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Russia-Ukraine War (continuing)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    The plan also has strong echoes of Munich 1938 about it ('peace in our time' and all that) - a worthless piece of paper. The parts where Russia gives assurances that it won't invade Ukraine in future are laughable, as if this sham of a plan has even the slightest credibility.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    More undefined security guarantees or rather negotiations on them in future. More disarmament of Ukraine like in 1994. This template has already failed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,369 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    UK, France, Poland, and Germany should invade Ukraine . 3 day operation. Problem solved .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    Its questionable if even these terms will satisfy Putin. He is still talking war to the Russian people.

    Regarding the promise to put non aggression into the Russian constitution, it is already there and is worthless.

    Putin, as a KGB colonel well versed in deception and telling westerners what they want to hear and doing the opposite,cannot be trusted.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,627 ✭✭✭Dr Robert


    Give up a huge chunk of their country,limit army and leave themselves wide open to another attack. No NATO protection.

    Once Trump got back in this was always going this way.

    Joining NATO will soon be seen as essential to other countries.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    Offering Russia concessions the day after the sabotage of Poland railways and the beating up of the Polish ambassador in Russia is a disgrace.

    Poland seeking sanctions on states that are flagging the ghost fleet.

    More on the so called peace plan.

    Ukraine would also be required to roll back restrictions on the activities of the Russian Orthodox Church (which is controlled by Putin) in Ukraine.

    They would also have to roll back their De-Russification laws. During Tsarist and Soviet rule, the Ukrainian language (at least since the 1930s) was suppressed (Lenin had a policy of promoting minority languages in the USSR, which Stalin reversed).

    It would be like allowing the UK to dictate our policy on the Irish language. Its colonialist.

    Post edited by Ozymandius2011 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,095 ✭✭✭Avatar in the Post


    Peace plan, my hoop. US blatant profiteering, more like. Has Trump’s tiny, grubby hands all over it!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    Poland has closed Russia's last remaining consulate in the country in Gdansk following explosions that damaged a critical line bringing weapons to Ukraine. The suspects were working for Russian intelligence and entered Poland from Belarus but are from Ukraine.

    What is known about the railway sabotage in Poland:

    ▪️ The saboteurs blew up a railway line between Warsaw and Lublin on 16 November. This route is critical for delivering aid to Ukraine. Prime Minister Donald Tusk called the incident “an unprecedented act of sabotage against Poland’s security.” Warsaw initially suspected Russia.

    ▪️ But Tusk later said two Ukrainian citizens are now the main suspects. They allegedly cooperated with Russian intelligence services. Both, according to him, entered Poland from Belarus.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,448 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Ukraine's statement at the UN security council last night. Confirmed receipt of Trumps plan and listed it's concerns they have already.

    The old world is dying, and the new world struggles to be born: now is the time of monsters. — Antonio Gramsci



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    They say they wont accept limits on their defence capability or the recognition of the occupied territories. Journalist on News Review on Sky News just now saying "I can't see this happening". Also says because the US has stopped aid to Ukraine, it reduces the US leverage over Ukraine.

    Also said that before Russia invaded Ukraine, the country was divided 50:50 between pro West and pro Russia, but is now "entirely pro western".

    I think thats true though Putin has expelled much of the population in the occupied territories and replaced them with settlers. He's also banned the Ukrainian language there.

    Prof Michael Clarke analysis: Draft plan is a 'complete undermining' of Ukraine's sovereignty



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    Reports Zelensky uncovered a plan by the Trump WH to humiliate him in Turkey but announcing the so called peace plan conceding all of Russia's demands, resulting in Zelensky putting forward a plan of his own. This reportedly (according to Ben Meisalas of Meidas) resulted in the meeting with Witkoff being cancelled and General Kellogg either resigning or being forced out.

    German Chancellor Friedrich Merz has pledged "long range fires" for Ukraine but dodged a question on whether he would send Taurus.

    Also, the US says it wants Germany to take over the position of NATO Supreme Commander in Europe. This came as a shock as the US traditionally holds that position. Germany said it sees things differently.

    UK police have busted a billion dollar operation funding Russia, reports Sky. RTE Radio 1 claimed its linked to the Kinahan cartel, and that it was laundering money through the cartel to get around sanctions.

    Under the Ukrainian constitution, territories cannot be ceded. The Trump plan proposals Russia "rents" these territories.

    Analysts agree that any referendum on ceding these territories would be defeated. Sky News reporting "outrage" in Ukraine at the proposals.

    Post edited by Ozymandius2011 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,971 ✭✭✭✭bear1


    It’s just a non starter. The Europeans aren’t being talked to but are being told they have to fork out 100bn euro? As if we are the worlds atm.

    But the Americans get 50% of the profits? That’s all they want, money.
    Then have the ball to ask us to stop doing business with China. At least China offers something to the EU consumer.. the **** do the Americans offer except disrespect?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    Trump is also very ungrateful for the untold sums Europe has spent integrating 4.5 million Ukrainian refugees. He has pulled this $350 bn figure as an imagined amount the US has given Ukraine, when in fact Europe has given more. His politics is largely about grievances, including this imagined one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭rogber


    It just shows the difference in power between the US and Europe. When it comes to trade we are powerful, when it comes to everything else we are seen as irrelevant by the US and China and indeed Russia, the fact the EU wasn't even informed about this latest "peace plan" shows the utter contempt with which Trump and Putin see the EU.

    But still Starmer, Merz, Macron, von der Leyen and the rest are terrified of ever angering Trump.

    It's an absolute shambles



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    About 50 Russians under the cover of fog made it into Novopavlivka but then Ukrainian F16s bombed a concentration of Russians near the nearby village of Filya. Ukrainians then captured Russian armoured vehicles. Fighting is ongoing but they have prevented more Russian reinforcements.

    The Russian assault on Novopavlivka began under the cover of dense fog, which prevented either side from fully relying on drones. Exploiting this rare window, Russian forces quickly set up a pontoon crossing between Yalta and Dachne and transported roughly ten armored vehicles across the river. Because the fog was extremely thick, Ukrainian surveillance detected the maneuver too late, allowing the Russians to disperse troops in the central and southern parts of the village. Russian analysts immediately glorified the event, claiming absurdly that the same vehicles not only made a successful 2-way trip with no losses, but also immediately picked up more troops upon the return and made the second 2-way trip undetected. Novopavlivka holds great tactical value, and if Russia captures it, its troops could push toward Mezhova from the south and severely weaken Ukraine’s defensive flank west of the Pokrovsk direction. This area has very few settlements suitable for establishing firm defensive lines, meaning any Russian advance north of Novopavlivka could unfold quickly. That is why the fog-aided Russian breakthrough created initial concern, but the truth of what happened differs from the Russian narrative.The Russians managed to make only one crossing, and even that came with losses, as while the fog limited drone visibility, Ukrainian operators still managed to detect and strike Russian equipment. Geolocated footage shows Russian tanks and armored vehicles being immobilized before the fog lifted fully and later destroyed once visibility improved. Even so, Russia succeeded in landing a limited number of troops who immediately scattered across houses, small shelters, and farm structures. Ukrainian infantry began clearing operations immediately, working building by building and street by street to root out infiltrators.Soon after, Ukrainian forces released another geolocated video from Novopavlivka, showing the elimination of the Russian equipment that had managed to slip into the village. One armored vehicle and several Russians, initially lucky enough to evade immediate detection, were spotted and destroyed by drone-dropped grenades. While Russian sources claimed that over 100 soldiers infiltrated the settlement, judging that their second cross indeed happened, Ukrainian officers estimated that no more than 50 made it inside. Ukrainian soldiers captured two Russians from a destroyed BMP-2 and even managed to seize a working BMP-1 as a trophy, using the fog as cover to their advantage this time. From these engagements alone, 15 Russian soldiers were killed, while more footage indicates that at least 25 out of the roughly 50 infiltrators have been eliminated or captured, meaning that in reality Russians made only 1 trip with 50% losses, not 2 trips with zero losses.Ukrainian drone operators continued to hunt the remaining infiltrators, destroying seven more Russians hiding among the houses in Novopavlivka. West of the village, at a nearby farm, Russian troops attempted to establish a foothold, but they were spotted by drones. Once Ukrainian operators struck them from the air with FPV drones, two Ukrainian marines moved in and cleared the site. This perfectly illustrates how battles unfold now, with tiny assault teams determining the fate of several square kilometers, while drones guide every step.To prevent the Russians from exploiting the fog again, Ukrainian forces also struck the rear where new troops were gathering. A Ukrainian F-16 carried out a bombing mission against Russian concentration points in the village of Filiya, destroying several buildings with soldiers inside. Simultaneously, Russian reinforcements attempting to cross the Vovcha River near Yalta got stuck in heavy mud. What could have become a breakthrough instead became a traffic jam of four armored vehicles, all of which were destroyed by Ukrainian FPV and Vampire drones moments later.Overall, despite the surprise of the initial fog-assisted crossing, Ukrainian defenders demonstrated resilience and adaptability. The battle for Novopavlivka is far from over, as Russian troops remain scattered inside the settlement, hiding and trying to build positions. Yet the Ukrainian response has blunted the momentum of the attack and prevented reinforcement waves. Because Novopavlivka's location is so important, both sides understand the stakes, and more clashes...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭Glenomra


    You mentioned the word irrelevancy yesterday. We often write paragraphs to try and explain how supine Europe is. No need. That single word the sums up Europe.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 780 ✭✭✭Bitcoin


    The reality of what's going on is that every single ruzzian assault ends in a utter rout where they lose huge numbers of men and tanks.

    Ukraine is winning and attempts by the fat orange man to bail ruzzia out will fail.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭ilkhanid


    Point 26 is particularly repugnant. Trump wants his friend Putrid and his flunkies to escape any accountability for their crimes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    What's very striking about the 'plan' is that there are virtually zero concessions from the Russians - just some vague assurances that they won't invade the unoccupied part of Ukraine in future. All of the sections about demilitarising Ukraine are bonkers, as if Ukraine invaded Russia in February 2022 and not the other way around. A person who had been living on a remote Pacific island for the last three and a half years reading it would assume that Ukraine must have attacked Russia at the start and poses a very serious and long term threat to the Russians.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    NATO’s top military official, Admiral Giuseppe Cavo Dragone, has declared that Russia’s war in Ukraine has reached a stalemate and that Vladimir Putin has suffered a strategic defeat. He said the Kremlin has failed to achieve its military or political goals despite years of fighting.

    Dragone noted that NATO remains committed to supporting Ukraine “until we bring it to the negotiating table for lasting peace.” He described the ongoing conflict as a “waste of lives” and said it was nearly time for serious peace talks.The admiral pointed out that Russia’s invasion in 2022 had backfired, leading Finland and Sweden to join NATO—an outcome that strengthened the alliance rather than weakening it. “Putin won’t get a friendly or puppet government like in Belarus,” he said.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    The oligarchs around this WH just want to get back to doing business in Russia, especially on fossil fuels, rare earth minerals. Its greed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,627 ✭✭✭Dr Robert


    If Putin takes another chunk of Ukraine I can't imagine he'll see that as a defeat



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    Sky defence analyst Clarke calling it a "terrible terrible document " and says as it stands it's a non-starter. Says it's possible diplomats will "firm it up", but that it is "foolish" and EU officials say it reads "like a Kremlin wishlist".

    It also contains signs Trump does not see the US as part of NATO, such as the provision on the US 'mediating between NATO and Russia". Also dismisses Trump wanting this signed by Thanksgiving to Christmas.

    It also says that normal trade relations with Russia will be restored. He had no right to make that promise on behalf of Europe.

    It also says that out of the $100bn in frozen Russian assets used to rebuild Ukraine, 50% would go to the US



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,627 ✭✭✭Dr Robert




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    More on what the so called security guarantee would look like. After the failure of the 1994 one I dont find it convincing.

    The security guarantees proposal declares that any major Russian attack across a new armistice line

    “shall be regarded as an attack threatening the peace and security of the transatlantic community.”

    Participating US and NATO states — including France, UK, Germany, Poland and Finland — would act “in concert,” potentially with military force.

    A joint NATO-Ukraine mechanism would investigate violations.

    A Joint Monitoring Commission (European-led, U.S. included) would oversee compliance.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    The whole thing is nuts - everyone seems to be conceding that there is a not insubstantial chance that Russia would / will invade Ukraine again in the not too distant future (!). What the hell sort of a "peace plan" is that?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,481 ✭✭✭Rawr


    It's essentially the Kremlin's demands with some window-dressing designed to look like consessions to Ukraine, all of which was just copy / pasted by Donnie's nitwit brigade.

    Give it a week, someone pro-Ukraine will flatter Donnie and we'll be back to talking about Tomahawks and how Russia has to end the war. He'll flop back to the Russian side after flattery from them and the bullsh*t cycle will continue ad-nausium until he's out of the White House.

    All while the war continues to grind down the Russian state's ability to continue. Focus might be on the Ukrainians, but this is by design, the Russians are in a progessivly bad position what can't continue forever. I suspect that they are desperate for a respite in the fighting while not wanting to lose anything. This is why the Cauldron Club are being manipulated to be so excited yet again for another BS non-agreement that solves nothing. The Kremlin needs such an agreement to happen soon, or the current situation will continue to consume what's left of their functioning state.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 959 ✭✭✭junkyarddog


    https://bsky.app/profile/noelreports.com/post/3m655covtgs2o

    Russia officially claims it has not received any proposals from the U.S. regarding a peace settlement in Ukraine, according to Foreign Ministry spokesperson Maria Zakharova.

    Peace plan?

    What peace plan?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,073 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    The proposed deal also bans foreign diplomats planes from landing in Ukraine. Sounds like an attempt to turn it into a Soviet style satellite country.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 589 ✭✭✭discostu1


    NNot Sure how many heard Dr Frank Ledwidge this morning on #MorningIreland...now we may not like what he says but whilst not a Putin puppet his analysis is bleak . It starts at 1.12.30 into the show

    https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/morning-ireland/2025/1121/1545133-morning-ireland-friday-21-november-2025/



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