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Tax returns.

  • 15-09-2025 11:03PM
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭


    Hi All, I received my 2024 tax returns for my farm account from my accountant and to be honest I'm actually quite shocked how my tax has doubled since the previous year with more or less the same scale of operations on the farm. I have also a preliminary tax of over €3000 to pay for year 2025 and accountants fee of over €600 on top of that. I have a small farm that I farm part time. Can I ask the accountant to explain how my tax has doubled in a year and a preliminary tax for 2025 that is four times what I paid last year? I really dont know where to start but the total fee I got is quite extortionate and really annoyed about it. If the tax man was to take what they have calculated here I might as well be letting the land out than farm it.

    If I take out loans from the bank and pay over a set number of years will I get tax relief on that?

    TIA



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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 31,449 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    I pay preliminary tax every month so I'm not left with a big whack coming out. As I dont know what way my finances will be each year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,618 ✭✭✭J.O. Farmer


    How does your profit and off farm income compare to previous years.

    More income = more tax



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,040 ✭✭✭Jb1989


    Exactly, has your profit increased much from the previous year? Like was your bank balance bigger on the 31st December than the previous year?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 4,762 Mod ✭✭✭✭Siamsa Sessions


    Go into the accountant and get him/her to take you thru it line-by-line.

    It's most likely right, but you need to see where the extra tax liability is being generated, (1) for your own sake, and (2) so you can see where you might be able to reduce it next year.

    Make him/her work for their €600 fee. Asking them to explain everything isn't much to ask.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,711 ✭✭✭dar31


    stock value on your accounts. Everyone has the same problem this year as all stock are worth more than last year



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,500 ✭✭✭bogman_bass


    had you a loss in 2022that got carried into 2023?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,020 ✭✭✭Conversations 3




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin


    Can I put some of it on my pension?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin


    ,,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin


    Made money on cattle but also had to buy in new stock for the year at huge prices as well.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin


    I have also had to buy in cattle same year at big prices than normal.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin


    ..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭Seadin




  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 4,762 Mod ✭✭✭✭Siamsa Sessions


    Yes, that's one way to reduce the tax bill.

    But your accountant will be able to advise on that too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 340 ✭✭ThreeGreens


    To be honest, asking here is really going to be a waste of time as people here don't see your tax return nor last years.

    This is what you are paying your accountant for (admittedly they aren't really charging you a lot). So if you don't understand why it's changed make an appointment to see them again and ask them to take you through the results and explain why they are different to the year before.

    They should have no problem with that, and you'll understand where the differences are. Accountants should normally explain the result to you. They might have done so already but you didn't take it in at the time, or they might not have seen it as a big changes and not clarified why it had moved.

    If your accountant refuses to explain the figures then you need a new accountant. No point in having one that won't explain the results to you. I'd be shocked if they refused to explain the differences to you.

    Don't get high and mighty complaining about the bill. Just explain that you are shocked by the change and that you'd like to understand why it's different to the year before and would appreciate it if they could go through it with you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 853 ✭✭✭degetme


    What are people being charged for tax returns? 300k turnover here, being charged 1200 plus vat



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 31,449 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    YYes, Years ago and I just kept it going. Takes the sting out of it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 266 ✭✭Tibulus


    Agree with this, you dont need to go through every item line by line. But can be summaried into a few key headings and compare it with other years.

    1. Income
    2. Expenditure
    3. Difference in value of stock
    4. Depreciation


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 4,762 Mod ✭✭✭✭Siamsa Sessions


    Much smaller turnover here and I pay €900 to IFAC.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 853 ✭✭✭degetme


    Are you happy with them? Do you wait long for accounts after handing them in?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭KAMG


    That's all you have to offer? Insinuate that the accountant didn't do enough work to justify a fee of the huge amount of 600e? That's about the smallest fee any of our sole traders would pay.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,039 ✭✭✭Stationmaster


    I've a good few farmers on the books and €600 would be on the low side of what any of them are paying. Break it down over the full year on the time spent on each client and it's easy add up.

    OP, have you asked your own accountant for the a detailed breakdown of the man items like others have suggested here? That's your starting point and I don't think any accountant would have an issue with that.

    Setting up a monthly income tax payment is a very simple process.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭KAMG


    Very difficult to give you advice OP, without knowing more details, but what I will say is that the vast majority of our farmer clients have substantially higher tax liabilities this year.

    And next year will probably be worse.

    Are you on income averaging?

    Have you any teenage kids you could pay a wage to?

    Are you interested in adding to a pension?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭KAMG


    If your preliminary tax is 3,000e for 2025, that means your 2024 actual liability is 3,000e.

    If its 4 times what you paid last year, that means 750e was paid last year in preliminary tax, which would have been your 2023 actual liability.

    So, I am missing something as you stated that 2024 liability was double 2023?

    Thats 4 times as much? Are you saying your total tax payment doubled?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 4,762 Mod ✭✭✭✭Siamsa Sessions


    Relax - you’re protesting too much.

    I’m insinuating that the OP make an appointment and go into their accountant and get full value for the €600 service provided.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭KAMG


    Believe me, I'm relaxed.

    Anyone who knows me, first thing they say is how chilled I am. And I'll tell you something, you would want to be, dealing with what I have to deal with on a daily basis.

    You can muddy the water all you want, but I know you were getting a little dig in against the accountants.

    I find your online presence very interesting. And I wouldn't like anyone saying anything negative about how much you earn. Or how hard you work for it.

    Let's not derail the tread.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,960 ✭✭✭morphy87


    Out of curiosity, could you give us a very rough idea if you don’t, say your beef farmer that paid €2500 in tax in 2023, what do you think they will pay in 2024 and 2025? Someone in full employment



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 4,762 Mod ✭✭✭✭Siamsa Sessions


    Agreed - let’s not derail the thread.

    And you’ve reminded me why I’m reducing my online presence slowly over time. It’s a variation on “Goodbye cruel circus, I’m off to join the world” 😂



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭KAMG


    Impossible to say how your tax liability will work out. A lot of other variables to take into account.

    But, your farm profits should be anywhere from 50% to 100% higher.

    But, income averaging will help negate this. Every farmer should be in this.

    I know my own profit will be a lot higher, but I'm doing some much needed enhancement work this year. The aim of which, shock horror, is to make more profit next year. And then more tax again. Its a vicious circle.



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