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M6 - Galway City Ring Road [planning decision pending]

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 755 ✭✭✭GBXI


    Is it down to inept politicians or is it down to our terribly over-centralized governance, where the city council just reverts to central government on nearly everything and struggles to develop its own revenue?

    The ring road itself has been handled embarrassingly by the public servants responsible for it but as you say the lack of development regarding transport in and around Galway City is just as big. Improvements to roads, footpaths, cycle infrastructure, pedestrianization, and public transport (especially bus lanes) are so minimal as to be criminally negligent.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭Juran


    New Merlin park hospital plans scrapped.

    No Galway ring road 20+ years later from the start of 'planning'.

    No new Galway public transport infrastructure since the foundation of the state .. just a few more buses added to the higgldy-piggldy roads which are the same roads my great grandparents travelled on by donkey and cart (western distributor rd and Quinncentinnial bridge from scratch are the only 2 I can name being built in 100+ years).

    Its 2026, Galway and the West of Ireland generate a huge amount of corporate tax thanks to our medical device and IT industry, and smaller pharma & finance/insurance companies. Add in the global & EU innovation and research funding plus the significant student fees the 2 big Galway universities recieve from non-EU countries like China, India, US, south america. Add in all the other critical businesses in the Galway area - Ros a Mhil harbour, Marine Insitute Oranmore, biggest University hospital in the west / north-west region and its centre of excellence for cardiac care, Major tourist destination Connemara & Galway city, the biggest Gaeltacht in Irish hosting thousands of students learning Irish in the summer and school breaks .. and I'm probably forgetting loads of other major businesses. But yet, no matter how much Galway contributes to the economy, we seems to have no say in our infrastructure requirments, and we seems to have no voice.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,296 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    Every local authority gets a say in its infrastructure requirements. That’s how it works. The authorities work out what they need, then they and their TDs lobby the minister for Finance for funding to get the projects into TII’s delivery programme.

    If you don’t ask, you won’t get. The central government doesn’t decide that Galway will have a ring-road, or Cork needs a Light Rail; it asks the local government to go and figure out what they want, and then it makes a decision on which of those proposals should go forward. Galway’s public transport is **** because the council has never asked for any money to make it better. The only thing they’ve pushed for is this road. What’s worse is that when the road plan was knocked back the first time, Galway was left “short” by about €600 million in the national game of infrastructure investments. That put them in a perfect position to get cash to improve public transport in the meantime while they reviewed the road submission, but they didn’t do it.

    From the outside it really looks that the people in charge at Galway City Council are fixated on this road project, and are unwilling to even ask for funding for anything else transport related, for fear that it would jeopardise the road. This is the road which their own analysis says will make traffic worse in the city, by the way… Forgive me if I think that it’s not about traffic at all, but that it’s about securing a once-off income windfall from developer levies.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Consonata


    Merlin Park isn't scrapped, it's still going ahead.

    No New public transport in Galway lies squarely at the hands of GCC not actually entertaining any transport proposal that isn't the Road.

    Given the road only benefits around 4% of commuters in Galway, its not surprising that it has been shelved repeatedly



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭Juran




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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Galway got its bypass. It is called the M17. Unfortunately, it was built too far east.

    They should recognise this and look for a Luas service from Claregalway to City Centre(along the old N17 or asjacent), and from Oranmore to Knocknacara (along the N6 and WDR).

    With appropriate P&R, this would solve the traffic particularly if some one-way routings and bus lanes and cycle infrastructure.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭Dr Robert


    That wouldn't solve traffic coming from Clifden, Oughterard, Moycullen, Spidéal, Barna and beyond.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Not much comes from that direction, so is not part of the problem.

    If the rest of the traffic evaporates to some amount, then the whole congestion will be on the way to solution. Sorting the N6 junction to be free flow and a new bridge over the Corrib, and things will flow.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭Juran


    Try sitting in Bearna, Knocknacarra, Sathill between 7.30am and 9am and again between 4pm and 7pm and you'll see the thousands of cars who are coming & going west every day.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭Dr Robert


    "Not much comes from that direction"

    No offence, but you haven't a clue if you are saying that.

    It wouldn't surprise me if you didn't even live in Galway.



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  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 11,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Most likely Sam is going off this data that was provided by the council as part of the ring road planning application.

    Screenshot_23-2-2026_221816_www.pleanala.ie.jpeg

    14% of traffic would pretty much be right slap bang in the middle of what I would consider "not much".



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 785 ✭✭✭topcat77


    It's funny that the graph % adds up to 101%



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 11,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Yeah, it's quite common when they start rounding stuff. I'd disagree with it, as it does result in people questioning it a little, and as it's only ever 1%, they should just make it fit.

    Post edited by CatInABox on


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    If the N6 (Botha na dTreabh) had all its junctions free flow, and the Coolagh roundabout was also free flow, then the only problem is at Terryland, where a new bridge linking directly with the Western Distributor Road. That would constitute a bypass for the city. Listen to the traffic in the morning - (…..Tuam Road from Thhree Mile Ditch ….'). - no mention of Headford Rd.

    Put the Luas lines in as I suggested, then there would be plenty of room for the 14% who come from the western side of the city and county.

    By the way, I do not currently live in the city, but I did for many, many years and have family who do. I do know Galway.

    I am familiar with the City Council removing traffic lights to replace them with a roundabout, only a few years later to remove the roundabout and replace it with traffic lights. They installed a one-way system to enable bridgeworks at Lough Atalia Rd and College Road that improved traffic flow, only to remove it after the work finished. They could not even put a cycle lane along the Salthill Prom because it removed free parking. All traffic problems will be solved by building a road that will make the system worse, and nothing is to be done until it is built (in about a decade). They do not have a clue.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    The Luas lines I suggested would make a huge difference, particularly if P&R is built.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,278 ✭✭✭Paddico




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,851 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    The M17 was never a Galway bypass or designed as such. What a nonsense statement.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    It was a bypass of Galway built too far east. Why did they call it the M17 instead of the M18?

    It is at least 10km too far east. It should be near Oranmore and Claregalway.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,851 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    It was never a bypass of Galway City. The traffic that uses it would never have had to go into Galway City via the roads it took the majority of the traffic off.

    It is a significant and useful piece of infrastructure (and will be better if the full corridor gets to that grade) but a bypass of Galway City, it was never designed as.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 352 ✭✭gilly1910


    I don't think the cycle lane along the prom was the problem, it was the absolute lunacy of making the road one way from Blackrock out to the Barna Road. Whoever came up with that idea obviously hasn't a clue, and should never be allowed to make another suggestion in relation to improving Galway's traffic, which in fairness is probably beyond improving at this stage!!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 202 ✭✭jimbob955


    I'm from Cork and I have only had the pleasure of experiencing Galway traffic a couple of times in my life.

    As an outsider I just can't understand why a ring road has not been built. It of course will not solve all of Galway's woes but surely will help traffic flow from west to east, and give people an option of getting around the city easier. Are the same local councillors being voted in year on year. Is Galway traffic a big local election issue? Would it get air time on local radio?

    Coming from a Cork perspecive. We are getting a watered down Bus Connects (when I dunno!). Cork Luas (2056) and the Cork Area commuter rail project - which is actually happening. More train stations, P&Rs, double tracking.

    Would this work in Galway? Double tracking, more frequency trains, new train stations between Oranmore and the city?

    What about focusing AT and PT measures around the colleges and big business parks first?

    Is there even a plan for Galway transport?

    @Juran you have listed Galways impressive contribution to the local, regional, national economy and Galway doesnt seem to be getting much back.

    It is the same in Cork to a lesser extent. The M28 should have been built to Ringaskiddy 25 years ago (for all the massive pharma companies). The North Ring Road should have been built 40 years ago for Apple. Where is all the money going? Is it too much Dublin/commuter belt county focused? Or has it been spent in the wrong place like a bypass of a random rural town?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,296 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    I take your point about N28, but let’s not get too revisionist about Apple: until about 15 years ago, Apple was nothing more a second-tier computer manufacturer that frequently brushed with bankruptcy (the infamous €14 bn deal came out of one of those crises: Apple was seriously considering shutting Cork down and sourcing the little European product they sold from Singapore, and so the Irish government extended their exporter credits in order to preserve jobs at Cork). There’s no way in hell an extraordinarily expensive project like M40 would have been put in place for one single ailing computer company in Knocknaheeney: the big investments at the time went into N25 and South Ring, where Cork’s big industrial employers were.

    (I worked for Apple for many years around the turn of the century, I still live in Cork).

    But the whole argument is bogus. Infrastructure is based on need, not on “contributions”. Dublin gets the most money because it and its hinterland holds about half the country’s whole population. Also, if you start weighing up “contributions”, then Leinster is actually subsidising the rest of the country.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭hans aus dtschl


    That's not fully accurate. I previously regularly used N6 as far as Headford Road and (more often) N83. I now use M18 and then M17. M17/18 have taken me off the N6 and I am not part of Galway commuter traffic.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭hans aus dtschl


    For a Cork-based perspective, how is the N40 working out on a daily basis? It is a perfect example of a ring road.

    JLT completion date was 1999, completing the N40.

    KRR needed an upgrade in 2005.

    DKI needed an upgrade in 2006 (signalisation).

    SRR needed an upgrade (began in 2011)

    BRR needed an upgrade in (began in 2011).

    The DKI needed an upgrade in (began 2011, finally completed in 2024). The DKI will likely need another upgrade soon to deal with the Dublin-to-Tunnel and Midleton-to-Tunnel rat running shutting down the Little Island West and Tivoli interchanges at peak times.

    The N40 is realistically THE reason there's been no upgrades to Northern Distributor or Bypass roads you're mentioning.

    A ring road is lot of investment in one single mode of transport on one single route. We think of it like a project with an end date, but if you build a "ring road" you're realistically locking yourself into decades of investment with reasonably unpredictable and undesirable mode share outcomes. Locking yourself into unsustainable development and travel patterns.

    I reckon Galway could do with an East-West bypass alright though to allow the N6 to perform full distributor duties. Segregate both functions. I keep saying this on the thread. We need investment for Galway commuters and also for people wanting to bypass Galway. The problem is they keep pushing for a ring road instead.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭Dr Robert


    It was bizarre. Not the first I've read.

    It's easy to say stuff that isn't true when you don't even live in the place.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,574 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    It's kinda the point though. It should have been a proper bypass but was built too far east. So while it still fulfills the objective of allowing people travel North-South (e.g. Limerick-Sligo) and not go into the city, it doesn't facilitate people living closer to the city bypassing it going in those directions.
    The point in relation to this ring road is that it is also not a bypass because we don't have the traffic demand to necessitate a bypass going East-West (that's not my opinion, it's the official findings of the report(s)). Part of the reason the whole proposal is such a weird mess of a thing



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,457 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    They made that suggestion i.e the Galway City Roads Engineering Dept - so that their proposal could be sunk. They didn't want to do it. They made an offer that they wanted to be refused!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,457 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    The first P&R is going to planning, don't think it will be used as a P&R much based on the planned BusConnects Network for the City. Will be used for parking for the nearby CAR Magnet that is the Galway City Council run Cappagh Park / KnocknaCarra Community Centre though.
    https://www.connachttribune.ie/news/concerns-raised-over-proposed-park-and-ride-without-bus-lanes-5595614



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Another example of GCC proposing something that is useless and so will be refused, or not used as specified.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,492 ✭✭✭Unrealistic


    I think this is the opposite. In the case of the Salthill cycle path the city management staff were insulted that the Councillors had the cheek propose something themselves rather than just adopting proposals made by the engineers. So the staff torpedoed it through very effective malicious compliance. When it became clear two way traffic could not be maintained on the narrower stretch between Blackrock and the junction with Kingston Road, the Councillors went back to the staff and asked to just run the cycle path from Grattan Road to Black Rock instead. The staff responded that they could not do this because the vote in the Council meeting had been for Grattan Road to the Kingston Road junction. They said the only way to change it would be for the Councillors to schedule another vote, which would set the process back at least 6 months. I heard one Councillor say at the time that he had lost count of the amount of times the Council staff ignored a vote of the Councillors, saying what they had voted for was not feasible, and implementing a watered down version instead. But in this case the staff were adamant it was all or nothing, and no watering down could take place. It was widely understood that this was done to create the public backlash that inevitably ensued, so that the Councillors would be taught a lesson and would have to backtrack on the proposal.

    Today's Park & Ride proposal strikes me as the opposite. The Council management wants a carpark in Cappagh Park for users of the park but that would have to be funded from its own operational budget. However, if it positions it as a Park & Ride facility, even if the actual usage is going to be the opposite, then they can bring the NTA on board to fund it.



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