Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

Quazzie · 07-10-2008 10:49PM

Denilson will NEVER be as good as Cesc. It's really unfortunate that Arsenal's future lies with Cesc. He is such an important part of it because he is both the present and the future. If we lost Cesc it is just further evidence (if any is even needed) that Arsenal cannot hold onto their top players. A reputation of creating good players then selling them when they get good is a very bad thing to have. Look at West Ham if ya need an example. Losing Cesc would have a more detremental effect than losing any of the others (Overmars, Vieira, Pires, Henry, Hleb, Flamini). All players that stated they wanted to leave and who we surrendered to. The difference this time is for each of them we always had someone lined up to replace them. I don't think we can replace Cesc. He represents all that is good about this club. Losing him might just disprove the theory of youth development, and therefore negate Arsenal's whole philosophy.

leninbenjamin · 07-10-2008 11:19PM

Quazzie2002 wrote: »

Losing him might just disprove the theory of youth development

no it doesn't, it just means you have to do more to hold onto you're best players.

Quazzie · 08-10-2008 07:51AM

leninbenjamin wrote: »

no it doesn't, it just means you have to do more to hold onto you're best players.

Like win trophies? If we can't do that then I think we will lose Cesc. It is currently October 8th and we are already out of the running for the PL (not mathematically but realistically). Our main hope is the Champions League and to win that it seems we have to hope someone else knocks out the other PL teams in it. We have plenty of prospects with the potential to be a really great team, but losing Cesc might just set a precedence for other members of our youthful future, and thats where it turns tragic. One player does not make a team, and never will, but we really need to stop the outflux of great talant from our club. Other players that left were always sold at their peak or just after it, and therefore its always been kind of justified selling them, but Cesc is not in this category. Selling him would be the first player we sold that we knew was going to get better after he leaves. And thats whats scary. Its not only that we are making ourselves weaker but we are making other teams stronger. We are too big a club to be a feeder club for Europes elite.

leninbenjamin · 08-10-2008 11:19AM

Quazzie2002 wrote: »

Like win trophies? If we can't do that then I think we will lose Cesc. It is currently October 8th and we are already out of the running for the PL (not mathematically but realistically). Our main hope is the Champions League and to win that it seems we have to hope someone else knocks out the other PL teams in it. We have plenty of prospects with the potential to be a really great team, but losing Cesc might just set a precedence for other members of our youthful future, and thats where it turns tragic. One player does not make a team, and never will, but we really need to stop the outflux of great talant from our club. Other players that left were always sold at their peak or just after it, and therefore its always been kind of justified selling them, but Cesc is not in this category. Selling him would be the first player we sold that we knew was going to get better after he leaves. And thats whats scary. Its not only that we are making ourselves weaker but we are making other teams stronger. We are too big a club to be a feeder club for Europes elite.

if you look at the Flamini situation though, it was just a major f*ckup by the club. by all accounts he was initially offered a fraction of what a first team regular could expect. it was only when it became apparent that he was leaving for Milan that Arsenal finally upped their offer to match his demands. i mean that kind of crap would have anyone wanting the door. of late it seems to be just this basic man management where the club are messing up on.... i mean the Adebaor situation is then the direct flip of this. caved into his demands even though he didn't really deserve it... Wenger is going to have to ask some tough questions of himself i think. forget the trophies, if you can't get your man management right at this level then you might as well pack it in.

yahoo_moe · 08-10-2008 12:34PM

Quazzie2002 wrote: »

Our main hope is the Champions League and to win that it seems we have to hope someone else knocks out the other PL teams in it.

Yeah because we could never possibly hope to beat another Premier League team ever :rolleyes:

leninbenjamin wrote:

Wenger is going to have to ask some tough questions of himself i think. forget the trophies, if you can't get your man management right at this level then you might as well pack it in.

I don't think that's entirely fair - everything hasn't gone perfectly but he's wanted help (seemingly Grimandi in a more senior role) for some time now and he has yet to get it.

leninbenjamin · 08-10-2008 02:23PM

yahoo_moe wrote: »

I don't think that's entirely fair - everything hasn't gone perfectly but he's wanted help (seemingly Grimandi in a more senior role) for some time now and he has yet to get it.

and he's yet to get it because it's up to him to hire whoever comes in. it's nigh on, what, 18 months now? it's just too easy to give excuses...

L'prof · 08-10-2008 03:03PM

Quazzie2002 wrote: »

Our main hope is the Champions League and to win that it seems we have to hope someone else knocks out the other PL teams in it.

yahoo_moe wrote: »

Yeah because we could never possibly hope to beat another Premier League team ever :rolleyes:

I think he's right in the fact that the Champons league is our only hope of silverware this season though, don't you? The only way, for me, that we can get the league back on track is by beating 2 out of United, Liverpool, Chelsea the first time we play them and that's a tall order! As for hoping we don't face Premiership teams in the Champions League, that's a bit harsh. I think we were very unlucky last season (and against Chelsea that year...Wayne Bridge :mad:) and I'm hoping that this season we can knock and English team out!

Galvasean · 08-10-2008 03:12PM

Sky Sports News wrote:

Indeed his only medal in the last three years has come with Spain - who he helped to the Euro 2008 title in the summer.

Erm, didn't Cesc get a Champions League silver in 2006 and Carling Cup silver in 2007?

L'prof · 08-10-2008 03:21PM

Galvasean wrote: »

Erm, didn't Cesc get a Champions League silver in 2006 and Carling Cup silver in 2007?

Yeah, but the only medal anyone cares about is a winners medal!

Dont Ban Me · 08-10-2008 03:52PM

Appently Aaron Ramsey is as talented at his age as Cesc was too!! Apparently, lets hope so and that he gets his chance in the team, with only Song and Denilson in front of him the competition aint that great!

yahoo_moe · 08-10-2008 04:34PM

leninbenjamin wrote: »

and he's yet to get it because it's up to him to hire whoever comes in. it's nigh on, what, 18 months now? it's just too easy to give excuses...

Maybe - but as I understood it, Arsene wanted Grimandi to come in in a purely football role but the board wanted some kind of combined role or something.

But I can't really remember how I thought it was going before Edelman's departure so I could just have it arseways.

Galvasean · 08-10-2008 10:04PM

A few of the young guns on way out:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/n/nottm_forest/7649361.stm

Pepe LeFrits · 08-10-2008 10:16PM

Rene Steer will also be leaving shortly.

Galvasean · 08-10-2008 10:17PM

I wonder will any of those Arsenal-Forrest players pplay against ireland B tomorrow..

Evil_Clown · 09-10-2008 02:41PM

It looks like the old International curse is back for another bout of arsenal crippling

Both van Persie and Gallas are out of their matches but the injuries do not seem that serious so hopefully ...........

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/08102008/1/van-persie-iceland-game.html

http://www.sportinglife.com/football/news/story_get.cgi?STORY_NAME=soccer/08/10/09/SOCCER_France.html&TEAMHD=soccer

Frisbee · 09-10-2008 02:43PM

Wouldnt mind both of them missing the first game back with Arsenal tbh.
Means Bendtner/Vela and Djourou could get a much needed start...

Evil_Clown · 10-10-2008 08:28AM

Frisbee wrote: »

Wouldnt mind both of them missing the first game back with Arsenal tbh.
Means Bendtner/Vela and Djourou could get a much needed start...

Maybe Gallas missing 1 or 2 games would be possibly a good thing(give Djourou a chance), but I think van persie is playing much better than Ade at the moment and I would rather see a van persie / Bendtner combination up front

Galvasean · 10-10-2008 11:57AM

Wouldn't mind seeing Ade miss a game or two. His performances havent been as good as they should be and he has that look of "I'm indispensable" about him.

Galvasean · 10-10-2008 12:03PM

Anyone catch the England legends v Arsenal legends game on Setanta yesterday?
We were pretty well represented. For Ireland there was Frank Stapleton, Niall Quinn and Eddie McGoldrick.
For england Paul Merson, Nigel Winterburn, Ray Parlour and David Platt.

OPENROAD · 10-10-2008 06:53PM

Galvasean wrote: »

Anyone catch the England legends v Arsenal legends game on Setanta yesterday?
We were pretty well represented. For Ireland there was Frank Stapleton, Niall Quinn and Eddie McGoldrick.
For england Paul Merson, Nigel Winterburn, Ray Parlour and David Platt.

Yup, was pretty good seeing the likes of Merse Winterburn and Parlour playing again,I celebrated Winterburns winning penalty like an Arsenal goal brilliant.

10-10-2008 07:23PM

Galvasean wrote: »

Anyone catch the England legends v Arsenal legends game on Setanta yesterday?
We were pretty well represented. For Ireland there was Frank Stapleton, Niall Quinn and Eddie McGoldrick.
For england Paul Merson, Nigel Winterburn, Ray Parlour and David Platt.

(off topic) these games are played in fantastic spirit imo. the spirit the game of football should be played in. barry fry is a thoroughly wonderful character and the last of his kind currently involved in the game.

merse/and parlour after putting on a few pounds but winterburn don't look as bad.

gallas being dropped wont do the team a bit of harm as he is muck these days. completly going missing for corners. toure not much better. i cant understand why djourou was dropped in the first place when you consider they kept 2 clean sheets the first two games when he played v wba and twente.

Galvasean · 10-10-2008 09:37PM

The question is will Wenger opt for Djourou or try out Silvestre?

OPENROAD · 10-10-2008 09:39PM

Galvasean wrote: »

The question is will Wenger opt for Djourou or try out Silvestre?

I have a feeling he will go for Silvestre, would like him to anyway.

Frisbee · 11-10-2008 12:17AM

Evil_Clown wrote: »

Maybe Gallas missing 1 or 2 games would be possibly a good thing(give Djourou a chance), but I think van persie is playing much better than Ade at the moment and I would rather see a van persie / Bendtner combination up front

Yeah RVP is playing better, but you just know Ade is gonna be awkward and not get injured all season...

estebancambias · 12-10-2008 12:10PM

Arsenal are heavily keeping tracks on James McCarthy apparently. Probably will cost more than Ramsey though so I'm not sure if it will happen. I'd say Bayern Munich or Barca is more likely or perhaps an upper-mid table team where he can use as a launching pad.

eZe^ · 12-10-2008 12:25PM

Apologies about Hleb asking Fabregas to join him at Barca, it was a little embarassing. I wouldn't worry about it anyway, Fabregas is the last player Barca need when they have Iniesta and Xavi...

OPENROAD · 12-10-2008 07:45PM

estebancambias wrote: »

Arsenal are heavily keeping tracks on James McCarthy apparently. Probably will cost more than Ramsey though so I'm not sure if it will happen. I'd say Bayern Munich or Barca is more likely or perhaps an upper-mid table team where he can use as a launching pad.

What source? Why would you say he could go to Barcelona? Is he that good?

estebancambias · 12-10-2008 07:58PM

He's NOT Lionel Messi style good. But he has great football intelligence. He probably has the same style as Ramsey so it comes down to which one nurtures their ability and progesses the best. He is the real deal. Liverpool offered 1 million for him which I'm not sure if he refused himself saying he wasn't ready to move on.

http://www.premiershiplatest.com/news/liverpool-boss-benitez-impressed-with-16-55824.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/h/hamilton_academical/6638285.stm

Barcelona according to his manager Billy Reid have wanted to take him over ever since they first got news of him.

Palermo apparently offered 6 million pounds during the summer for him.

Of course with anything a player of his age could only just be potential but at this time he's got a hell of a lot of potential.

I could actually see him being very like Esteban Cambiasso. I seen him play German for Ireland u-17's I think and he was by far the most composed player on the pitch, got two as well in a victory.

eZe^ · 12-10-2008 08:06PM

estebancambias wrote: »

Esteban Cambiasso

You-Esteban Cambiasso style, or Esteban Cambiasso-Esteban Cambiasso style? :pac::pac:

Galvasean · 12-10-2008 08:10PM

I suppose its only natural that any great young prospect would be linked with us.
Would be nice to have a green gunner once again. (a good one)

Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

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