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Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Boggles wrote: »
    What are you, his official spokeman?

    I couldn't make my argument more effectively if I tried. Cheers.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 41,926 ✭✭✭✭_blank_


    This is the list of Liverpool players:
    • Sami Hyypia
    • Michael Owen - wanted to leave and was sold immediately
    • Dietmar Hamann - coming to the end of his career
    • Steven Gerrard
    • Jamie Carragher

    Are they the only players who were at Liverpool when Rafa took over?

    Wow.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    Agger is a serious toughy.

    Rafa has made it very very clear he wants Agger to have a new contract, and Agger is clearly the future with Skrtel. but at the same time, he cant really play Agger ahead of Skrtel when Skrtel has the position on merit.

    We did also see in the last game, Rafa's attempt to kill 2 birds with 1 stone by playing all 3 at the back, so we'll see how that goes in the future. I think we will see more game time for Agger from here on, but at the end of the day teh buck stops with Parry and he really needs to get this **** sorted! I have a feeling this is one of the things thats prompting Rafa to want more control as well, so crap like this doesn't happen where the board basically ignore a player's contract despite the manager clearly wanting it extended.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Des wrote: »
    Are they the only players who were at Liverpool when Rafa took over?

    Wow.

    Just wow...

    Just read the last page of posts before bothering posting in the future will you because this is retarded.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 972 ✭✭✭internelligent


    Just wow...

    There are sometimes when you just know there's no point..........:(


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,552 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    This is the list of Liverpool players:
    • Sami Hyypia
    • Michael Owen - wanted to leave and was sold immediately
    • Dietmar Hamann - coming to the end of his career
    • Steven Gerrard
    • Jamie Carragher

    Off the top of my head, Heskey, Finnan, Riise, Murphy??


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,095 ✭✭✭zing


    Not a bad 5 a side team though :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,184 ✭✭✭✭Pighead


    Boggles wrote: »
    Off the top of my head, Heskey, Finnan, Riise, Murphy??
    Dudek was pretty good back then too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,636 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Boggles wrote: »
    Off the top of my head, Heskey, Finnan, Riise, Murphy??
    Heskey Gone before he signed.
    Murphy Oh come on.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,397 ✭✭✭Paparazzo


    Boggles wrote: »
    Not when he comes out with qoutes like this, not accepting blame for the amount of dross he purchased over the past 5 years.
    Agreed. From F365:
    The age-old complaint from anyone not in the fiscal elite is that they cannot compete with their wealthier opponents. The moneybags likes of Chelsea and Manchester United have their Italian-loafered feet on the scraggy throats of the rest, and they are lucky simply to get the scraps cast aside from the big table.

    It's a useful tactic for some managers to employ. To foster an 'us against them' attitude and to dampen expectations, and it's a tactic that Rafa Benitez has down to a tee.

    Rafa said yesterday: "Every year, United collect £60million more than us - and that means they can buy three £20m players each season. Chelsea will have spent £500m over the last five years.

    "We've made a team that can compete with them but economically we're inferiors and can't afford the players they can.

    "I have enough data to bore you with it. But if you look at United, it wasn't just spending £32m on Dimitar Berbatov - they can spend whatever it takes for what they need every year. Last year it was £17m on Owen Hargreaves, £18m on Nani and £20m on Anderson. Seven years ago they paid £30m for Rio Ferdinand.

    "In my five years, I've paid less in transfer fees than I've received, even though I spent £40m on Fernando Torres and Robbie Keane. It's as simple as that."

    Simple eh? Rafa has spent less than he's received. Let's just check that.

    According to the excellent and thorough TransferLeague.co.uk, since Benitez took charge of Liverpool in 2004, he has spent an impressive £215,490,000 on players, receiving £98,030,000. Our rudimentary maths tells us that amounts to a net spend of the not inconsiderable sum of £117,460,000.

    If one is to be fair - and we are nothing if not fair - one should knock off the £14million paid for Djibril Cisse in 2004, as that was Gerard Houllier's deal, but even then Rafa's net spend tots up to £103,460,000.

    By way of comparison, those big money bullies Chelsea have a net spend of £131,150,000 in that time, while Manchester United - the trampling behemoths cited by Rafa - have splashed £93,300,000


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Boggles wrote: »
    Off the top of my head, Heskey, Finnan, Riise, Murphy??

    Actually, I forgot Finnan and Riise..

    Heskey was gone when Rafa took over and he got rid of Murphy.


    So, the Liverpool list was - players that played in the first season
    • Sami Hyypia
    • Dietmar Hamann - coming to the end of his career
    • Steven Gerrard
    • Jamie Carragher
    • Steve Finnan
    • Riise


    So what is the list of United players?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 88,968 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Wee Danny wasn't happy about all them foreigners if I remember rightly.

    Anyway onto important stuff - Gerrard back in training and it looks like the Madrid game is his comeback target.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    So what is the list of United players?

    Considering no one seems to be willing to provide a list:
    • Wesley Brown
    • Rio Ferdinand
    • Gary Neville
    • John O'Shea
    • Mickaël Silvestre
    • David Beckham
    • Darren Fletcher
    • Roy Keane
    • Paul Scholes
    • Juan Sebastian Veron
    • Ryan Giggs
    • Ole Gunnar Solskjær
    • Ruud van Nistelrooy


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,095 ✭✭✭zing


    and he got rid of Murphy.
    Don't think that's entirely true. From what I can remember it was Spud who looked to leave rather than been forced out. Also pretty sure he was sold before Xabi arrived so it wouldn't have been down to competition for places.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    zing wrote: »
    Don't think that's entirely true. From what I can remember it was Spud who looked to leave rather than been forced out. Also pretty sure he was sold before Xabi arrived so it wouldn't have been down to competition for places.

    I thought the opposite was the case if I am honest. I was watching an interview with him recently where, IIRC that is, he was talking about how he didn't want to leave the club.

    Either way, it isn't really relevant in the point I am trying to make, he wasn't there for the start of the PL season.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,456 ✭✭✭kida


    also there

    Dudek/Kirkland - both as good as your curent no 2
    Finnan - better than any current full back
    Risse - close to any current full back
    Baros/Heskey - Better than Kuyt/N'Gog as backup striker
    Henchoz - decent backup

    others
    Smicer - as good as Bennyoon
    Biscan/Murphy - as good as Lucas


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,250 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    Considering no one seems to be willing to provide a list:
    • Wesley Brown
    • Rio Ferdinand
    • Gary Neville
    • John O'Shea
    • Mickaël Silvestre
    • David Beckham
    • Darren Fletcher
    • Roy Keane
    • Paul Scholes
    • Juan Sebastian Veron
    • Ryan Giggs
    • Ole Gunnar Solskjær
    • Ruud van Nistelrooy
    Whats the point of this list - the majority of those players are still there. What point is being backed up with this?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Whats the point of this list - the majority of those players are still there. What point is being backed up with this?

    Just read the last page or 3 and hopefully you will see how things have progressed..


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,250 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    Just read the last page or 3 and hopefully you will see how things have progressed..

    Ok, cheers.

    FWIW - this link has a list of United players for the 2004/05 season (Rafa's first?)

    http://stats.football.co.uk/2004/man_utd.html


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    kida wrote: »
    also there

    Dudek/Kirkland - both as good as your curent no 2
    Finnan - better than any current full back
    Risse - close to any current full back
    Baros/Heskey - Better than Kuyt/N'Gog as backup striker
    Henchoz - decent backup

    others
    Smicer - as good as Bennyoon
    Biscan/Murphy - as good as Lucas

    Dudek/Kirkland
    Neither were happy being number 2 at pool. Kirkland spent most of his time on the treatment table.

    Finnan
    Was a regular for 4 years. Noticeably degraded after that and wanted to play regular football. Arbeloa being nearly 10years younger was the way to go for main starter. Would have liked Finnan to stay as backup, but i dont think he would have been happy with that

    Riise
    USED to be as good as our fullbacks (or better). His last 2 years were frustratingly awful. Had a really really shit attitude for the last year as well. Will remember his good service in the past but was only too happy to see the back of him.

    Baros/Heskey
    Baros was ok, wouldnt have minded keeping but wouldn't have been happy not starting. Heskey was never there under Rafa.

    Henchoz
    Decent backup at the time, but proved pretty poor from just after he left onwards. Wouldn't have minded if he'd been kept for another season, but meh.


    Smicer was Not as good as Yossi. Left when his contract ran out. His contract ran out the summer after Rafa arrived

    Biscan was fairly ruined by Houllier playing him anywhere but midfield. Had a pretty influential season under Rafa, and then his contract ran out as well.

    Murphy was simply never going to be a regular, which he wasn't going to be happy with. I recall an interveiw from the time with this being the reason he decided to part ways, though he would have wanted to stay if was a starter

    In particular on the Lucas comparison, I would have Lucas any day of the week over those 2, he's 4th choice, young and has loads of potential to be better then either of them


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭Jazzy


    can i play too?

    Ian Rush
    John Scales
    Rob Jones
    Stig Inge Bjornebye
    Michael Thomas
    Stan Collymore
    Salif Diao
    Dominic Matteo



    we are just randomly listing off former liverpool players or something?
    has this thread really gotten this bad? really?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    Jazzy wrote: »
    can i play too?

    Ian Rush
    John Scales
    Rob Jones
    Stig Inge Bjornebye
    Michael Thomas
    Stan Collymore
    Salif Diao
    Dominic Matteo



    we are just randomly listing off former liverpool players or something?
    has this thread really gotten this bad? really?
    thanks Jazzy you've made me look like a fool. Like A FOOL!

    yeah, is there anything else we can talk about really? there must be SOMETHING.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,463 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    I think jesus_thats_gre was trying to make some sort of point about how sh*te the players that wont he champions league were, and then about how Rafa had to rebuild that champions league winning side in order to create a side that was capable of winning loads of trophies, such as an FA cup, and err...

    And then how it's unfair because Sir Fergie already had a really good team. So something in the Rafa/Fergie transfer spend vs. team how much good they are vein?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭PiE


    I think what astrofool is trying to say is that money money money money, money money money, money.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    astrofool wrote: »
    I think jesus_thats_gre was trying to make some sort of point about how sh*te the players that wont he champions league were, and then about how Rafa had to rebuild that champions league winning side in order to create a side that was capable of winning loads of trophies, such as an FA cup, and err...

    And then how it's unfair because Sir Fergie already had a really good team. So something in the Rafa/Fergie transfer spend vs. team how much good they are vein?

    You sort of have it but there is something about the tone of your post that suggests I am jumping up and down shouting "it's not fair".

    It was an attempt, albeit poor, to try delve to deeper into the overly simplistic argument that Rafa and AF has spent as much as each other and how Rafa's signings since his arrival have been extremely poor compared to those of AF's.
    Both clubs and their respective clubs were at completely stages of development.

    Things are now a lot lot closer and this is reflected in the both the quantity and value of singings being made by Liverpool now. Mascherano, Torres and Keane all cost in the region of 20 million each. The revolving door that was 10 players leaving and arriving each summer has also slowed significantly.



    As a side argument, I think it should also be noted that Rafa had attempted to sign the likes of Villa, Vidic, Alves and a few others but ultimately missed out due to a combination of financing and a bumbling chairman. Alot of the players that Rafa subsequently signed were relatively cheap short term quick fixes after missing out on primary targets. It was obviously hoped that these then work out but there was also the logic that if they didn't, they could be got rid of again with minimal loss.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,871 ✭✭✭Karmafaerie


    Paparazzo wrote: »
    Agreed. From F365:

    Not this sh*te again!

    That wouldn't be the article that was completely disproved a utter crap with ridiculous figures that were way off would it?

    That wouldn't be the article that was disproved to the point where Rafa's Net spending was actually around £90,000,000 including Robbie, which would nw bring it down to somewhere around £75,000,000.
    The one where UTD's was actually proven to be about £110,000,000 IIRC.

    Yes, yes it is.

    I could do what you did.

    I can post an article from the 1400's saying the world is flat.
    Completely ignoring the fact trhat we've proven over and over again that it isn't since then.

    That's about as reevant as an article that's been proven wrong!
    Multiple times!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,095 ✭✭✭zing


    More charges in the Gerrard case
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/7895246.stm

    So now we have:
    3 charged with ABH & affray
    2 charged with affray
    1 charged with affray and assaulting a police officer


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,456 ✭✭✭kida


    I think you will find that it was only pool fans that disproved it by making up their own figures, the truth I would guess lies somewhere in between.

    Question for you how many signing has he actually made ?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,552 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    kida wrote: »
    Question for you how many signing has he actually made ?

    according to lfchistory.net

    Rafael Benítez bought 51 players for £189,866,000


This discussion has been closed.
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