Russia-Ukraine War (continuing)

Smart move by Ukraine to agree with it, they can now watch Russia stall or refuse to agree with it.

I would expect the US (as Ukraine's former no. 1 Western supporter and military ally - lol what a sad joke that is now with Trump) has plenty of experts embedded in country who are very interested in learning from what Ukraine and Russia are doing on the battlefield as it will obviously affect how their army approaches land warfare in future.

Maybe petty of me but kind of feel Ukraine should give the lot of them the bum's rush out if (or is it when - hope not?) Trump admin. cuts off intelligence support again and shuts down PURL programme to sell Ukraine weapons.

It was always going to be a **** deal for Ukraine to end this.

Still see Putin refusing or stalling.

He speaks as if Russia is a close friend and ally of the US.

Donesk and Lusank, for Kherson and Zappy would be okay trade off

Ending the war is most important and no 1 else has been trying bah bah...

This initiative is so flawed hand over millions of people and there homes from a democracy to a dictator police state, thats why no 1 wanted to offer this deal from the first day of the war or ever.

To say millions died because no one talked is wrong they, Ukrainians would still have died been displaced or made stateless.

Putin sacrificed a million + armed combatants on his side he would have less respect for a subservient Ukrainian he didn't care a jot for there suffering he reined on them.

Let us remember Israel wouldn't allow journalists into gaza Russia hasn't allowed any journalists into areas of Ukraine it controls.

Similarly Trump dosent care what putin does to living mortals, biden cared and most of europe so here giving everything or anything is a means to a bad end so choke on your thanksgiving.

Occupied southern Kherson and southern Zaporizhia have not been offered. Witkoff after a previous visit to Moscow suggested they were but that turned out to be untrue.

I dont trust him as far as I could throw him. He had business ties to the oligarchs according to press reports, and his parents were from Russia.

The fact Witkoff is being sent to Moscow is always a bad sign because he always comes out with these pro Russian statements and regarding propaganda like Ukraine bring a "made up country" and "I don't think hes a bad guy" (about Putin).

They will try to bounce Europe and Ukraine into accepting a sellout. Europe must stand firm.

CNN has more on what Witkoff told Putin.

A daughter of Jacob Zuma, South Africa’s disgraced former president, has been accused by her own sister of duping men into travelling to Russia, where they are forced to fight against Ukraine.

Nkosazana Zuma-Mncube, Mr Zuma’s oldest daughter, alleged that Duduzile Zuma-Sambudla, her half-sister, was one of three people involved in the recruitment of 17 South Africans trapped in occupied Ukraine.

When Jacob Zuma was South African president, there were complaints about "state capture" by giving control of parts of the economy to his supporters. Parallels with the rise of the Russian oligarchs under Yeltsin, most of whom later supported Putin. Some later fell out with Putin including Boris Berezovsky who was largely responsible for Yeltsin picking Putin as his successor and was later found dead in mysterious circumstances in London.

Putting your friends in control of sectors of the economy has become a modus-operandi of establishing authoritarian states. Fortunately Zuma was impeached.

In Hungary this model has been followed too. The ruling party now control most of the press, as the government made it hard for the opposition press to get advertising by restrictions and intimidation of businesses that they would be seen as enemies if they advertised with them. Then Fidez gave a huge loan to a consortium of cronies of the regime to buy out the collapsing media outlets.

Then this consortium sold their share to the government or rather to a government controlled holding company.

Merkel was far too soft on Hungary while this was going on. Billions continued to flow into Hungarys pockets. There is evidence of misappropriation of EU funds to build up oligarchs tied to the regime.

Chamberlain was naive to trust Hitler, just like anyone trusting Putin is naive. There's nothing to indicate he was playing for time.

However at least he had a good reason for wanting peace: He had seen entire British towns decimated of their male populations due to WWI, with millions of dead soldiers across Europe. Anyone who has lived through that would have no doubt preferred peace.

However, I have to mention Churchill's quote after the vote for the Munich Agreement passed because it's appropriate now more than ever:

"And do not suppose that this is the end. This is only the beginning of the reckoning. This is only the first sip, the first foretaste of a bitter cup which will be proffered to us year by year unless by a supreme recovery of moral health and martial vigour, we arise again and take our stand for freedom as in the olden time."

'Peace in our time' and 11 months later Europe was at war.

I dont think its in the interests of Ireland to support a big country annexing part of a smaller but still large country. I never understand why some on the Hard Left who condemn what they call "American/Israeli imperialism" are fine with Russian imperialism. I think some of it with the older ones is a pre-existing admiration for the supposed "anti capitalist" or "revolutionary" Soviet Union, despite the bread lines and the empty meat counters, labour camps and Stalin's Terror.

The story from South Africa about people being lured to Russia thinking its for a job, and then being forced to fight Ukraine is classic colonial exploitation, quite apart from Russia's mercenary involvement in the Congo, Chad etc. which is turning into something like Strongbow's mercenaries being invited in by Dermot McMurrough and conquering most of the country. Russia has a strangehold on the diamond trade in CAR. CNN also had a report months ago on Wagner's involvement in Sudanese gold exploitation and using it to help fund their war in Ukraine.

I won't be surprised if this current Trump fart will be forgotten as soon as he fixates on some other issue depending on what movie he watches over the weekend.

At this stage if Zelenksky promised Trump a 100 m high gold statue in Kviv his vanity and need for adulation would be so stoked he'd forget whatever pedo pics Putin has on him.