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Israel Launches strike against Irans Nuclear Programme

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    Interesting piece on Netanyahu. Seems there were no plans for attacking Iran up to at least 2021.

    Rather odd given he's been shouting about Iran having nukes from the 1990s at least.



    Netanyahu's claim that others stopped him from acting earlier is typical of him. It belongs to the genre of "They didn't tug on my coat" (after the Mount Meron tragedy), "They didn't wake me up" (on the morning of October 7) and "I wanted to deal with Hamas a long time ago, but the Shin Bet told me they were deterred," and so on.

    He has no rival when it comes to constructing narratives. What surprises us every time is the speed with which he creates them and the horrifying cynicism behind it.

    Take Bennett. When he entered the Prime Minister's Office in June 2021, the first thing he asked for was the plans for attacking Iran. "The drawers were empty," he said in disbelief.

    It was clear that his predecessor (Netanyahu) had been content with pathos-filled speeches at the UN General Assembly"

    Yossi Verter



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    Wrong thread - sorry



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,415 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Israel at the UN are a fecking parody, how any country can entertain these frauds is laughable and a real stain on those countries.

    The Israeli ambassador, in his following remarks, accused Iran of having a “genocidal agenda,”



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    Seems that lately, every Israeli accusation is a confession.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,515 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    By what metric did you come to that conclusion?

    Russia killed more people (including their own) and destroyed more cities than Israelis nutcases done



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,549 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Israel at the UN are a fecking parody, how any country can entertain these frauds is laughable and a real stain on those countries.

    The Israeli ambassador, in his following remarks, accused Iran of having a “genocidal agenda,”

    There's a reason why Israel have been fighting for years to have the UN's definition of anti-semitism altered. They want the term 'genocide' to exist only when it refers to them as the victims of it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,685 ✭✭✭rogber


    He's vile but doesn't alter the fact you misinterpreted his remark



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭dmcdona




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,933 ✭✭✭Homelander


    I'm extremely surprised there wasn't at least basic plans laid out for attacking Iran. Even if they weren't actionable, or plausible, or sketetal in design - the idea there was nothing whatsoever is very surprising given Iran has been Israel's main threat for decades.

    Countries usually have all sorts of military plans for even highly unlikely or outlandish scenarios. I'm not for a second saying it's not true - but I find it incredibly hard to believe.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,607 ✭✭✭thereiver


    Yes its double standards. but all the American politicans don't want to criticize Israel for fear of losing the Jewish vote Trump won' the election by a few per cent. Plus an awful lot of writers journalists editors are Jewish Jews are very prominent in media journalism and Hollywood company's

    The IDF is happy to bomb hospitals and kill aid workers or peaceful protestors there's extremists on both sides of this war



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,549 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Maybe it's the fact that there wasn't a concrete plan that is the reason they acted now. It's as much based on impulse and the belief that people globally just don't care enough right now to pay attention… than it is about there being no overall plan in place at all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    I can't vouch for the author but the piece is in Haaretz - they wouldn't let that big a whopper go.

    Perhaps there were secret plans somewhere and Netanyahu didn't know (which would be just as bad I suppose).

    I think the point of the piece is the man will not take responsibility - "they didn't wake me up" on Oct 7th is pretty lame.

    He and his cohort really are dragging Israel through the mire. If Israelis really do want peace and security, he has to go.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,933 ✭✭✭Homelander


    I would say after October 7th Israel decided the gloves were off and it was time to end Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran for good, international opinion be damned - act now, ask for forgiveness later approach.

    And at that, I don't think their crippling of Hezbollah caused too many waves, or even this attack on Iran - it's the incessant pulverising of Gaza that's going to hang over them for generations.

    But in the end, it will be Israel who'll achieve its aims, we all know it won't have to answer for the means it used to achieve it in the overall scheme of things, and that won't change even if Bibi is hauled off to the Hague.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,128 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,105 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Not sure the penny has dropped yet that Israel's 'war' may already be a failure. Yes, they assassinated a load of Iranian military and scientists but the fact they are now talking about a conflict against Iran possibly going on for weeks or months would suggest the thing has gone pear shaped with no guarantee of a positive outcome.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,933 ✭✭✭Homelander


    I think that's because Israel wants to keep going and completely destroy Iran, not that the war is suddenly going horribly.

    We all see the missile strikes on Israel, but they're not achieving much and causing minimal casualties - at least, not at the moment, but Iran's ability to launch large-scale attacks seems to be rapidly dwindling.

    The widespread availability of these videos from Israel, and relatively none from Iran, is causing confirmation bias.

    What we don't see as much of, because of lockdown in Iran, is the damage Israel is doing there. Air defenses, strategic sites, launchers, production facilities, nuclear facilities leadership targets, etc - Israel is hitting them extremely hard.

    All Iran has is ballistic missiles, and they've achieved nothing so far in terms of strategic or military value. They don't have an air force, they don't have air defenses that can challenge the Israeli air force.

    Israel might consider the war a "failure" if they can't deliver a knockout blow to Iran's nuclear capability, or regime, but from a purely conventional war point of view, Israel as of today is completely dominant.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,415 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    The goalposts are definitely moving all over the place now. Apparently 07/10/23 was a response to Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran and anyone else who criticised Israel….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,481 ✭✭✭MFPM


    It isn't or was never going to be 'international opinion be damned' they knew they had the support of the US, the UK, France etc. and key leaders like Von der Leyen in the EU, even bloody Zelensky has been complicit much to his shame! Israel has ignored the UN for decades with no consequences, they slaughtered Palestinians in 2014, they've systematically robbed their land and homes and nothing has stopped them. October 7 much like 9/11 was for those in US behind the project for the new America century (Bush, Rumsfeld, Cheney etc) - provided an opportunity to go further than previously they dared, exploiting the event for their own nefarious ends - those war criminals faced no consequences and Netanyhau isn't likely to either - friends of the West never do - Thatcher worked tirelessly to keep Pinochet out of prison!!

    The world watched while Blair and Bush slaughtered the children of Iraq and Afghanistan and the world watches while Israel slaughters the children of Gaza and takes pot shots at the children of Iran, Yemen, the West Bank and Lebanon.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,105 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    A very big ask for Israel to try and destroy Iran's military using air strikes alone. Iran's military is said to number over 1m personnel spread out over a massive land mass and they might be the best armed country in the region.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,933 ✭✭✭Homelander


    They don't have to. Iranian land forces are irrelevant in this conflict. As are Israeli land forces. Or naval forces for that matter.

    Israel could never, would never want to, invade Iran. It would be logistically and logically impossible.

    The two countries are 2,000km apart.

    Israel's already destroyed its air defenses, Iran's airforce is inactive, and Israel is dismantling their missile facilities and launchers, and attacking nuclear infrastructure - Iran can do nothing to counter any of it.

    Israel can destroy Iran's military where it counts, and it is doing so.

    When I say "destroy Iran", I don't mean destroy the country or its military. I mean destroy its ability to wage any sort of long range war against Israel.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,161 ✭✭✭Bogey Lowenstein
    That must be Nigel with the brie...


    I think IDF will be pushing north into Lebanon next. They will want to annexe up to the Litani river at least.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    The war on Iran started by Israel, yet again has seen mission creep. In the space of a week the war goals have ranged from ending Iran’s nuclear program to killing the Ayatollah, to regime change, involving installing the son of the last Shah as puppet ruler.

    Can Air Power alone achieve these Israeli war goals in Iran. A country more than a million square kilometres larger than Ukraine?


    We have the same war hawks on boards who predicted Hamas would be defeated in weeks once the IDF invaded Gaza and the famous Summer in Crimea predictions of 2 years ago.
    Many posters are just parroting already biased opinions which suit their hoped for narrative rather than being an objective analysis, as far as that is even possible given that information on Iranian missiles and Israeli interceptors is not publicly known.
    For those focusing on the Iranian supply of weapons to Russia. Was there outrage when the west was supplying weapons to Saddam Hussein to kill Iranians and chemical weapons to kill the Kurds.

    Because of the pre meditated attack by Israel, air defence systems and anti drone missiles are being diverted from Ukraine to protect Israel from the war they started.
    There is a huge double standard as usual when it comes to the behaviour of western powers versus non western powers.
    Many are happy to condemn Iran for supplying weapons to a country undertaking an illegal invasion but are supportive of western countries who have supplied weapons for illegal invasions or who have undertaken illegal invasions themselves.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,128 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Very comforting view you have there, the bit about Iranian ground forces being irrelevant.

    In this regard, it should be recalled that most experts in explosives and high-powered bombing have assessed that the destruction of the Iranian enrichment facility at Fordow, deep buried in a mountain, seems impossible from the air even with the largest conventional bombs owned by the US. Only a ground action would guarantee the destruction of the facility, but with great risks for the forces engaged who would have to operate under fire from the Iranian army and in a fairly limited time frame.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,481 ✭✭✭MFPM


    Don't disagree with any of this though always important to point out that Israel can only do what they do with the military hardware, money and political support of the US, the UK and the EU.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,933 ✭✭✭Homelander


    Relevant sure if Israel took that option but I can't imagine them pursuing that course.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,105 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Not sure how alarm bells aren't ringing with Israel's supporters when the IDF are now saying the war could go on for months : as recently as Tuesday they claimed the war would be over 'in a week or two'.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,533 ✭✭✭combat14


    Trump: Israel doesn’t have capacity to destroy Iran’s underground nuclear site on its own

    .. does this imply Trump is going to help Israel do the job .. ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,619 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Most of the worlds Middle Eastern Jews (the Mizrahi) now live in Israel:

    Mizrahi Jews - Wikipedia

    As for the Ashkenazi (the white Jews) they descend from Jewish communities in that part of the world around 2500 years ago.

    Ashkenazi Jews - Wikipedia

    These studies revealed that Ashkenazi Jews originate from an ancient (2000–700 BCE) population of the Middle East who spread to Europe.

    So the idea that Israel is some kind of European colony is made up, fabricated BS. Kind of like the falsehood, repeated regularly on this thread, that Israel was "unprovoked" by Iran.

    https://u24.gov.ua/
    Join NAFO today:

    Help us in helping Ukraine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,619 ✭✭✭SeanW


    So why are they not at war with Jordan, Egypt, Saudi Arabia etc?

    Why is it only countries and territories participating in the "Axis of Resistance?"

    https://u24.gov.ua/
    Join NAFO today:

    Help us in helping Ukraine.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,128 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    No, but that's what they want the US dragged into it for. Better US troops die than Israeli.



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