Israel/Palestine Thread

Sorry @Paddy_Mag you seem to have missed my questions, any answers?

dmcdona, regarding my early AM post yesterday:

I see Haaretz published an article yesterday evening. So, journalists are catching on to what I think was a clever set-up…

“Israel also demanded explanations from Spain regarding flotilla activist Saif Abu Kashek,[Palestinian origin] a Spanish citizen whom the ministry said has ties to Hamas and was recently subjected to U.S. sanctions.” - Haaretz ⬇️

'Israel Rebukes Spain for 'Hypocrisy' Over Police Treatment of Deported Gaza Flotilla Activists'
'Israel's Foreign Ministry also criticized Spanish PM Pedro Sánchez and his ministers for not condemning the conduct of Spanish police nearly 24 hours after officers were allegedly seen using force against flotilla participants, while 'rushing to condemn Israel at every opportunity'
Liza Rozovsky and Reuters 06:30 PM • May 24 2026 I
https://www.haaretz.com/gaza/2026-05-24/ty-article/.premium/israel-rebukes-spain-over-police-treatment-of-deported-gaza-flotilla-activists/0000019e-5a5a-db4a-a9bf-ffdb53940000?fromLogin=success

“According to the ministry, Sunday's meeting was held on the instructions of Foreign Minister Gideon Sa'ar and led by the head of the ministry's political division, Ambassador Yossi Amrani. The ministry said the summons followed the publication of videos and images allegedly showing Spanish police using force against flotilla participants.

“During the meeting, Amrani accused the Spanish government of hypocrisy, saying Madrid sends "provocateurs" to Israel and later condemns Israel for enforcing what he described as a lawful naval blockade, while Spanish police themselves used force against the same activists.

“The Foreign Ministry also criticized Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez and his ministers for not condemning the conduct of Spanish police nearly 24 hours after the incidents, while "rushing to condemn Israel at every opportunity."

dmcdona, in short, there are still prominent Basque political parties that want independence / self-determination from Spain. I wrote that the Basque Police (Ertzaintza) answer directly to the Basque Government.

FYI, the historical origins of now disbanded ETA (once a proscribed terrorist group) are deeply rooted in the province of Biscay - capital Bilbao. They opposed Francisco Franco’s military dictatorship - violent similarities with Israeli National Zionist government’s policies against Palestinians. ETA started with a group of Bilbao university students (in secret).

Politics is dirty.

Sinn Fein would have to update a lot of the marketing materials lol

My point is the people of Gaza need to be freed from Hamas before there's any hope of peace.

So yes, absolutely free Palestine from Hamas, and then that puts Israel in an undefendable position (so long as the Palestinians don't elect or otherwise get taken over by another terrorist group).

The question you should be asking yourself is why did Israel support them, when the world and his wife knew what HAMAS were all about.

How is it naive or simplistic to want rid of a terrorist organisation? I'd love to know because I've never considered wanting rid of a terrorist organisation to a bad thing, be that Hamas, IRA, UVF etc etc

They all have no place in a peaceful society regardless of their origin, or am I wrong?

At best you're being naïve, at worst disingenuous about the situation in Gaza. You can casually throw around terrorist all you want but the fact is Hamas are the state in Gaza and no amount of American style binary politics will change the nuances.

Ive supported causes i believe in, 

Fair play to you. But do you not think it hypocritical when you label people doing that very same thing as "virtue signallers in ivory towers"?

You are trying to delegitimize people who are against mass murder of innocent people (mostly women and children), that all our governments are turning a blind eye to. Surely someone who supported causes they believed in couldn't be so cynical to be unable give a bit of respect to people supporting causes they believe in?

Im very anti Immigration in the way our government are going about it, as a father to three girls, one of whom has had a negative experience in the last year with one,

Id say v few people are pro the way the government is doing immigration. They are bumbling through this like they bumble through everything, Ill thought out policies, the same creaking infrastructure, no imagination, and just hoping everything will work out and spinning it all as positive.

I'm sorry for whatever happened to your daughter, immigrants can commit crimes and when they do, the guards have to deal with it, if they aren't the only recourse is to rail for more guards or better laws etc. That is a legal problem though, not a problem with all immigrants.

I'm sure you recognize many more immigrants doing important jobs here, our hospitals/ services/ creches/ private industry etc employ loads, working hard, paying taxes, and are doing terrific jobs, many volunteer also and involved in their communities. I'm sure plenty of them look after you and yours, do jobs for you etc.

That's the way of the world - our prosperity comes at a price of letting people in, and with the benefit that we can go other places, and plenty of us are abroad working hard (including some of our scumbags causing mayhem abroad as some immigrants do here). And I am not saying we are doing immigration right in Ireland.

As for Israel and Palestine, I dont condemn or condone what's happening. I dont support Israel and will never support a country that jails men for being gay or that tries to hinder women in society who are victims of rape.

I do find it mad you are against people coming in here but have no opinion on Israel invading their neighbors, ethically cleansing them (as is going on in the west bank). It's hypocritical, especially when you have the bandwidth to criticize Gazans on how they treat gay people or women. Why do you have an opinion of one group of people on this "war", but the others doing far worse get a let off from you? Starving everyone is f*ckin psychotic and evil, never mind blowing up a whole city of 2 million people, i couldn't care less what laws are there or not there on either side of the conflict.

You don't have to agree with everything Palestinian society does, you can still be against them being blown up, starved, and victims of a f*ckin genocide, which again is killing mostly women and children.

Women being indiscriminantly murdered and having medical/ natal care intenionally witheld is hindering them far more than any laws you don't like. Like all the other posters on here, youre against women being treated bad if people you don't like are doing it, but when people you support or doing it and far worse, you won't "condemn or condone it".

It’s a discussion forum, if you don’t want to discus things and only soapbox and grandstand maybe go for walk or something

It’s not hard to admit Hamas are a terrorist organisation

The first steps of addressing any problem is identifying root causes

And do you not understand that terrorism almost always exists in places of political strife, apartheid, war and societal breakdown?

How exactly did any of these terror groups you mention come to exist? Because the conditions were there to grow them right? How exactly did any of these terror groups disband or lose power? Because the conditions that led to their emergence changed - we have evidence of this in our own country.

Are you arguing this situation is different? That Israel's blockade, genocide, and ethnic cleansing operations have had nothing to do with the emergence of Hamas? Be interested to hear your take. If Israel didn't want Hamas, they first needed not to fund them (which they did), and secondly, they need to change the conditions that allow terrorists to emerge and hold power.

Destroying a whole city of 2 million people and trying to starve everyone in it isn't an anti terror campaign, nor is blowing up schools full of kids and hospitals full of patients - which Israel have done again and again. Nor is destroying all arable farmland, power and water pumping facilities. All war crimes and all evil.

Israel are happy to have Hamas in power - hence why they funded them and still haven't defeated them despite having the capability to do so- because that gives them cover for what they are doing, which is almost universally agreed by aid groups/ human rights orgs / international investigators, as a genocide.

And the gullible (or supportive) are lapping it up and defending it.