Immigration and Ireland - MEGATHREAD *Read OP for mod warnings before posting*

Nope. As I've said many times, we've done our part as a nation and as a reward we will be stuck with the consequences of it for generations to come. Ireland has fundamentally changed and we're seeing the consequences reported more often in the media as it can't be ignored or swept under the rug anymore.

I'll keep saying it - we're a small island of 5 million people, massively dependent on foreign investment and job creation, and with fundamental decades-long issues that we can't solve. We've more than "done our part".

We can't afford to take in any more "refugees" - legitimate or otherwise - and we are already struggling with the societal effects of what we already have. It's these latter problems that will become paramount in years ahead as they have already in places like Germany, the UK, and Sweden. Communities have been ignored, concerns demonised, services stretched to breaking, law and order breaking down with it, and a hardening of our previously generous and welcoming culture in the face of mass abuse of it.

I don't care what "obligations" we theoretically have. We've already seen several of our European "friends" bend, rewrite or just ignore their own "obligations" in the last year - including Germany who are arguably the most responsible for it all in the last 5 years or so. Obligations and laws are only such until they are changed or abolished by legislation, itself generally dictated by "realpolitik".

We've had the "good times" of ideological crusading, agendas and "feelz good" governing, but as has happened before - not that long ago either - these things tend to change and disappear quickly in the face of economic hardship and social unrest. Given what's happening in even the last 3 days in the markets, the party is about to come to an abrupt halt. Anyone who was an adult 17 years ago will know what comes next!

Of course, our politicians will wait for the decisions to be made for them by our "betters" and "friends" in the EU but times are changing. The goodwill and patience shown by our people has already largely evaporated in the face of the mounting problems it's caused, but the freebies and favouritism will go next, and so too will many of the acknowledged opportunists who magically will find somewhere else to go, maybe even back home and for more than a holiday this time! We'll be left with the rest, and the social and economic bill for it!

I never hope for (and certainly am not looking forward to) tough times but they do have one benefit - it tends to reset a lot of the nonsense and focus minds on the real issues, at least for a while. As an open economy that's also handed off more and more control to others, we have even less chance of avoiding it anyway, but it might allow us to catch our breath on this particular issue at least.

This being Ireland, I certainly don't expect us to learn from it, no more than we did after 2008, and I fear that many of the issues caused by the massive influx of new arrivals in the last 15 years (accelerated massively in the last 5) are now irreversible. We're well on the way to the same problems seen elsewhere, and as I've also said before, there's zero reason to expect different outcomes here - if anything it could be even worse because of our institutional incompetence.

I said many years ago on this site that this issue would be the defining one yet and we're fast approaching that point. As I said at the start of this post, Ireland is fundamentally changed and not all of it is for the better. Despite our (paper) wealth, fancy coffee shops, foreign holidays and new cars, we are in many ways poorer and more isolated than we were 40 years ago.

Not all of this is unique to our country of course, but we will feel the effects much harder and faster because of our small population, small communities outside of the cities (even just Dublin), and the apparently deliberate self-sabotaging efforts of Government who have put the needs and wants of random others before those who are ACTUALLY deserving and constitutionally entitled to those efforts and support.

Our role as citizens and especially if parents should be to work collectively to make things better for all of us and leave the country in a better place than we found it. Well, I fear that when many of us look back in the next few decades we'll have to face the uncomfortable truth that we've failed badly in that regard, and then explain to our kids that it'll be them who'll have to live with/in it.

Not a conversation to look forward to!

Careful now the term far right is regularly hurled out by that poster to anyone that does not agree with him.

Mod - warned for uncivil post

This is daily sport levels of hyperbole. A paper where once I seen in one of those it's a fact boxes the following line. "Sheep can see through walls and are being used in country terrorism efforts"

Law and order is not breaking down in "Germany, the UK, and Sweden."

Do you want to pick any one country and outline how law and order can be declared as broken over the past 15 years?

You having a problem with immigrants in the past and still having a problem with immigrants doesn't prove anything. Except you have long had an issue with immigrants. It does give an indication of why you might look there only for the problem rather than any of the other actual causes.

Name one way ireland is "poorer and more isolated than we were 40 years ago."?

80 percent rejected at first instance and 70 percent rejected on appeal is not " very very few " who are not genuine . !

The only very few is the number of final decisions given the backlog and the high numbers still coming .

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/number-of-appeals-by-people-denied-asylum-in-ireland-up-over-300-last-year-1640917.html

AfD now level with CDU in Germany at 24%, CDU losing 5% since election, this is what happens when you ignore your election manifesto in a rush to get into govt with the detested SPD, who incidentally have been in power in one for or another bar 4 of the last 25 years

How do you know ?

Difficult to understand what you mean sometimes you should have been more clear . Very few of those positive decisions are not genuine would have been clearer .

The link does show many chancers are applying which was being debated . I would think they are given the benefit of doubt as every aspect of their claim cannot be verified . Eg the vetting process that is prone to failure .Those whose countries refuse them entry . Those who made claims in other EU or the UK not returned but given leave to remain . Those who are here over 5 years and those with children .Those who entered into sham marriages or had children to remain .

Even if/when they're rejected, they can just appeal the decision. Apparently 30% of the decisions are then overturned.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/rise-in-number-of-asylum-seekers-appealing-rejected-applications-to-stay-in-ireland/a924270328.html

Unsurprisingly the appeals process is falling behind as well.

Not to worry though, I'm sure it'll all get sorted out when they've stuck around long enough to be handed citizenship in one of those ceremonies that RTE like to promote. After all, we don't value our communities or our services, or our own needs, why should we value citizenship?!

So you think people should not be allowed appeal .

And if they do and they succeed they are still suspect in your eyes ?

Yes it's very slow process alright and those pesky appeals slow it down more.

Would you prefer we just refused 7 out of 10 straight away and deported them ?

Be much quicker , sure why bother with little issues like legalities and human rights .

Where do you propose we house all these people while their appeals are (slowly) processed?

It's as if there's no housing crisis in immigration world.

Where's the infrastructure for all these new arrivals?

Ireland has largely the same infrastructure it had three decades ago with an additional million plus people living in the country but we shouldn't question the continuous arrival of people or else we're somehow bigoted.

It's hilarious how lefties defend this situation, because it's their arch enemies the rich who are profiting the most from it, shuttering businesses to cater to the IPAS system taking piles of tax payer money to cram as many people as possible into it whatever premises they can muster.

The asylum system in Ireland is just another form of cronyism, the government paying their rich buddies off as usual.

We used to have left wing politicians who'd call this type of crap out, now we have left wing politicians who are cheer leading for it.

The Irish left has lost its way completely. It happened when they began prioritising the needs of people outside this country over those in need within it.

I admitted to not understanding your post which was not clear .You made a distinction between those granted asylum and those granted refugee status .

I gave more reasons that asylum seekers who are granted leave to remain can circumvent the system .The post was edited read again .Admit I was wrong to what we just disagree .

Posted previously about the costs of the new EU pact. The costs of the current system will be running in tandem until it is fully operational.

https://x.com/Nick_Delehanty/status/1908780108069974421

The data can be found in a report issued by the DoJ on 26/03 before anyone claims the linked X post is rubbish or misinformation.

This is a very angry post aimed at " lefties" .

Are you calling me a leftie ? Should I be grateful that you didn't lump me with "far left " ?

I am certainly not either that or supporter of a government who have allowed our housing and services crisis to be used by " righties" (if you want to refer to people in a lump ) to further their niche and angry anti immigrant views by using IPAS as scapegoats for the situation we all find ourselves in .

The joke here is I entirely agree with all you say about the carpet baggers profiting from our government's ineptitude .

What I don't agree with is scapegoating refugees nor do I agree that " the left has lost its way " or that they are in any way culpable or responsible for the state of the country ! Now that's hilarious😂

How can they be when they have not been in power for over 14 years ?

And if you are talking about the Greens well say it . Don't lump all parties in Opposition as the Left . I don't accept that a minority group like them or PBP encompass the views and represent the entire Left Wing in Ireland .

Where did I scapegoat refugees? I never mentioned refugees once.

Unfortunately PBP do represent the left in Ireland, they engage in preposterous behaviour and the likes of the Soc Dems et al don't have the backbone to stand up to them.

Left wing politics in Ireland is now characterised by the likes of the scumbags spitting on Israeli tourists or driving cars at anti immigration protests.

It's difficult to hold the moral high ground when you refuse to actually call out the bad behaviour of the extremes of left wing ideology.

You'd go some way to find anyone excusing the ideology of the likes of the National Party or it's splinter groups but the extreme left are part of the scenery of Irish politics. How the hell is that even a thing?

I'm sorry, but as long as moderate sensible left wing people (I used to count myself in that group until I couldn't tolerate what the left has become) refuse to call out the utter nonsense spouted by the Paul Murphys and Boyd Barretts etc you're going to be associated with everything they say and do. Lie down with dogs and you'll get up with fleas.

I'm still none the wiser as to why you said I was scapegoating refugees.

Maybe try being the change you want to see in the thread, just a thought.