to smack, or not to smack

24-02-2009 04:10AM

Senna wrote: »

Having no kids does not give you enough experience to know if smacking is ok or not. Become a parent and feel free to bump this thread.

Ok, seriously, give it a rest. The act of procreation did not bestow upon you some gift of insight. If a foster parent hit a child, they'd have it taken away from them. If a teacher, who acts in all senses in the place of a parent while the child is in their care, hits a child they are arrested. If a parent hits a child they should be....?????????? Understood to be doing it with some degree of love that no other person can bestow? Imbuing each painful strike with a sense of parental protection and love that eases the sting?

Pride Fighter · 24-02-2009 04:10AM

There is everything wrong with smacking kids, it is lazy parenting, it is child abuse, it is parents power tripping. Oh wow, I am a big man, I smacked a child half my size:rolleyes:
Anyone that smacks their child is lowlife scum, and should be arrested for assault.

I misread the thread first and said it is ok to smack occasionally cause I thought it was about giving skanger adults a smack for their ridiculous behaviour, so mod change my vote to no.

So in conclusion, smacking a skanger adult ok.
Smacking a child who does not have a fully developed brain yet and is so vulnerable NEVER!!!

24-02-2009 04:15AM

Rb wrote: »

Children outgrow smacks when, as I said, they begin to realise that there are consequence to their their actions. It's also around the same time as they start lying, there is then no use in smacking the child if they know that the only thing that will happen for being bold is a smack across the arse, hence when you bring in "bigger" punishments such as cutting their pocket money.

So you accept that hitting a child is a pointless punishment and achieves nothing?

Rb wrote: »

I'll take it that your lack of reply to my previous question means that you do indeed have no children?

And I shall take it that your lack of reply to my previous request implies a refusal to apologise for implying that I strike children?

Pride Fighter · 24-02-2009 04:15AM

Senna wrote: »

Having no kids does not give you enough experience to know if smacking is ok or not. Become a parent and feel free to bump this thread.

She works with children so it does. While you give your child into a crèche or school in the morning and work all day, the crèche assistant and teacher are basically taking care of your children. So people like these have more experience with children than parents due to years of experience and the increased proliferation of au pairs etc than modern parents have with children.

Paige Turner · 24-02-2009 04:16AM

The only thing smacking a child shows them is that you are bigger than them! It is never right to smack a child. It drives me crazy when I hear parents ask their kids "Would you like a smack?" "Eh no thank you - would you"

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:20AM

Deleted User wrote: »

So you accept that hitting a child is a pointless punishment and achieves nothing?

No, it teaches them discipline and the role of consequence (moderately) when they're at an age that they wouldn't understand it otherwise. Sticking a child on a chair for 20 minutes for a bit of "time out" is going to do sweet fcck all to them except make them pissed off with you.

Deleted User wrote:

And I shall take it that your lack of reply to my previous request implies a refusal to apologise for implying that I strike children?

I didn't mean to imply that you actively do it, just that you're ok with it

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 24-02-2009 04:20AM

Ok, what if the child hits back...? Once got slapped, kicked my mother in the shin, left a massive bruise.

(And before anyone says anything, I'd been wrongly accused by a neighbour)

Rb wrote: »

No, it teaches them discipline and the role of consequence (moderately) when they're at an age that they wouldn't understand it otherwise. Sticking a child on a chair for 20 minutes for a bit of "time out" is going to do sweet fcck all to them except make them pissed off with you.

The fvck it does! Have you been listening to Degsy?

It teaches them that it's okay to hit people you don't agree with. And if time outs don't work LEARN TO COMMUNICATE.

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:21AM

Paige Turner wrote: »

The only thing smacking a child shows them is that you are bigger than them! It is never right to smack a child. It drives me crazy when I hear parents ask their kids "Would you like a smack?" "Eh no thank you - would you"

No it doesn't.

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:21AM

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Ok, what if the child hits back...? Once got slapped, kicked my mother in the shin, left a massive bruise.

(And before anyone says anything, I'd been wrongly accused by a neighbour)

Lock it in its room for two days and refuse to feed it.

That'll teach the little bastard.

puntosporting · 24-02-2009 04:22AM

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Ok, what if the child hits back...? Once got slapped, kicked my mother in the shin, left a massive bruise.

(And before anyone says anything, I'd been wrongly accused by a neighbour)

Then you need to bring out the baseball bat its the next level of parenting 101!

SeekUp · 24-02-2009 04:23AM

Senna wrote: »

I got a smack if i done something wrong, but i wasn't smacked every time i through a tantrum and i dont think i was smacked in public (not much anyway). It was the threat of smacking that keep me right, as did many of the kids i grew up with.

Hear hear! Beating a child is wrong, and smacking 'em around in public will certainly go on a list somewhere of "Things Not To Do On Any Given Day," but I remember getting spanked when I was a kid. In fact, it happened so infrequently that I can name the specific occasions when it did happen.

And I graduated in the top 10% of my class, have a wonderful sense of self esteem, am a loving girlfriend, caring coworker, dedicated volunteer and have had no issues that I have needed to discuss with a therapist.

Granted, what works for one won't work for all. But everyone who lays a hand on their child isn't a bad parent. In fact, some parents out there could use a few knocks upside the head, IMO . . .

24-02-2009 04:24AM

Rb wrote: »

No, it teaches them discipline and the role of consequence (moderately) when they're at an age that they wouldn't understand it otherwise. Sticking a child on a chair for 20 minutes for a bit of "time out" is going to do sweet fcck all to them except make them pissed off with you.

And hitting them makes them fear you. A far more worthwhile outcome.

Rb wrote: »

I didn't mean to imply that you actively do it, just that you're ok with it

I would appreciate an apology. You cannot seek to speak to me on this issue and simultaneously make such a scandalous implication.

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:28AM

Deleted User wrote: »

And hitting them makes them fear you. A far more worthwhile outcome.

C'mon now, we're not talking about throwing fists at the child.

Deleted User wrote:

I would appreciate an apology. You cannot seek to speak to me on this issue and simultaneously make such a scandalous implication.

Ok ok, I don't believe you secretly beat children.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 24-02-2009 04:30AM

Rb wrote: »

C'mon now, we're not talking about throwing fists at the child.

You sure about that? Discipline is discipline.

Paige Turner · 24-02-2009 04:31AM

I'm sure the reason you kicked your mother in the shin was because you were upset about getting smacked - If a child encounters violence on a regular basis it is only natural this is the way they are going to learn to react.

If a husband smacked his wife he can be done for assult - parent smacks child to show them who is boss, that's how it is - surely something doesn't add up there!

I was never even once smacked as a child and would never condiser smacking a child!

Senna · 24-02-2009 04:34AM

Right this is my last post in this thread, populated by none parents with strong PC views.

If a responsible parent chooses to smack a child as a method of developing that child, then that is their choice. This can be abused by some, but thats not what this thread is about.
The best argument for smacking is not a parent that believes in smacking, but a simple look at average children in society. This PC attitude has lead to the attitude 'my little johnny is an angel, thats him over there climbing up on display stand'. I would say the next 5-10 years could be very hard on this country and this attitude will hopefully be replaced by a more tradition child rearing practices, if that involves smacking so be it. If it involves one parent being at home all the time, all the better.

Zillah · 24-02-2009 04:35AM

I've always thought that there are far less petty ways of disciplining children then giving them a belt. I think it says something very odd about a parent and how they view their children if they think physically striking a child is appropriate.

And no, I haven't gotten someone up the duff, which apparently means my opinion is irrelevant because I have not been driven by stress to the point where hitting a child sounds like a reasonable proposition.

Senna wrote: »

This PC attitude has lead to the attitude 'my little johnny is an angel, thats him over there climbing up on display stand'.

You're implying that a lack of physical violence means no discipline, which is monumentally stupid.

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:38AM

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

You sure about that? Discipline is discipline.

You could say the same about 1 week of grounding and what Joseph did so.

There's an enormous difference and most people capable of logical thinking know the overwhelming majority mean a smack, not a thump.

Paige Turner wrote: »

I'm sure the reason you kicked your mother in the shin was because you were upset about getting smacked - If a child encounters violence on a regular basis it is only natural this is the way they are going to learn to react.

Thank you, Dr.Phil

Paige Turner wrote:

If a husband smacked his wife he can be done for assult - parent smacks child to show them who is boss, that's how it is - surely something doesn't add up there!

He can't really though and probably won't.

A woman can smack a man full force for a cheeky comment and the Gardai wouldn't bat an eyelid - surely something doesn't add up there!!

Paige Turner wrote:

I was never even once smacked as a child and would never condiser smacking a child!

K, but you don't have any to smack as of yet, right?

AlmightyCushion · 24-02-2009 04:40AM

I got a smack a few times as a kid. I really don't see what all the fuss is about. It never really hurt that much, I'd get much worse beatings/injuries playing football with the lads. It didn't make me into a violent person (I'm far from it).

I really don't think comparing a relatively painless smack on the arse to beating someone up or domestic violence is fair. It would be like comparing sending a child to their room to solitary confinement or holding someone against their will (the latter is a crime I believe). While they share some similarities they are nowhere near the same thing,.

javaboy · 24-02-2009 04:43AM

Do you have any kids Rb?

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:43AM

Senna wrote: »

Right this is my last post in this thread, populated by none parents with strong PC views.

If a responsible parent chooses to smack a child as a method of developing that child, then that is their choice. This can be abused by some, but thats not what this thread is about.
The best argument for smacking is not a parent that believes in smacking, but a simple look at average children in society. This PC attitude has lead to the attitude 'my little johnny is an angel, thats him over there climbing up on display stand'. I would say the next 5-10 years could be very hard on this country and this attitude will hopefully be replaced by a more tradition child rearing practices, if that involves smacking so be it. If it involves one parent being at home all the time, all the better.

Indeed, all we need do is glance at the US for an insight as to what is to come in this country.

An enormous amount of their children are completely out of control over there, a fucking crazy amount, and as a consequence there's a stupid amount of children who've now been diagnosed with ADHD and are on Ritalin, Adderall etc which ends up numbing them out. The parents have absolved themselves of the blame and still believe that "soft" parenting is the way forward.

It's ridiculous.

Also you're completely right, there's a funny trend emerging in this thread of young, childless people posting PC-US views on parenting and as I said previously, no doubt a lot will be the same people claiming their child has ADHD in a few years time and that's why they're so out of control :rolleyes:

useful_contacts · 24-02-2009 04:43AM

carlybabe1 wrote: »

So, am just wondering how many of you have been is a shop/supermarket/cinema where a youngster has been actin up, and thought
"Id give that little fcuker a good shmack"

Or indeed how many of you have been witness to a youngster gettin a smack and thinking "ye cnut, try that with someone your own size"

Is smacking ever ok

I am not a parent yet but i believe a child deserves a slap if they are bold- my dad did it to me and it never did me no harm. My sister slaps her 2 girls and when i am taking care of them she tells me to slap them if they are bold- i dont like to do it but i do if need be.

I will be slapping my children if they are bold, i do however hate these parents who WALLOP their children for NOTHING. I witnessed this in a supermarket before... the father handed the little girl a bar, the mother snaps it back saying "it will wire her" the little girls starts crying(obviously because the bar was just waved at her then taken away) and the mother belts her for crying... now that i dont agree with.

But i have also seen little bastards screaming throwing tantrums in the middle of the street... and the mothers pleading "ill give you sweets if you calm down" Now they deserve a belt... and so do the mothers

Rant over!!!

tallaght01 · 24-02-2009 04:44AM

I'm very much against smacking children for a number of simple reasons:

1) I find it very hard to reconcile in my head the fact that it's illegal for me to hit my 95kg flatmate, for example, because it's an infringement of his human rights. But some people seem to think it's OK to clatter a little 7kg baby. Why does a big person get more protection against assault than a little person.

2) It doesn't work. I have never seen a kid who was in need of a beating. I've seen plenty who were in need of more loving parents. Just look at those parents who batter their kids round the shops. Those kids are still brats.

3) You're showing your kid that violence is an acceptable way of dealing with frustration. Kids imitate their parents.

4) People simply don't understand the parameters of acceptability. They say things like "it's only a slap etc". But too many of these kids turn up in emergency departments. It's amazing the damage "only a slap" can do.

I'm always amazed at the arguments that are made about only hitting kids until they're old enough to understand the consequences of their actions. What if they're special needs? Should we be able to knock them about for longer? What about old people who become demented? Should we be able to give them a kicking? Also how young should slapping start? If a 2 day old 3kg baby won't settle, should we be able to smack him?

So, slapping doesn't work. It treats the parents, not the kid. It sets a bad example. There's even some evidence that it breeds more violent kids.

I'm amazed that in this day and age people actually think it's OK to hit a small child.

SV · 24-02-2009 04:44AM

Too right smacking should be ok.

Never did me any harm either.
I know there's some brats that do be on that 'Super Nanny' crap that would be sorted out fairly quickly with a good smack.

and no it doesn't teach you violence is 'ok' or make you grow up to be more of a violent person or any of that bullshít people come out with.

24-02-2009 04:44AM

Senna wrote: »

Right this is my last post in this thread, populated by none parents with strong PC views.

I am sorry but you cannot simply dismiss someone's position because you believe it to be part of some over-riding PC agenda. I have serious problems with hitting a child for all sorts of reasons, moral, developmental and for the protection of children.

Having studied child development I have yet to find a single expert in the field who advocates the disciplining of children through physical punishment.

Senna, you say that if a responsible adult chooses to strike their child as a means of discipline then so be it. You also accept that this is open to abuse but dismiss it as not being the point of this thread. I think you do this because you realise that it is this very openness to abuse that makes striking children to be so wrong. How hard, how often and for what actions may a parent strike a child for?

Paige Turner · 24-02-2009 04:45AM

K, but you don't have any to smack as of yet, right?[/quote]

Three younger siblings of 4, 9, 17 ........

Plus volunteer in a centre for disadvantage youths for 6 years and a local pre-school so have many the experience of dealing with children on a daily basis. And yes you can get stressed, but it does not give you an excuse to take it out on them

tallaght01 · 24-02-2009 04:46AM

Rb wrote: »

Indeed, all we need do is glance at the US for an insight as to what is to come in this country.

An enormous amount of their children are completely out of control over there, a fucking crazy amount, and as a consequence there's a stupid amount of children who've now been diagnosed with ADHD and are on Ritalin, Adderall etc which ends up numbing them out. The parents have absolved themselves of the blame and still believe that "soft" parenting is the way forward.

It's ridiculous.

Also you're completely right, there's a funny trend emerging in this thread of young, childless people posting PC-US views on parenting and as I said previously, no doubt a lot will be the same people claiming their child has ADHD in a few years time and that's why they're so out of control :rolleyes:

Kids with ADHD get battered way more than kids without it, as it's so hard for parents to cope. It doesn't help.

24-02-2009 04:46AM

You know what? I forgot where I was having this debate. Good luck Rb. I have no problems with your opinions but your humourous attempts to make me seem ok with striking children are incredibly offensive. Congrats.

The chance of any of the "never did me any harm" brigade seeing any point of view barring theirs being valid is far too small so I will leave ye to keep hitting your children and convincing yourself it's for their own good.

Rb · 24-02-2009 04:47AM

javaboy wrote: »

Do you have any kids Rb?

Nope, and I make no secret of it.

However, I don't go around accusing parents who are using proven methods of disciplining their children of being bad, lazy parents and telling them that they should use this new and so far a complete failure of a method to do so, as it's "fairer on the child".

I will be a parent in the future though, and my children won't be getting any of this soppy crap used on them. They'll get a few smacks if they misbehave and be rewarded when they behave well, in fact I'm sure I'll end up going overboard with the rewards lol.

I got a few smacks when I was a kid and now I'm far, far from physically aggressive and have a lot of respect for my parents and the way they brought me up.

AlmightyCushion · 24-02-2009 04:48AM

tallaght01 wrote: »

1) I find it very hard to reconcile in my head the fact that it's illegal for me to hit my 95kg flatmate, for example, because it's an infringement of his human rights. But some people seem to think it's OK to clatter a little 7kg baby. Why does a big person get more protection against assault than a little person.

Would you be arrested for slapping your 95KG flat mate relatively lightly on the hand? Beating a child isn't ok, no one here is defending that I believe. And there is a difference in beating and smacking.

tallaght01 wrote: »

4) People simply don't understand the parameters of acceptability. They say things like "it's only a slap etc". But too many of these kids turn up in emergency departments. It's amazing the damage "only a slap" can do.

For the record, I'm (and I believe everyone else here) would be talking a light slap. Nothing that could land a child in the emergency room.

to smack, or not to smack

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