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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,117 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I would lean towards Crowley over Byrne regardless (I'm not as sold on him at 10 as others), but he just doesn't provide enough cover on a 6-2 bench.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    No reaction to the Stockdale selection, after all your gnashing of teeth anytime someone suggested Lowe should be dropped over the last few weeks?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    It’s all down to if Ireland can stay in the game up until around the 60th minute. The last 20 is traditionally when France are at their most exposed, the hope is it’s not like last year when the game is essentially over at that point.


    During the autumn France led by 4, 6 and 1 point in all 3 games at this point in the game so it’s certainly doable, then it’s up to the bench to provide impact.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,368 ✭✭✭MarinersBlues


    Terrible bait, ill bite:

    If you are going for place if birth

    1 from Connacht - 1 starter - captain



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Crowley can't even control a game at home against Castres at the moment. 

    Whatever about his form, this is way over-stating it (and smacks of punching-down, tbh).

    Crowley had some good moments during phase play; his biggest issue that day by far was his kicking from the tee.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,503 ✭✭✭almostover


    I'm happy with that squad selection overall. Would loved to have seen Edogbo bench over Timoney, he would have brought a bit of raw power in the final 20mins. But that's nit picking.

    Farrell has selected on form here anyway, can be no complaints on that front. Lowe dropped, Stockdale starting is evidence of this. Scrum is going to be huge, a lot rests on that front row. It's likely we would want less kicking in the game with this selection, more ball in hand time. Less set pieces etc. Let's see if that will work out.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,117 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    How can I punch down on an international rugby player from my desk?

    His biggest issue was kicking from the tee, but his kicking from hand is also quite poor at the moment and his good moments in phase play are generally individual moments - I just do not think he is good at imposing structure on an attack. Interestingly, ROG called him a "12 playing 10" on the Rugby Pod this week and I think it captures his play quite well. I think he is a great rugby player still.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 578 ✭✭✭mogwai81


    Any idea when the French team is due to be announced?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 121 ✭✭slowway20206




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭typhoony


    I'd be concerned about Furlong's future, he would still have a role to play in the next RWC but i have a gut feeling he might have to retire before then.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭realhorrorshow


    Perhaps they plan to sub Beirne and want to avoid having Edogbo and McCarthy in the second row together. If there's an injury, I think Beirne/Ryan is better balanced than Edogbo/McCarthy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,165 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    Stockdale's try scoring record is so impressive, 19 in 40 internationals. I really hope he has a good game and can establish himself as first choice.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 309 ✭✭big-al


    it has the record try scorer and former player of the tournament in it.


    O’Brien is in form also.


    so no.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,687 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    I heard that quote yesterday, and thought it was an excellent summary of what a lot of people have been saying about Jack Crowley's flaws for a very long time.

    The most concerning thing is this part of his game just hasn't improved at all. He should really be pushing on now - he played 1,200+ mins for Munster back in 22/23, and has a clear grip on the jersey. He's 26 now - but it feels like he's still good at the things he was good at 4 years ago and just hasn't improved at running an attack.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    "Can't even control a game at home against Castres at the moment" as if any old 10 with an ounce of ability should be able to do it without thinking…

    It's way over-stating it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,776 ✭✭✭All_in_Flynn


    VDF is starting but agree no Lowe is a big call.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,797 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    6-2 split for the French too

    FRANCE: 

    Thomas Ramos; Théo Attissogbe, Nicolas Depoortere, Yoram Moefana, Louis Bielle-Biarrey; Matthieu Jalibert, Antoine Dupont (capt); Jean-Baptiste Gros, Julien Marchand, Dorian Aldegheri; Charles Ollivon, Michael Guillard, Francois Cros, Oscar Jegou, Anthony Jelonch

    Replacements:

    Peato Mauvaka, Rodrigue Neti, Régis Montagne, Hugo Auradou, Emmanuel Meafou, Lenni Nouchi, Baptiste Serin, Kalvin Gourgues.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,687 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Really spicy backline with lots of quality and pace. Jalibert has been the best 10 in the world this season IMO, and Dupont back is probably worth 10+ points to them on his own.

    Would hope we can drag them into a dogfight up front though. They've picked three tacklers and jacklers in the back row in Cros, Jegou and Jelonch, so obviously hoping the two locks (each of whom are very comfortable in the back row too) will do the bulk of the tight carrying.



  • Administrators Posts: 56,313 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    It only seems like a big call if you ignore how he's been playing.

    Lowe has been pretty average for quite some time now and being dropped entirely is not undeserved.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 197 ✭✭longjohn200




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,231 ✭✭✭TRC10


    Are we really pretending that picking Stockdale on the wing, who turns 30 in a couple of months, is some ballsy selection? For all the chat about his form, he's only scored in one game this season. He's also failed to score in his last 5 Ireland caps, all of which were against tier 2 nations. He's only there because he can boot the leather off the ball, same as Osborne. If we were really looking to attack, we'd have put Stockdale at 15 (where he's actually been playing this season) and Ward or Kenny on the wing. Osborne offers zero counter-attacking threat or playmaking ability from 15. And Farrell is still doing nothing about our aging midfield. We're probably looking at JGP playing 80.

    We'd be less f*cked at LH had Farrell not insisted on playing Porter for 70+ minutes every game for the last 4 years. Cian Prendergast starting at 6 I actually do rate, but I feel we've missed out on the one-two punch of having McCarthy play 50 minutes before unleashing Edogbo.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,496 ✭✭✭P.Walnuts


    Our current LH issue has absolutely nothing to do with Porters minutes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,165 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    He is the same guy that if you look at our top ten all time try scorers - has the best scoring average per game.

    He hasnt had a decent run of games in years, he deserves a shot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    Like I stated earlier, it’s not the biggest French pack we’ve seen, the biggest forward they have is Mikkel Guillard.

    Like someone else stated, they have a lot of jacklers and guys who can tackle in that back five, maybe that signals their approach this this game.


    The big aim for Ireland is to stay in the contest for as long as possible, Ireland definitely have an overall edge on the bench compared to France who have a very young and inexperienced one, it’s unlikely to go the way last year did where their bench murdered Ireland between minute 48 and minute 60.


    Its hard to feel optimistic going into this game given all the chatter but ultimately I think there is an element of unknown going into it as both teams had so-so autumns & CC campaigns so far.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 416 ✭✭roverjoyce


    Does the acceptance of JVDF in the team really sum up the lack of talent coming through in Ireland, Timoney is 30 with 6 caps and Conan is 33

    Turning 33 this year can anybody say the last really good performance he has had

    Look at England's with Pepper and Pollock now blooded internationals at aged 21 and 23

    Curry Earl Underhill are then only 28/29



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,231 ✭✭✭TRC10


    VDF has been in really good form this season. No issue players in their 30s getting picked as long as they're playing well, which he is. Having said that, we should definitely be looking at a different option at 7 in at least 2 games. Be that Doris, Prendergast or Timoney. I feel like that's where they see Bryn Ward in the Irish setup long-term. We know Farrell prefers bigger units in the 7 jersey rather than old-school smaller build opensides.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,068 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    On Crowley's current game form I'd largely agree with this statement and dropping him. Not sure Prendergast is the man for the job either though, I'd sooner have put a Harry Byrne/Jake Flannery combo out there to see how they get on against the big boys.

    Beirne is a stranger call considering his recent destruction of Munster scorelines via silly yellow cards. I'd like to see his indiscipline punished at national level until he relearns the rules



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,029 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Delighted that Osborne is fit again and that we've someone slotting in at 15 with recent experience of playing there at test level. Would still rather him at 12 or 13, but needs must.

    A back three of TOB, Stockdale and he might be pretty adept at fielding contestables also. Could be a way for us to get into the game.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,928 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    VDF was man of the match only 1 month ago versus Munster in Thomond on Dec 27th.

    Choosing him as an example of players aging out is extremely weird. Hes one of the older guys that conssitently puts in high level performances in important games.

    As to your question, yes its a big issue across all four provinces that the havent produced a test level 7 in 10 years.

    After JDVF Leinster had Connors (more of a 6 and permainjured) and Penny (too small for test level rugby) as the only opensides to come through before you look into the academy.

    in munster Kendallen didnt progress from his U20s promise, and Hodnett is an honest, agricultural player, but not test level imo. Munster have also had to bolster their back rows with Cloete for 5 seasons. POM was always their next best 7 option.

    Ulster have bryn ward coming through, but is obviously still very young. Only timoney has been test level since chris henry retired. Its a pity Reuben Crothers retired cos i thought he might have had a real chance as his U20s form was impressive. Reidy got capped but couldnt progress.

    Connacht have some up and comers in Moose and SHL, but with Connors moving to Connacht teh futher of SHL is in doubt.

    there really hasnt been any decent openside to challange JVDF over the last 10 years.

    our 2nd and 3rd choice 7 have been players already within the back row squad.

    Farrell cannot magic these players out of thin air.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    The acceptance of JVDF in the team is largely because let me think he’s Ireland’s best 7…sometimes it’s best not looking for drama when there isn’t any.

    Okay thanks for the update on England, they are insufferable enough to listen to at the best times so it’s nice to have someone else bring up how amazing they are again!



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