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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,294 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    At 12.28pm you complained about not giving players a shot.

    At 12.42pm, you complained about making too many changes.

    Wonderful.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,018 ✭✭✭shootermacg


    I would have preferred JoB to start over Osbourne to try and get some pace into the back 3.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 10,980 ✭✭✭✭Pudsy33




  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 31,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I would have preferred JOB to start at 15 so Osborne could start at 12, but that doesn't appear to be on the management's radar at all so so be it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    How is any coach watching Henshaw this season and coming away with the opinion that he's a viable option at 12? He's looked washed up playing in the URC, let alone international level. Put Frawley there, if you're going to insist on Osbourne at 15.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,294 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    to try and get some pace into the back 3.

    Stockdale and TOB are in the back three?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 10,980 ✭✭✭✭Pudsy33


    And I'm not sure JOB is that much quicker than Osbourne



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 398 ✭✭Bart97


    You probably missed the ”I do like the team, not much complaints there” part?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 398 ✭✭Bart97


    Going by the rugby podcasts logic, having pace on the wings in Stockdale and TOB means our lineout will be sorted!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭typhoony


    The ireland A v Spain is free to watch on Rugby Pass TV this weekend



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Jimmy O'Brien is way way quicker than Jamie Osborne - not even close between them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭TRC10


    As highly as I rate him as a player, I don’t really get the Nick Timoney selection. He’s 30 years old and has been around the squad for over 4 years now, he gets one game every November against a tier 2 team and then isn’t seen again until the next November. Might have been more beneficial putting Doris at 7 and giving someone younger a shot at 8 like Prendergast or dare I say Coombes. Would be a perfect game for Gleeson if he wasn’t injured. Because let’s be real, no matter how well Timoney plays, they’re not going to drop VDF for either of the last 2 games. Maybe I’m wrong and he plays well and gets more game time, but I doubt it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭TRC10


    I actually think this is a massive game for Jacob Stockdale. He’s 29 now and has gotten games over the last few years and has either played poorly or gotten injured. But James Lowe is 33 and is visibly in decline. There’s the potential for an opening on the left wing and if Stockdale plays well here he could put himself in prime position to take that spot going forward. I’m happy to see him get a chance but as I said, he really needs to grab this with both hands or it’s probably time to start looking at other options. Ulster fans have been raving about his form of late so we’ll see if he can translate that to the Irish jersey.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭TRC10


    Also, I just can’t get behind the continued Osborne at 15 experiment. JOB isn’t world class, but he’s fast and at least brings some attacking flair from fullback. He’s a fine stop gap until Keenan is back. Osborne just brings size and a big boot. He’s could be an excellent 12 but Farrell and Cullen are stifling his career by playing him at 15.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,281 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    AND HES BEING USED!!!!

    jesus christ sometimes this pace is mind numbing! The lack of alternatives at 15 means that JOB has to cover the back three position from 23.

    So you want to put Osbourne to 12 and Jimmy O Brien to 15? fine…

    is your wonderful solution then to have Ciaran Frawley covering back 3 from the 23 shirt?? did someone mention lack of pace earlier?

    or maybe its put Henshaw in at 23 and say a decade of the rosary that he doesn't have to come on at 15.

    Id absolutely prefer myself to see osbourne at 12, ive said it loads of times already here that imo hes our future 12, but jeez anyone can take a step back and see why hes gone with Henshaw for Saturdays game given the players available and more importantly the players not available.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,316 ✭✭✭50HX


    Delighted he has shaken things up...it was on the cards anyway regardless of Sat result/performance purely from a return travel perspective.

    Hopefully whoever shows form in this game is given the opportunity to continue it to the following week & not revert to type.

    Will watch with interest how Timoney,Farrell,Stockdale go & how the half backs run the game assuming set piece doesnt malfunction.

    I understand the reasoning on the 12 selection but it again feels like they don't see Osbourne as an option.

    Could have gone Stockdale at 15 to move Osbourne to 12 but thats ripping the whole backline apart then for 1 game which is never going to happen.

    Remaining 3 games are massive for O connell & goodman to show there worth



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    We wouldn't be in this conundrum if Farrell picked players in form. Lowry playing out of his skin this season and can't get a look in. Baloucoune wasting time playing for the A team. Boltyn sitting in the stands. Frawley could be on the 23, given all of the lads picked cover 11-15 to various levels.

    There's no excuse for playing lads out of position to accommodate Henshaw



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,281 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Come on now, like he made a number of changes last week, and has gone and made 8 changes this week. Virtually all of the guys who were touted on here this week as players we'd like to see get a chance have been included, with the solitary exception of Tom Ahern IMO.

    Baloucoune has played 256 mins of rugby in the past 12 months (4 games). It's great he's in the A squad, but he's lucky to be there given his injury profile of recent times. He also plays in a position where we're already giving a shot to a younger player who is on 3 caps.

    Some of this whining about selections is just way OTT now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Osborne being out at 15, instead of JOB or Stockdale. Frawley too I suppose, since he rarely gets a chance at 12 either.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,714 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    No, because I don't think he's infallable whether he wins or loses. I wouldn't make a ridiculous argument in a discussion forum that the proof that a player isn't good enough, is that he hasn't been picked.

    Counter factuals are impossible to prove. Ireland could scrape a win in the 6 nations with this team, or we could have won a grand slam with a better coached or selected team. In a discussion forum, we should be allowed to advocate for changes to our national team without someone trying to shut down the debate with an appeal to authority and unseen training ground work.

    We could scrape a win in this upcoming 6 nations at the expense of the RWC in 2027 Its perfectly legitimate to criticise a coach if I think his win now strategy is coming at the cost of future performances.

    I think he should be selecting bigger training squads and playing more players in meaningful games in rotation, instead of playing the same players for every big game, and then playing some scratch teams in A games or some rotation for Tier 2 opposition like Japan

    This weekend, Thomas Ahern should have been on the bench at least. Play Baird at 2nd row from the start if he wants to give him time in that position, and have Ahern on the bench. If Ryan needs gametime to build up match fitness, play him, but Beirne doesn't need to play. He has already shown he is up to speed in the Leinster game and has plenty of minutes on the clock this calendar year and could easily be rested for the Japan game.

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    It's about specific positions. Our centres are geriatric. We have young talent playing regularly for their clubs, yet Farrell continues to choose lads who aren't delivering. Ringrose made 1 pass last week. Henshaw looks like he's doing a Ross Bryne impression, given how slow he is now. It's crazy, makes no zero sense. Playing the younger lads would improve our likelihood of success. It's the pragmatic choice, as well as being the right one looking to the future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,526 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    The Tom Farrell story needs telling.

    Just brilliant to see a player like that reach the pinnacle despite getting rejected again and again and again.

    Coolmine RFC, Castleknock, Lansdowne, 2013 U-20 World Cup (Thnks Mike Ruddock), Leinster academy, London Irish (A's), Bedford.

    He only played half a season at Bedford and only because of an Injury crisis at Connacht he was signed up.

    A great story and I hope he has a stormer on Saturday.

    Post edited by ionadnapóca on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Yeah, I get it, but we have a debutant at centre this weekend, and this is still a lot of change and a lot of new combos in the side.

    You're not going to get everything you want all the time, and I still think this is an encouraging and relatively exciting side.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,020 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Mod Edit

    Warning issued.

    Post edited by ShamoBuc on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Japan side (15-9,1-8):

    Yoshitaka Yazaki, Kippei Ishida, Dylan Riley, Charlie Lawrence, Tomoki Osada, Seungsin Lee, Naoto Saito, Kenta Kobayashi, Kenji Sato, Shuhei Tekeuchi, Epineri Uluviti, Warner Dearns, Ben Gunter, Kanji Shimokawa, Faulua Makisi.

    Reps: Shodai Hirao, Ryosuke Iwaihara, Tamefusa Keijiro, Jack Cornelsen, Michael Leitch, Shinobu Fujiwara, Shinya Komura



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,053 ✭✭✭vetinari


    Happy enough overall with the team. Felt Porter could have gotten a rest and like others would prefer to see Osbourne at 12. JOB would be the best option for full back given who Farrell picked for the squad.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,552 ✭✭✭leakyboots


    It does make you wonder how many other Tom Farrell's are out there (in terms of working their way up through different channels and people that might be international class but can't get a look-in - I know he hasn't shown it yet himself!)



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,281 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    yeah i much prefer a 6' 4" Osbourne competing against a 5' 11" full back in Yazaki

    the two japenese wingers are also small, 5' 10" and 5' 6" respectively.

    There wont be much leather left on the ball come 3pm on saturday.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,539 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    We still need some experience at prop. Clarkson only has 8 caps at tighthead. Porter is there to help him through the game. Bealham will do the same when Paddy McCarthy comes on.



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