez is not cautious first.....

Boggles · 11-03-2009 12:39AM

ButcherOfNog wrote: »

It was never a peno, but the way Henzie threw up his arm as the ball came off his shoulder, in real time, made it look terrible suspicious, pull your arms in, not flail them about you eejit. I can see why the peno was given. But it was never a peno

To be honest I was delighted, Heinze and Ramos should be ashamed of themselves for what they did tonight, Pepe wasn't too far behind, Canavara cared for about 35 minutes and packed it in aswell.

Diarra in fairness to him tried his best at times.

SlickRic · 11-03-2009 12:39AM

raven136 wrote: »

it was great to see Spearing get a run out,Jeez he is small

and Spud-like.

LuckyLloyd · 11-03-2009 12:40AM

rossie1977 wrote: »

4 european cup quarter finals in 5 years since rafa took charge and the names of juve, inter, real, barcelona, ac all dispatched, who would have predicted that at approx 10pm on the night of march 25, 2004 when for the second year in a row Houllier's liverpool bowed tamely out of the uefa cup this time to a very average marseille team

Brondby
Celta Vigo
Paris SG
Celtic
Marseilles
FC Basle

Oh, the horror.

Utopia Parkway · 11-03-2009 12:41AM

Boggles wrote: »

75% possession against Stoke, 21 shots.

72% possession against Sunderland 31 shots.

That's like something Rafa would come out with.

Mr Alan · 11-03-2009 12:42AM

kryogen wrote: »

A. Gerrard hasnt been out all year

B. are you really gonna try argue the point that benitez is not cautious first.....

i meant top scorer from last year, Torres.

also, gerrard has been out a good chunk of the year too.

Benitez is cautious first, nothing wrong with that....wat top team in England wasnt built around a solid defensive base?

Boggles, you can pull out stats all you want....dont care what they say, maybe Ronaldo was pinging free kicks over the stand to keep the shots up?:D i watched both those games, and Utd were poor, poor, poor. Utd fans were saying the same at the time how you werent even nearly playing well yet etc etc....it irritates me when people try & rewrite history.

LuckyLloyd · 11-03-2009 12:45AM

Lads, lets not talk about UTD in this thread. It's off topic in here. Thanks.

raven136 · 11-03-2009 12:45AM

Boggles wrote: »

More often than not Rafa is negative Alan, the dog on the street knows it.

whats negative though?its about winning the game first and foremost and if you feel the best way to do that is to defend well and play on the counter is that a problem.

When Rafa took off Torres and brought onb Dossena i was waiting for the gimps in the studiop to tell us that Fergie would have in fact taken off a defender and put on another striker and gone for 8 goals."Thats why Rafa is a chancer Bill,he just doesnt play football the way the great teams like madrid do"i believe something like this was uttered on RTE two weeks ago.

SlickRic · 11-03-2009 12:47AM

anyone watching RTE?

ronnie whelan is a very irritating man.

he really dislike benitez. he's points are valid-ish, but he really does not seem to want to get behind the team. why can't he just revel in the performance before trying to get his dig in?

ugh.

Mr Alan · 11-03-2009 12:48AM

apologies LL

Utopia Parkway · 11-03-2009 12:49AM

SlickRic wrote: »

anyone watching RTE?

ronnie whelan is a very irritating man.

I don't think Ronnie is the sharpest knife in the drawer to be fair.

kryogen · 11-03-2009 12:49AM

Mr Alan wrote: »

i meant top scorer from last year, Torres.

also, gerrard has been out a good chunk of the year too.

Benitez is cautious first, nothing wrong with that....wat top team in England wasnt built around a solid defensive base?

Boggles, you can pull out stats all you want....dont care what they say, maybe Ronaldo was pinging free kicks over the stand to keep the shots up?:D i watched both those games, and Utd were poor, poor, poor. Utd fans were saying the same at the time how you werent even nearly playing well yet etc etc....it irritates me when people try & rewrite history.

United have been poorer this year by our own standards, whats amazing is that when Liverpool are supposedly after moving forward that we are actually closing in on the League title with relative ease, doesnt say a whole lot for the competition does it

Benitez is not an aggressive attacking manager by nature, its his style and thats fair enough, but to argue with you as you try to defend another indefensable point about him is something im gonna let you do with Boggles cause im too tired for it

EDIT: Sorry Llyod, posted before i saw your warning, this will be my last post on the matter!

redout · 11-03-2009 12:49AM

Boggles wrote: »

Madrid have been severely embarrased for at least the past 2 CL Campaigns, tonight would have been a severe eye opener for many fans, they havn't been hockied like that in 20 years.

If Rafa were to be head hunted, chances are he would be in the job no more than 12 months, if he could restore a small bit of pride into Madrid I think the fans might sacrifice the flair and paniche to insure nights like tonight don't happen for another 20 years.

Maybe there could be some truth in what you are saying Boggles but as you said he would never be a longterm fix. I think Real Madrid fans have become accustomed to no longer being a European heavyweight over recent seasons. They have not made a Q/Final since 2004 and have exited the competition at the last 16 stage for the past five seasons now which has become the norm form them. Other European sides no longer fear the once mighty Los Merengues and the fans are aware of this.

Rafa was also lambasted here in Spain after the first leg for being to defensive and that was not just from the press but also from the mouths of the Real Madrid manager and players so I am not sure they would take him on. But that said I think Benitez pulled off a masterstoke tonight as everyone, Madrid included thought he would go out and play defensive again and hold out for the draw or possibly snatch a goal on the counter. What does he do ? Went for the Jugular and it worked, he totally outfoxed Madrid tonight tactically and one could see after the first 3mins or so after the Torres and Mascherano efforts that Real looked confused and didnt know how to respond as it was apparently clear they were not setup for that.

Boggles · 11-03-2009 12:49AM

Sorry LL, Alans fault, I think he has been drinking.

Utopia Parkway · 11-03-2009 12:52AM

If Perez runs for the Real Madrid presidency again and gets it I think it's very unlikely Benitez will be back in Madrid anytime soon. The two of them don't get on apparently.

PHB · 11-03-2009 12:53AM

Fantastic from pool. With Gerrard and Torres on the pitch, the dynamic totally changes. Madrid were there for the taking and Benetiz just took them. Fantastic performance.

Mr Alan · 11-03-2009 12:55AM

If Rafa gets the contract he wants....he wont be going to Real.

End of discussion.

If he doesn't get the contract he wants, in my opinion, he would more likely end up at AC Milan after Ancelloti moves to Chelsea in the summer.

Its a testament to how ****ing thick some fans are when some of your own fanbase think a manager should be sacked, yet if he was, he would walk into one of the two biggest jobs in world football.

Boggles · 11-03-2009 12:56AM

PHB wrote: »

Fantastic from pool. With Gerrard and Torres on the pitch, the dynamic totally changes. Madrid were there for the taking and Benetiz just took them. Fantastic performance.

Torres in the first half actually reminded me of Tevez for his work rate. Great first half performance, he shouldn't have let Heinze wind up him thou, I thought the ref was a bit erratic and was surprised the teams finished with there compliments.

Boggles · 11-03-2009 12:58AM

Mr Alan wrote: »

Its a testament to how ****ing thick some fans are when some of your own fanbase think a manager should be sacked, yet if he was, he would walk into one of the two biggest jobs in world football.

Spurs and Ramos immediately spring to mind, what had Ramos accumulated when he left Spurs, 2 points?

K-9 · 11-03-2009 12:58AM

redout wrote: »

Rafa was also lambasted here in Spain after the first leg for being to defensive and that was not just from the press but also from the mouths of the Real Madrid manager and players so I am not sure they would take him on. But that said I think Benitez pulled off a masterstoke tonight as everyone, Madrid included thought he would go out and play defensive again and hold out for the draw or possibly snatch a goal on the counter. What does he do ? Went for the Jugular and it worked, he totally outfoxed Madrid tonight tactically and one could see after the first 3mins or so after the Torres and Mascherano efforts that Real looked confused and didnt know how to respond as it was apparently clear they were not setup for that.

He has done this regularly in Europe.

Hell, even in the odd game away, he has gone on the attack.

I think its a regular pattern, others seem to ignore the obvious, based on preconceived notions of his style.

People don't take Rafa seriously and boy, do they pay.

He exposes the stereotypes, fair play.

Mr Alan · 11-03-2009 12:59AM

Torres was so wound up cause Cannavaro put in a shocking tackle trying to do him when him & heinze were tusseling. Torres thought it was Heinze i think.

Torres always works like that. Along with his skill, beauty & finishing abilty, its why he is the best.

Mr Alan · 11-03-2009 01:00AM

Boggles wrote: »

Spurs and Ramos immediately spring to mind, what had Ramos accumulated when he left Spurs, 2 points?

Ramos is a stop gap for Real. This was evident by him getting a six month contract.

Boggles · 11-03-2009 01:01AM

Mr Alan wrote: »

Ramos is a stop gap for Real. This was evident by him getting a six month contract.

Sure thats only 6 months less than most managers at Madrid get.

kryogen · 11-03-2009 01:04AM

Mr Alan wrote: »

Ramos is a stop gap for Real. This was evident by him getting a six month contract.

As would Benitez be imo if he were to go to Madrid, they would only want him in to work on building a strong spine again and then when the team is strong again give him the boot and get the free flowing attacking going again....

im not saying thats what we would be told when if he were to go of course, but they do have a bad record in dealing with, well everything!

Capello was brought in to bring stability, he did more then that but he wasnt their kind of guy so off you go!

Del Bosque has always been the most puzzling one though, he wins the Champions League and 3 league titles and hets the boot..... while they were playing good football!!

kinaldo · 11-03-2009 01:32AM

kryogen wrote: »

Del Bosque has always been the most puzzling one though, he wins the Champions League and 3 league titles and hets the boot..... while they were playing good football!!

I hate this, Eamon Dunphy as usual spouts off some mis-information from his lack of European football knowledge, and then it gets recycled all over. Well done Eamo. Del Bosque won 2 ligas and 2 CLs in 4 seasons with Real, got sacked after winning his second la liga and getting ko'd in the CL semis by eventual winners, Bayern Munich - edit: sorry, mixing 2001 and 2003 up, Capello's Juve team defeated them in the 2003 QFs, that season they destroyed Manchester in Madrid.

I wouldn't worry about Real, they'll be back as usual. In the meantime they can focus on claiming their 3rd liga title on the spin as the fixtures pile up for under pressure Barca. Florentino Perez will return in the summer and spend big. It wouldn't surprise many to see the likes of Kaka and Fabregas at the Bernabeu next season.

~Rebel~ · 11-03-2009 02:10AM

Im sure its already been mentioned, but a special mention for the crowd tonight, sang pretty much none stop for the whole night, and more importantly gave constant support to Rafa throughout the night. Thought it was very classy the way they started singing Jay Spearings name after he came on and got involved. Would have helped make it a really special night for the lad, coming on for Gerrard, against Real Madrid, and having the Kop sing his name.

LuckyLloyd · 11-03-2009 02:17AM

Barca related posts moved to the appropriate thread.

Liverpool vs. Madrid Redux

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