Bonded Beed Cavity Wall Insulation

Moanin · 06-11-2008 05:05PM #1

Has anybody ever got these beeds pumped into the walls of their house? If so did it work and what kind of costs are you talking about?

I see a crowd in my neighbourhood are doing alot of the houses:

www.i.love.muffler.com

Thanks

muffler · 07-11-2008 12:53AM

Moanin wrote: »

Has anybody ever got these beeds pumped into the walls of their house? If so did it work and what kind of costs are you talking about?

I see a crowd in my neighbourhood are doing alot of the houses:

www.i.love.muffler.com

Thanks

See. I fixed that for you.

No company names please. Read the charter.

Moanin · 07-11-2008 09:59AM

Apologies but has anybody had this done?

Quazzie · 07-11-2008 10:21AM

Had my semi detached done there a while back and I have to say i do notice the difference.

I must point out that mine is an old council house that had no insulation and is standard semi-d size and cost me €750 but that was a reduced price because i got a few others in the area to sign up to get it done the same day

P.S Stop promoting exhaust pipes Muffler its against the charter :P

muffler · 07-11-2008 10:39AM

Quazzie2002 wrote: »

P.S Stop promoting exhaust pipes Muffler its against the charter :P

Ah ha. Didnt think that would connect to anything. Now I must go and infract myself

SonOfPerdition · 18-11-2008 03:07PM

Moanin wrote: »

Has anybody ever got these beeds pumped into the walls of their house? If so did it work and what kind of costs are you talking about?

I see a crowd in my neighbourhood are doing alot of the houses:

www.i.love.muffler.com

Thanks

Yes, we had our house pumped about 2 years ago with silver bead insulation as part of a series of improvements to make the house warmer .. this will be our second winter since we installed it.

We have a small bungalow with a flat roof kitchen extension. The sales guy recommended only to go to ceiling height on the gable ends of the main house , but i might put in an attic conversion at some time so i paid 200 extra for both gable ends to be pumped to the top. The house plus the extension cost 1250 ..would have been 1050 originally.

Did it work? Yes, but our house needed some other work to make the most of it. I put an extra 8 inches of insulation in the attic on top of the 4 inches that was there and we've just had the flat roof replaced and insulated.

One thing it seems to have helped with a lot is mould on some of the walls, we used to have to clean one room in particular annually (clean and repaint), since the walls were pumped we've seen a drastic reduction in the amount of mould.

SOP

muffler · 18-11-2008 05:50PM

SonOfPerdition wrote: »

Yes, we had our house pumped about 2 years ago with silver bead insulation as part of a series of improvements to make the house warmer

Just out of curiosity was your cavity completely uninsulated prior to this or did you have any kind of partial insulation in it like "Aeroboard"

Lex Luthor · 18-11-2008 06:37PM

sorry for jumping on here, but is this beaded insulation only possibly on a cavity wall construction?

If your house is built with cavity blocks, I am thinking its not possible???

RKQ · 18-11-2008 10:23PM

Crazy prices in Ireland if you compare a standard 3 bed detached house in uk costs £198-00! to pump walls. Have a look at this:-
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/nav.jsp?fh_view_size=6&fh_eds=%3f&fh_reffacet=categories&fh_locatio

Eddie Hobbs must be right.

Lex Luthor, Bead is installed in the air space in a cavity wall, usually 100mm thick between the two leafs of solid blocks.

18-11-2008 10:29PM

Oh man...

Paid €1,700 for mine - platinum bead for a 220 sq m house in the west, thought I was doing well after 2 prev quotes came around €2,500!

It's a new build & I've gone with IPB on external walls inside too, so I suppose I'll never be able to gauge it's effectiveness on it's own...

sorry I'm not any help.

endplate · 18-11-2008 10:40PM

I'm gonna get this done in my new build it's a 3100sq ft house. I already have 60mm high density insulation in the cavity. The rep claims bet €1200 - €1600 for most houses. I think it'll help with air tightness.

On another note my in laws had a hollow cavity and noticed a difference straight away after filling the cavity. Dampness cleared up in the room furthest from the heating but condensation started appearing on the windows which were new double glazed windows and frames

Lex Luthor · 18-11-2008 11:19PM

afaik in the UK they get a big grant from the govt to get it done

MicktheMan · 19-11-2008 01:24AM

if your walls are cavity block (hollow block) single leaf you cannot EFFECTIVELY insulate the wall by pumping the cavities with any kind of insulation (foam, bead etc) no matter what the insulation company sales man says. Can't be done. Period.

Lex Luthor · 19-11-2008 08:58AM

MicktheMan wrote: »

if your walls are cavity block (hollow block) single leaf you cannot EFFECTIVELY insulate the wall by pumping the cavities with any kind of insulation (foam, bead etc) no matter what the insulation company sales man says. Can't be done. Period.

Thanks, I was thinking to do it properly each cavity in each block would need to be drilled to fill and thats just not possible

RKQ · 19-11-2008 09:41AM

endplate wrote: »

I'm gonna get this done in my new build it's a 3100sq ft house. I already have 60mm high density insulation in the cavity. The rep claims bet €1200 - €1600 for most houses. I think it'll help with air tightness.

Be careful endplate - not always a good idea to mix materials. Remember that bead has a certain u-value for 100mm thickness. Your cavity is probably only 40mm so its less than half. This thickness may not be worth installing.

Also the quote seems dear, if its €1200 for standard house then, you'll need less than half the standard amount, 40mm wide, so it shouldn't cost more than €500 or €600.

SonOfPerdition · 19-11-2008 04:50PM

muffler wrote: »

Just out of curiosity was your cavity completely uninsulated prior to this or did you have any kind of partial insulation in it like "Aeroboard"

Insulation was completely absent in the cavity between all the walls, the house is about 30 years old so maybe not as much emphasis on standards back then.

SonOfPerdition · 19-11-2008 04:56PM

40701085 wrote: »

Oh man...

Paid €1,700 for mine - platinum bead for a 220 sq m house in the west, thought I was doing well after 2 prev quotes came around €2,500!

Your house is about 3 times the size of mine, so it doesn't seem such a bad price to me . . . well, for irish prices that is! :rolleyes:

RKQ · 19-11-2008 04:57PM

SonOfPerdition do you have any problems with damp patches on the internal leaf?

Do you now have 12 inches of insulation in your attic?
"I put an extra 8 inches of insulation in the attic on top of the 4 inches that was there"

300mm / 1 ft of insulation would be of considerable benefit - making the wall insulation difficult to value. Of couse the wall insulation is also beneficial.

Glad it worked out for you:)

SonOfPerdition · 20-11-2008 11:17AM

RKQ wrote: »

SonOfPerdition do you have any problems with damp patches on the internal leaf?

Do you now have 12 inches of insulation in your attic?
"I put an extra 8 inches of insulation in the attic on top of the 4 inches that was there"

You'll have to explain to me what an internal leaf is, but I've no damp patches anywhere that I know of.

yes, its 12 inches in most of the attic (some parts of it was missing insulation for some reason best known by the previous owner), the existing 4 inches was old fiberglass and i put an extra 8inch layer of insulation on top of it. That did make a noticeable difference at the time.

300mm / 1 ft of insulation would be of considerable benefit - making the wall insulation difficult to value. Of couse the wall insulation is also beneficial.

The two jobs were done about 6 months apart so i could tell the benefit of pumping the walls nearly immediately by how much easier it was to heat the house and how it retained that heat longer. Our external walls feels much warmer to the touch and if i sit near one I don't feel the cold radiating from it like I used to.

Glad it worked out for you:)

it has worked out for us indeed. but the nature of our our house made it the only real viable option. The house is too small to put up internal insulation (i didn't want to lose any space), and external insulation worked out quite expensive.

RKQ · 20-11-2008 11:45AM

SonOfPerdition wrote: »

You'll have to explain to me what an internal leaf is, but I've no damp patches anywhere that I know of.

Thanks SonOfPerdition a cavity wall has an external leaf of blockwork, a cavity and an internal leaf of blockwork.

Glad you haven't any damp patches on the walls. Small circular patches, 50 - 75mm dia would indicate damp / water penetration at wallties. Damp patches around the windows would have shown themselve by now, if there was a problem.

Ashfield · 20-11-2008 02:43PM

Hi all,
I am building a new house and was just wondering at what stage exactly the walls should be pumped?
I heard that the windows need to be sealed, is it ok if there is some insulation board in around the windows or should the windows be fully sealed with plaster??
Thanks

RKQ · 20-11-2008 03:52PM

Check with the manufacturer or installer.
I'd assume the windows and doors installed and sealed with foam filler, roof complete but before plastering begins!
(Get a copy of their IAB cert!)

20-11-2008 04:31PM

Like RKQ says, you'll have to consult the supplier. If they pump it from the inside, you can plaster away on the exterior, but windows & roof they would need on. I had some inch polysio to close cavities at windows & they were happy with that - any spots I missed they packed with rockwool.
Get a drill pattern from them to satisfy yourself.

Ashfield · 20-11-2008 05:12PM

thanks lads,
our builder does seem to have the cavity blocked with some board insulation alright so hopefully will be grand
sound

SonOfPerdition · 20-11-2008 06:50PM

RKQ wrote: »

Thanks SonOfPerdition a cavity wall has an external leaf of blockwork, a cavity and an internal leaf of blockwork.

ah, I have you now.

Glad you haven't any damp patches on the walls. Small circular patches, 50 - 75mm dia would indicate damp / water penetration at wallties. Damp patches around the windows would have shown themselve by now, if there was a problem.

so it would be regular patches along the wall assuming more than one tie would have this problem? Can pumping the cavity with insulation cause this? I would be interested to know how so i can inform people of the risks if i'm talking about it in future.

i've definitely not seen any small patches of damp, so it looks like we're ok..

RKQ · 20-11-2008 07:32PM

SonOfPerdition wrote: »

so it would be regular patches along the wall assuming more than one tie would have this problem? Can pumping the cavity with insulation cause this? I would be interested to know how so i can inform people of the risks if i'm talking about it in future.

Yes, here's the quick answer, hopefully others will add to it:-
Cavity construction was developed to eliminate rising damp and damp patches on solid construction.
The 100mm air cavity prevents wind driven rain crossing the cavity, as wallties have a drip in the centre, to throw any water down into the cavity.
Dpc at the floor level prevent rising damp. Dpc over window and door opes, throw water out over the window / door. Dpc at reveals stop damp transfer.

Partial cavity fill, was used to insulate walls, but as requirements in insulation levels rose so thickness increased. So does the size of the cavity or you must consider full cavity fill. Removing the cavity removes the waterproof element, developed over decades.

Filling the cavity can result in rain water traveling across the cavity. We alway assume the exterior leaf is wet. Especially unrendered clay brick - as its extremly porous.

A good render is preventing your wall getting wet. We have a great history of render in this country because of our damp moist winters with heavy wind driven rain.

I'm sure your insulation will be fine, as modern processes have been developed to prevent water ingress / soakage/ transfer.:)

cathalmd · 09-02-2009 09:28PM

RKQ wrote: »

Be careful endplate - not always a good idea to mix materials. Remember that bead has a certain u-value for 100mm thickness. Your cavity is probably only 40mm so its less than half. This thickness may not be worth installing.

Also the quote seems dear, if its €1200 for standard house then, you'll need less than half the standard amount, 40mm wide, so it shouldn't cost more than €500 or €600.

That's the most ridiculous reply ever. Just because you need about half the product doesn't mean it costs half. What about paying the guys + plant etc. Dumb reply

RKQ · 09-02-2009 09:49PM

cathalmd I've been expecting you!
Why waste your first post criticising me?

Its your fist post yet you are an expert on Boards posts to date, stating "most ridiculous reply ever". Thanks for your 1st post. I'll be gentle with you.

What took you so long - digging up my post from 20th November - interesting timing.... yet again.

Average house takes 3 - 4 hours to pump with 100mm cavity. Same plant and staff required for 40mm cavity BUT less material and LESS installation time, therefore less cost.

Still I wouldn't recommend installing 40mm.

gizmo555 · 09-02-2009 10:06PM

RKQ wrote: »

Average house takes 3 - 4 hours to pump with 100mm cavity. Same plant and staff required for 40mm cavity BUT less material and LESS installation time, therefore less cost.

Less installation time, but not half the installation time. Travel time, time taken to drill holes and time taken to make good the holes are the same whether the cavity is half filled or completely filled. Other costs, such as sales, office and administration overhead, insurance, etc. would also have to be taken into account.

All in all, I would have to agree that your comment that half filling a cavity with bead should cost exactly half the price of completely filling a similar cavity is at best grossly simplistic.

RKQ · 09-02-2009 10:18PM

I never recommend filling the cavity of a wall with bead or rockwool insulation.

I would highly recommend NOT to pump a cavity with insulation.
I never recommend to retro-fit a part insulated cavity- far too risky. Filling the cavity doesn't make sense.

IMO pumping a cavity is almost acceptable in reto-fit of uninsulated cavities of old houses. Where no other option is financially viable.

Never pump insulation into a brick wall or part brick wall. Never pump insulation into a wall full stop!

Thats as simplistic as I can make it.

gizmo555 · 09-02-2009 10:29PM

RKQ wrote: »

I never recommend filling the cavity of a wall with bead or rockwool insulation.

I would highly recommend NOT to pump a cavity with insulation.
I never recommend to retro-fit a part insulated cavity- far too risky. Filling the cavity doesn't make sense.

OK, I've already asked you in another thread and I'd like to ask you again here please - what risk are you talking about? And if there is a substantial risk, why has the government just decided to grant aid precisely what you believe is far too risky?

Bonded Beed Cavity Wall Insulation

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