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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,889 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Yeah, mid afternoon games are the best for they players. Early games suck cause you have to eat way too much very early in the morning, and late games are a massive drag during the day and you need to try and sleep etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,750 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Good news is getting rid of the second break week, that always took the wind out of the competition and it also deprived us of the chance to go into a real back to back series of 3 big matches which is something the Irish team needs to figure out. It will be interesting to see what the tv audience is like for a Thursday evening match, Im guessing it will be bigger than the Friday evening equivalent.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    So who's going to Georgia and Portugal this summer?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    As part of the Ireland team.

    Not for a city break.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,989 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    I'd guess you'll have a couple from the senior bench, just to have experience and some mentoring.

    I can see Cathal Forde, Hugh Gavin, Hugh Cooney and Jude Postlethwaite as the centres. Doak and Frawley at out-half.

    Blade could be brought at scrum-half but I'd prefer if it is Ben Murphy and Cormac Foley.

    Full back Jamie Osbourne and Shane Daly maybe.

    Wingers Jimmy O'Brien, Calvin Nash then maybe Larmour and Bolton.

    Deegan, Prendergast, Herring and McNabney definitely for the back row, I'd like to see Culhane but you've got Soroka and Penny also at Leinster. Two of them could be brought but you've also got Kendellen from Munster.

    Izuchukwu, one or both of Henderson and Baird with Evan O'Connell and Darragh Murray in the running.

    Tom O'Toole, Clarkson, Boyle and Aungier maybe as the props, I think that's two tight and two loose but I'm running out of steam now.

    McCarthy and maybe Barron for hooker.

    I could be missing some very obvious ones, I'm really just guessing with everyone after the first two or three at each position.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,568 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Anyone from the "Irish Squad" not retired, injured or on The Lions trip will be included and probably play on this tour.

    We might have a different coaching set up but this tour is all about Team Ireland and Andy (rightly so) will decide on who's travelling and who'll start



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,889 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    The outhalves are going to be Crowley and Prendergast. Henshaw I'd say is 50/50 but im guessing he travels. Casey to go and captain possibly.

    The Georiga team in particular is going to be the absolute strongest team they can put out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,045 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    I

    Casey would be a great captain, but... I've heard players say the captain should be taller than the ref. They should be a bit naturally intimidating to the ref.

    Sounds mad but I saw some research on why home advantage exists in sport and the biggest factor was crowd reaction influencing the ref. Correlated with objective things like the home team getting extra time when they need a goal in football for example. The effect was reduced with crowd distance from the pitch like a running track around the pitch.

    I don't know enough to know it's definitely real, but other than all that, Casey would be a great captain. Decent leader.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,994 ✭✭✭RichieRich_89


    It'll probably be a fairly boring selection. Backs I expect to be something like:

    Scrumhalves: Craig Casey, Ben Murphy, Fintan Gunne

    Outhalves: Sam Prendergast, Jack Crowley, Ciarán Frawley

    Left wing: Jacob Stockdale

    Inside centres: Stuart McCloskey, Hugh Gavin

    Outside centres: Robbie Henshaw, Jude Postlethwaite

    Right wings: Tommy O'Brien, Calvin Nash

    Fullbacks: Jamie Osborne, Jimmy O'Brien

    Although 6 halves and 4 centres is probably overkill for only two games. Maybe one of the established centres skips the tour or Frawley gets left at home. Thomas Farrell would be very unlucky to miss out. If it was picked purely on merit he'd probably be the starting 13.

    The forwards are a bit more difficult to predict, but I think Prendergast should be starting at blindside.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,053 ✭✭✭johnh6767


    Backs definitely an easier guess , hopefully they take a decent sized pack and err on the side of caution as a confidence rebuild is important given the season we have gone through



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,053 ✭✭✭johnh6767


    Casey would be perfect as captain and sets the tone. If size were important DuPont wouldn’t be DuPont



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,045 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    I didn't suggest height stops a player being exceptional.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,660 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Be utterly ridiculous taking Henshaw and Henderson on this tour. You can't get a less meaningful summer slate than this. I wouldn't have any of the current starting 15 going



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,889 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I'd be surprised if Henderson doesn't go. The top 3 locks are all away with the Lions.

    There is no point putting out a full A team, and there is no way they are going to do that and risk losing to Georgia.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 45,353 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Yeah, this isn't an emerging Ireland tour.

    There will be plenty of debutantes. We need senior players alongside these newbies.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,660 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    I mean, is that a realistic worry? A tough test should be exactly what we want younger players to get to experience. Wouldn't bring anyone over 30, if at all possible. Waste of a space.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 396 ✭✭CalmaftertheGav


    Yeah but Henderson is a complete waste of space at this stage, I’m all for bringing experience but only if they actually pull their weight.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭CowboyTed


    Yes to everything except.

    Fintan Gunne: He can't get game time in URC for Leinster, Irish team isn't a place to rack up minutes. Beat Luke McGrath at home and then we are talking… Matt Devine or Ethan COUGHLAN have won there positions more…

    Left Wing : I would chance Killgallen possibly… Very unlucky with injury but could really thrive in this set up… Bolton is still there…

    Stuart McCloskey: Nope, won't make next world cup… Hugh Gavin is an outside center… Robbie as inside and possibly Cathal Forde as well.. Frawley is there as well

    Tom Farrell : Yes and hell yes… HE has been the best Irish player in the URC… We need to reward that level of consistency.. He is also 5 months younger than Robbie Henshaw and 15months younger than Stuart McCloskey.

    Backrow: We are basically saying who is better than Leinster's second string row of Deegan, Conan and Conors? Yep Prendergast… McNabney, maybe… Tom Ahern, yes… Jansen was trying to put up his hand… Coombes is limited has the power but not the athletic ability to match the Irish style of play… Bring John HODNETT, he is young and lets see does his game move up the gears..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,007 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    I'd agree with an awful lot of this, but for me, one thing I'd argue against is the following:

    Coombes is limited has the power but not the athletic ability to match the Irish style of play

    I think broadly speaking, the Irish attacking game plan is transitioning to generally having fewer rucks, fewer phases where we seem to kick more frequently and earlier. (Presumably in large part as a response to the change in escort laws). I think Coombes suits the new Irish gameplan significantly better than, say, the 22/23 version of the Irish attack.

    Aside from that, I'd have Devine in, think it's too soon for Coughlan, who I really like and think will jump passed Paddy Patterson next season, but he's still that bit raw.

    Hodnett, I love the guy, but he hasn't had as impactful a season as in the previous 2 years. I think I'd go Prendergast, Connors (if fit) and Coombes as the starting back-row vs Georgia.

    It'll be interesting to see if/where Tom Ahern gets picked too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭CowboyTed


    Not disagreeing with you on Combes, was thinking it while writing.. But everytime I see that , I think of Jansen… He is a bigger unit than Combes and just as unstoppable on the small yards.. might bring both to have a look…

    I really want to give Coombes a chance to see if he is a yea or a nay… Put it in his own hands…



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭CowboyTed


    Would love to see a possibles against probables game before they go…

    Do it for charity… Both teams are being put together and gives a chance for us to see where we are..



  • Hosted Moderators Posts: 9,574 ✭✭✭fitz


    Would love to see a pairing of Osbourne and Farrell in the centers, but more likely to see Osbourne at 15.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,068 ✭✭✭50HX


    If club & country have any iota of sense Osbourne will go at 12

    Post edited by 50HX on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    This is what they definitely they should do. But then, who is the alternative to Keenan?

    I'm not happy what Leinster and Ireland are doing with Osborne. He could end up like Frawley. Frazzled.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,568 ✭✭✭✭phog


    When we did have a viable option for FB we left him out of the squad, even with Keenan heading off to the now defunct 7s, but now, since Haley returned from injury I wouldn't think he's of the standard required.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,660 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    JOB has shown he can play there and there's a number of talented young lads coming through



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,075 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Osborne is getting a lot of game time in the Ireland team. He wouldn’t be getting that if he was only being played in the centre.

    I think that’s a good thing tbh.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,889 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Ah, players being utility backs at early points in their career is a tale as old as time in rugby. Frawley is where he is cause he ultimately isn't good enough in any of the positions he covers to push to be a starter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,750 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Yeah, how many AB centres and FBs start out on the wing. It's very common in the test game to see guys come in at wing and move to centre, though not in Ireland.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,994 ✭✭✭RichieRich_89


    My thinking is it's likely there'll be quite a lot of continuity of thought from selections made earlier in the season. Coughlan and Devine made the EI squad, but Gunne was selected for Ireland 'A'. Now, it could be that they just wanted to have a look at him and maybe he didn't impress, but on the face of it making the A side is a higher grade than with Emerging Ireland. Also, the third choice scrumhalf pick is likely to be a potential pick, because he's possibly unlikely to see gametime. So, yes, at the moment Gunne isn't the third best available 9, but maybe they feel he has the highest ceiling.

    Similarly, in relation to where Gavin plays, the selection in the A international was 12. Gavin, 13. Postlethwaite. Of course, Gavin has featured more at 13 for Connacht since then, so there's extra information to consider now. But Postlethwaite has also mostly been playing at 13 for his Province, so I think it's quite likely the alignment from the A game won't be altered.



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