Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Lot of 'student union' type of discourse

Can you quit this bloody nonsense.

if you're querying the point I was making, I wasn't - I was just making a statement.

But on reflection, and to make an actual point, I don't often see Germany linked with the Holocaust except in documentaries/historical contexts. But any reports on Israel would almost certainly be couched in terms of them being found guilty of Genocide (if the ICJ finds that of course).

It would be rather like the situation where Israel demands that everyone clearly condemns Hamas in any reporting of the Gaza situation. So, to be fair, I think they will do the same for Israel should the ICJ find they have committed Genicide. If that transpires, we might see reporting footnotes of Israeli news items on Gaza/West bank etc. saying stuff like "Israel was judged to have committed genocide in the Gaza war of 2023-2025 after x thousands of Palestinians were starved/killed" etc.

And to be clear, I would imagine that would very hard on Israelis who absolutely want no part in this massacre. That would be unfortunate and I think unfair.

There were some very good reasons for this:

1. The total destruction of the United Kingdom was never sought by the IRA. "The troubles" were never a fight to the death for any country. By contrast, Iran and its proxies (including Hamas) seek to grind Israel out of existence in its entirity.
2. There was a large natural barrier between the island of Ireland and the UK mainland, so that even if there was a desire to destroy the UK completely in this country, it would have been much more difficult to pull off something like a 7/Oct attack.
3. Until around the 1980s and the start of the IRA's "mainland campaign" there was no threat to the island of Great Britain.
4. The IRA was never anywhere near as depraved in their attacks as Hamas etc have been.

None of these mitigating factors apply to Israel.

Claims on behalf of the South Africans that they are "legally obliged to prevent genocide" are at best, self indulgent and hypocritical.

A country where open calls for the deaths of minority groups are not just tolerated but openly embraced by considerable swathes of the population, and furthermore where either tacit or open support for the "right sort" of genocide (e.g. Ukrainians, Tibetans, Uighurs, Inner Mongolians as well as domestic Afrikaners), is a not country I want to take a lecture on "genocide" from, because clearly in their country, this is a word without meaning.

Unless of course, you need a stick to beat the Jewish state with … then they take a break from singing "shoot the Boer" and kissing Putin and Xis' backsides to 'remember' their so-called 'legal obligation'.

SA is a fundamentally sick and morally bankrupt society with a lot of deeply depraved people. Their stance on Israel should be viewed in that context.

Someone had posted a comparison with the Troubles in Northern Ireland.

Remind me:

1. What was the objective of the IRA during the troubles?
2. What is the objective of Iran and its web of proxies, including Hamas?

What percentage of the electorate voted for him or his party? The majority of the Irish electorate didn't vote for for FF or FG combined never mind on their own. Nowhere near a majority voted for labour in the UK and the same goes for many democracies. I've no idea about Israel but this should be looked into before making generalisations about them.

Take the last Gazan election in 2006 for example I don't think the majority of Gazans even supported what turned out to be Iranian proxies. Imagine they called themselves Change and Reform. If only people knew what sort of change was to come.

The result was a victory for Hamas, contesting under the list name of Change and Reform, which received 44.45% of the vote and won 74 of the 132 seats, whilst the ruling Fatah received 41.43% of the vote and won 45 seats

Really? Do you have a single shred of evidence to back up the accusation that Israel intends to attack Egypt and Jordan?

I'm also not sure why you're accusing me of racism for mentioning the group Palestinian Islamic Jihad as PIJ are a real group allied with Hamas.

You mean this map?

Netanyahu Shows Map of 'New Middle East'—Without Palestine—to UN General Assembly | Common Dreams

Say what you will about it - it most certainly does not include any of Egypt or Jordan.

And can you clarify what you meant by accusing me of racism for mentioning the group Palestinian Islamic Jihad? Are you defending PIJ?

yes that map. Why are bits in green? Are they bits still to be invaded and assimilated? Like the ones on the badge idf soldiers wear?

and you said Palestinian islamic jihad not PIJ, you deliberately wanted to conflate Palestinians and islam with terrorism. I'll give you a chance to redeem yourself. Surely you don't condone the slaughter of 250 Palestinians today mostly women and children in terror attacks by the Israeli stablishment?

or the Israeli terrorist attack on the humanitarian aid ship in international waters last week?

The countries in green are the ones they want to be friends with. Obviously it excludes countries like Iran. And I still have literally no idea what you are talking about regarding PIJ.

Hamas and PIJ could put your theory to the test very easily, by surrendering. They refuse to do so.

Thanks for condoning those Israeli terrorist crimes. Makes my job blocking you easier. There are children tonight terrified that Israel will kill them in the their sleep. And Israel will do that. Some of those children will die in their sleep tonight tomorrow and ad infinitum. And you don't care because either they're not your children or you are being forced in some way to condone this. I honestly don't see any other reason or answer to your deplorable conduct. You are clearly islamophobic racist and support genocide. I don't dont know who you are and don't want to.

Nobody in this thread, that I can see, is showing a single shred of support for Hamas. Can you point me to a single post professing support for them?

I don't care who they are a proxy for - Iran or whoever, and I don't care how many hostages they hold - none of that justifies what Israel is doing to millions of civilians. None of that justifies witholding food to hundreds and thousands of kids. None of it justifies blowing up hospitals.

Sean makes out that the presence of Hamas not only justifies this, but from what I can see, he actively supports it. His points are a disgrace.

And by the way - he is the number one poster in here to slander anybody criticising Israel as antisemetic, whilst ironically being the most guilty party I have seen on this site for using antisemitism in trying to shoehorn all Jews as some hive mind complicit in this genocide.

'Proxies for Iran' would be a major over-simplification. Palestine has been on the receiving end of oppression by the colonial settler apartheid project known as Israel for the last 80 years. It would be incredible if didn't have a violent resistance or insurgency movement. Proxies for Iran would suggest that it is the Iranian regime which is pulling the strings and fermenting the conflict.

Bad news late this evening that Netanyahu's much vaunted major new offensive against Gaza is now underway with the name 'Operation Gideon's Chariots'. The **** is clearly completely out of control at this point.