Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 12:28AM

Is Arbeloa only average? He's a European Champion with only Sergio Ramos, arguably the world's best right-back, ahead of him for the national side. He kept Leo Messi in his pocket in his debut match, even though he was deployed at left-back.

He's not great going forward, but he can definitely do a top job defensively.

Is Degen average? I really don't know. I haven't seen him play. His previous record, his fee and reports don't bode particularly well, but there are plenty of occasions where players have been plucked from obscurity by a top club and prospered. Rafa has a great track record with defensive signings. Who had heard of Skrtl or Arbeloa before they signed? Or to go back even further, who had heard of Henchoz, Hyypia or Riise? Give the lad a chance.

Boggles · 20-08-2008 12:49AM

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Is Arbeloa only average? He's a European Champion with only Sergio Ramos, arguably the world's best right-back, ahead of him for the national side.

He is a European Champion but come on? Ramos is muck in my opinion. Defenders first job is always to defend, something Ramos is terrible at.

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

He kept Leo Messi in his pocket in his debut match, even though he was deployed at left-back.

From memory it was Riise who man marked Messi that night.

Melion · 20-08-2008 12:53AM

Boggles wrote: »

He is a European Champion but come on? Ramos is muck in my opinion. Defenders first job is always to defend, something Ramos is terrible at.

From memory it was Riise who man marked Messi that night.

Ramos was the best defender in Spain last year, was Spains best defender during the summer. Get off Eamonn Dunphy's cóck and actually watch football.

It wasnt Riise, it was Arbeloa who marked Messi out of the game.

el rabitos · 20-08-2008 12:54AM

personally i dont rate arbeloa, as said i think he can do a job for us in a given game and he'd be a fine john o'shea type player to have who can play anywhere across the back when we're in need. but to rely on him as the first choice right back? not for me, i dont see it. good defensively, very average going forward.

only rafa and his staff really know what level of fitness and what they think finnan has left in the tank, but if it was me and based on what we've got in the position i'd hold onto finnan for another year and see if arbeloa pushes on and improves (he's still only 22) or see if we can sign an improvement next summer.

i'm hoping degen suprises us, he hasn't had a good run without injurys in a year or so by the looks of things so hopefully he can get a run together. we dont need an aurelio on the right

either way its a postion we could improve on. but lack of money and all...

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 12:55AM

Boggles wrote: »

He is a European Champion but come on? Ramos is muck in my opinion. Defenders first job is always to defend, something Ramos is terrible at.

I'm not going to argue with someone who doesn't agree Ramos is amongst the top full-backs in the world.

From memory it was Riise who man marked Messi that night.

Riise was in midfield. Finnan was right-back, Arbeloa was left-back. Rafa's thinking was to play Arbeloa at left-back because the fit-again Messi would be cutting inside from the right.

Quality post as always though boggles.

Boggles · 20-08-2008 12:58AM

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Riise was in midfield. Finnan was right-back, Arbeloa was left-back. Rafa's thinking was to play Arbeloa at left-back because the fit-again Messi would be cutting inside from the right.

Quality post as always though boggles.

Do you get all your information from Wikipedia?

Melion · 20-08-2008 12:59AM

el rabitos wrote: »

see if arbeloa pushes on and improves (he's still only 22) or see if we can sign an improvement next summer.

Arbeloa is 25

Melion · 20-08-2008 12:59AM

Boggles wrote: »

Do you get all your information from Wikipedia?

Just for once, admit you were wrong

Tusky · 20-08-2008 01:01AM

Arbeloa is good but Id prefer he was our back up rather than first choice. Hes not nearly as good as the likes of Cole, Bossingwa, Evra, Clichy or Sagna, and thats the level we should be aiming at.

el rabitos · 20-08-2008 01:02AM

Melion wrote: »

Arbeloa is 25

****, my bad. dunno why i thought he was 22. looks like he's as good as he's getting so

Melion · 20-08-2008 01:05AM

He's solid. The only improvements on him in the premiership would be Richards and Sagna and i dont see either of them being sold to us. Im quite happy to have Arbeloa as our first choice RB.

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 01:06AM

Boggles wrote: »

Do you get all your information from Wikipedia?

Nope, it was well commented on around the time of the game. Arbeloa was signed as a right-back, and it was one of Rafa's tactical shocks when the line-ups came out.

Do you get all your erroneous information from voices in your head?

zAbbo · 20-08-2008 01:09AM

Boggles wrote: »

Do you get all your information from Wikipedia?

I'd say most Liverpool fans would know that in Arbeloa's full debut in the Nou Camp he was asked to play LB to counter Messi cutting inside.

For someone with such an unhealty interest in LFC, I'd expect you to know that 'from memory'

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 01:12AM

Arbeloa is good but Id prefer he was our back up rather than first choice. Hes not nearly as good as the likes of Cole, Bossingwa, Evra, Clichy or Sagna, and thats the level we should be aiming at.

Out of that list, I'd only have Evra, Clichy or Sagna ahead of Arbeloa. Cole is hugely inconsistent and seems to be coasting on a reputation established at Arsenal - when he emerged at a time when English left-sided players were rarer than hen's teeth. I know nothing about Boswinga only that Chelsea payed a huge amount for him, but also that Scolari favoured Ferreira to him with Portugal.

At the end of the day, Arbeloa is employed to do one job only - defend. He does this job very well, and Liverpool fans can have no complaints with this respect. This year, Rafa has clearly indicated that he wants more width from his full-backs. I can't picture Arbeloa flying up and down the touchline, but then I don't know. In games were an attacking full-back is needed, I'd imagine we'll see Degen get a run out.

Boggles · 20-08-2008 01:14AM

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Riise was in midfield. Finnan was right-back, Arbeloa was left-back.

Riise played ahead of Arbeloa on the left, there was no great tactics whatever Wikipedia would have you believe, Rafa put 2 defenders on Messi that is all.

Melion wrote: »

Just for once, admit you were wrong

What "wrong" would you like me to admit?

zAbbo wrote: »

For someone with such an unhealty interest in LFC, I'd expect you to know that 'from memory'

Are you suggesting there is something wrong with people who have an interest in Liverpool football club?

Jazzy · 20-08-2008 01:18AM

lol boggles. bless ya. are you really that bored that you just make things up now? or is that just one of those OPINIONS that you keep going on about

i wouldnt bother getting rid of finnan. we wouldnt get enough to make it worth while as i dont think degen would be up for it. the sub right back for switzerland? cant be that good then.

Reira good or bad? havent seen too much of him tbh

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 01:20AM

Boggles wrote: »

Riise played ahead of Arbeloa on the left, there was no great tactics whatever Wikipedia would have you believe, Rafa put 2 defenders on Messi that is all.

Err, you're wrong. We took the game to Barcelona, and Riise was playing as a left-winger. He was involved in a lot of our attacking play that night - not least his goal. Not many opposition full-backs find themselves in the home-team's penalty area at Nou Camp, do they?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/europe/6371395.stm

There's a match report I googled. It gives you a little sense of the mentality and the football we were playing that night, including Riise's involvement in our attacks - with nary a mention of Messi being double-marked.

Melion · 20-08-2008 01:20AM

Boggles wrote: »

What "wrong" would you like me to admit?

That Arbeloa played at left back, not Riise.

Boggles · 20-08-2008 01:20AM

Jazzy wrote: »

lol boggles. bless ya. are you really that bored that you just make things up now?

What have I made up?

Melion wrote: »

That Arbeloa played at left back, not Riise.

Jesus Christ, where did I say that?

Boggles · 20-08-2008 01:24AM

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Err, you're wrong. We took the game to Barcelona, and Riise was playing as a left-winger. H

How exactly am I wrong?? That's exactly where I said Riise was playing.

mayordenis · 20-08-2008 01:30AM

Boggles wrote: »

How exactly am I wrong?? That's exactly where I said Riise was playing.

you said from memory riise was marking messi, and now you say that you were implying riise was playing on the wing,
wingers don't mark wingers, never have, never will.

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 01:30AM

Boggles wrote: »

How exactly am I wrong?? That's exactly where I said Riise was playing.

So, to be clear:

Arbeloa was at left-back, marking Messi. Riise was deployed as a left-winger, and wasn't instructed to double-mark Messi.

That's not to say he didn't track back when Liverpool weren't in possession, but he was not employed to double-mark Messi in any way, shape or form.

Is that what you mean? Because that's what happened on the night. I can remember the game clear as day, as many other 'pool fans can, I am sure.

zAbbo · 20-08-2008 01:30AM

Boggles wrote: »

Where exactly am I wrong?? That's exactly where I said Riise was playing.

Sigh, the bit where you said Riise man marked Messi, despite them both playing high up the pitch on the left...so about 40 yards between Riise and Messi.

'From Memory' you'd know that we attacked a frail Barcelona team that night, with Riise given the licence to bomb forward, while Alvara picked up Messi.

And Messi did threaten, just not out wide - he was forced inside where Sissoko was given the role to pick up players moving between midfield and defence.

Boggles wrote:

Are you suggesting there is something wrong with people who have an interest in Liverpool football club?

No, just those with an unhealthy interest, while consistently talking through their hoop :pac:

Boggles · 20-08-2008 01:36AM

zAbbo wrote: »

Sigh, the bit where you said Riise man marked Messi, despite them both playing high up the pitch on the left...so about 40 yards between Riise and Messi.

Messi played on the right that night, by yer own admission Arbeloa played on the left, so how was he marking Messi if he was at the other side of the pitch?:rolleyes:

But then again I watched the match, something you obviously didn't do, or you would have know that right?

mayordenis wrote: »

you said from memory riise was marking messi, and now you say that you were implying riise was playing on the wing,
wingers don't mark wingers, never have, never will.

Wingers should always pick up the runs of opposing wingers.

zAbbo · 20-08-2008 01:39AM

Yup, Obviously Messi played on the right, I think you've misunderstood me there, Messi played high up on our left (his right)

I did watch the game (twice

)

Do you still think Riise man marked Messi, just so we're clear?

Melion · 20-08-2008 01:39AM

Boggles wrote: »

Messi played on the right that night, by yer own admission Arbeloa played on the left, so how was he marking Messi if he was at the other side of the pitch?:rolleyes:

But then again I watched the match, something you obviously didn't do, or you would have know that right?

Oh dear god

el rabitos · 20-08-2008 01:40AM

Boggles wrote: »

Messi played on the right that night, by yer own admission Arbeloa played on the left, so how was he marking Messi if he was at the other side of the pitch?:rolleyes:

But then again I watched the match, something you obviously didn't do, or you would have know that right?

barca's right is liverpools left.

but then again you watc.....oh

Dont be at yourself · 20-08-2008 01:40AM

Boggles wrote: »

Messi played on the right that night, by yer own admission Arbeloa played on the left, so how was he marking Messi if he was at the other side of the pitch?:rolleyes:

But then again I watched the match, something you obviously didn't do, or you would have know that right?

Haha! This is the best quote ever.

Arbeloa played on Liverpool's left. Messi played on Barcelona's right. They attacked opposite ends of the pitch. Now, I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure that Liverpool's left-side would line up against Barcelona's right. Not only that, but Liverpool's defence would line-up against Barcelona's attack, and vice-versa.

So, mystery solved. Riise was the other end of the pitch to Messi, who was instead in Arbeloa's pocket.

Do you need a diagram?

Jazzy · 20-08-2008 01:43AM

Boggles wrote: »

Messi played on the right that night, by yer own admission Arbeloa played on the left, so how was he marking Messi if he was at the other side of the pitch?:rolleyes:

cos teams line up like this:

GK

-RB----CB

CB

LB

CM

RWF

AMF

LWF

FW

LWF

AMF

RWF

CM

-LB

CB

RB---

GK

and yes Boggles, those cows appear small because they are far away....

Tusky · 20-08-2008 01:45AM

Boggles wrote: »

Messi played on the right that night, by yer own admission Arbeloa played on the left, so how was he marking Messi if he was at the other side of the pitch?:rolleyes:

w00t, that is sig worthy. Somebody should really stick that in their signature.

hahahaha

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

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