The "free fees and books and stuff" thread.

Firespinner wrote:

BTW I do not believe in any "right" to 3rd level education, I believe it is a privilage.

A privilage for those who can afford it.....

elmyra wrote:

Huh, me?!

Nope, Firespinner.

Firespinner wrote:

I just realised I forgot the "use the revenue to improve and raise the grant level" part.

How would that work exactly??

rainbow kirby wrote:

Nope, Firespinner.

whew. wondered there!

Ernie Ball wrote:

One might have more sympathy for UCD students if the average one didn't spend a small fortune every week on drink. Go out less and you'll find that the books become magically affordable.

I know: it's not in the culture, etc. etc. Maybe it's time that changed. Or do you expect the taxpayers to subsidise your partying indefinitely?

Sorry, this post just stuck out, so I'll deal with it first, then read the rest while I'm still a little irate.

You obviously have no idea what life is like for a lot of people if you can hold that opinion. When I go out, I drink water. Not because I'm adverse to alcohol, but because if I want to be able to afford my rent, food and transport, despite having a loan that I'll be paying off until I'm selling my soul for a mortgage and a keeping up a part time job. Now, the average student might have enough money to drink, but you're not dealing with averages in UCD - the range varies from the very wealthy to the not so well-off. So add everyone up and divide by 22,000 and sure, you might get a nice healthy average. But please do not condescend to tell me and those like me that if we spent less on alcohol we could easily afford books.

Elmyra, doll, I agree with you. The sad fact of the matter is that plenty of students in the current system are in debt simply to finance their college courses, without even thinking of repeating a year and the fees that that entails.

Dave, if you care so little then why are you cluttering up the system? That space could have been offered to someone else who didn't get in to your course on the relevant round and may currently be repeating their leaving. There's a difference between knowing you want to do something but aren't sure on the nitty gritty specifics of what you want to specialise in and just going to college for the sake of it because hey, it's "free" after all.

Pythia, I'm with Zane on this one. You live in the clouds if you think you're the norm. I earned about €6000 last year all things included - that's weekends, holidays, all the overtime I could get my hands on (which granted wasn't much). Take rent from that - I pay very little rent at €3,900 a year. That's €2,000 left for bills (Gas and ESB combined at roughly €75 each month is €900), transport (basic bus tickets for the year amount to €806 based on last year's prices, €858 this year), leaving about €300 for living expenses, books, clothes, food, socialising, presents for birthdays and christmas, emergencies, you know what I'm getting at. And I'm one of the lucky ones whose parents earn too much for me to get a grant. Plus I'm well off by comparison to plenty of students in UCD. You're lucky - but don't use yourself as the yardstick by which to judge everyone else. Throw fees in on top of that (note I didn't include the registration fee or Student Centre levy there, that's another grand in approximation) and I'm well out of the system. I might be misguided at times, but I deserve the opportunity to get an education as much as anybody else. As it stands there are people who have the capacity and desire for a third level education who don't get the opportunity.

I think we all need to get over this entitlement attitude that's rampant in our society and learn to be reasonable for once. We're not ENTITLED to anything. We happen to get a lot of things that we have subsequently learned to take for granted. That's not helping anyone. How about we all look at our lives and realise what we have to be thankful for? Regardless of who you are, if you see this post you have access to technology and are therefore better off than thousands of people who don't - you have the largest database of knowledge at your fingertips... and you're probably only using it to download music/porn. At least you can do that, eh? As much as I gripe about stuff, I appreciate the opportunities I've been given. I'm sure lots of you do too. But I somtimes think that some people just have it all handed to them too easily. Where's the satisfaction in that?

Blush_01 wrote:

Elmyra, doll, I agree with you.

Whoo, cool! You also said it better than I could! *wishes to be Blush's protege of sensibleness*

Yeah the fees are crazy, although I actually know a few people who pay the non-eu fees, I don't know how they manage it.

Blowfish wrote:

Yeah it's crazy, although I actually know a few people who pay the non-eu fees, I don't know how they manage it.

"Non-EU fees? That'll be one soul, and your first-born please!"

Yep! I was getting a bus home from my friend's house, who lives in Cabinteely.

/me breaks out in spontaneous applause for the most part at Blush's post at top of this page

I think you're being just a tad harsh on Dave though - yes, you could say he's cluttering the system a bit but if he can get the education he is, without having to pay the fees for it himself, I don't blame him for taking advantage of the chance.

My fees would be €4,870 this year, which I seriously doubt my family could afford, we're only just clear of the grant threshold as it is. I had planned in September to get a part-time job but when I ended up getting involved in the SU I pretty much sacrified a majority chunk of my free time so between having few weeknights free to offer to an employer, and having to go home to play organ for my local kids' choir in Meath, no employer will take me on the basis of being able to offer, at most, six hours a week on sporadic evenings.

Last year it wasn't an issue because I was on (cheaper) campus accommodation and a choral scholarship; but I decided not to go for the choral scholarship again, to do the different things that you can only do in college (radio, newspaper, societies...) - and couldn't get campus as I'm a second year. To make a long story short, where last year I gave most of my free time to the Choral Scholars and got paid for it, this year the SU gets most of it for nothing.

Don't get me wrong, I love the work that I do for the SU and wouldn't change it for the world - and I'd like to think I help other people get stuff done a lot better because of it. I really can't put into words the amazing time I've had in UCD this year, meeting so many new people and getting involved in so many things - it's really the prime of my life; I will rarely have things this good. But if fees had to come out of the family pockets I simply couldn't be here any more.

Pythia wrote:

I believe if fees came back, the Gov. should introduce a student loan which you could begin paying off once you leave college. The loan would cover your fees in college, if you needed to take it out.
I think this is reasonable.

Nice idea, but the rates would want to be really damn low and have the options of teeny repayments because we all know that some degrees can still leave you waiting a while for a job...

In fairness, people in Ireland are a lot more likely to stay close to home than people in other countries are.

Thanks for saying that for me, Blush - my nearest Uni from home is Maynooth. No chance I'm going there for a commerce education when there's a school with an international reputation like Quinn an hour away.

Two 3rd level Colleges in Carlow and neither have a single course I'm remotely interested in.

Ok, I am going to the closest 3rd level (well uni anyway) to me, and living at home , but if there was fees I still couldn't afford it.