Immigration and Ireland - MEGATHREAD *Read OP for mod warnings before posting*

You are assuming that the consequences of "progressive" immigration policy's have played out already and that is just not true at all.

The assertion that because these countries you have referenced have high immigration and poll high on the OECD better life index then mass immigration and irregular immigration is of benefit to these countries, you've acknowledged it yourself the fact of high immigration doesn't mean that its causing the higher index. If you look at immigration policy then surely that would be an indicator of the experience of these countries and their reaction to what is essentially an experiment in multiculturalism.

Sweden for example has moved what would be described by many on this site to the far right on immigration,

https://government.se/government-policy/the-governments-priorities/migration-and-integration/

"Extensive immigration in recent years has caused major strains on our society. Integration problems now impact most policy areas. For this reason, the Government is overhauling migration and integration policy to create better conditions for successful integration. Sweden offers fantastic opportunities and conditions for everyone to succeed. What is important is not where you come from, but rather the will to be part of Swedish communities and what you are working towards. Swedish communities are held together by the Swedish language, self-sufficiency, the rights and duties associated with citizenship, and respect for Swedish rules, norms and values. Those who come to Sweden must respect our democratic values and live honourably. The expectations and requirements for becoming part of Swedish society must be made clearer and stricter to preserve our open and free society. Those who do not wish to become part of this community should not come to Sweden."

Could you ever imagine an Irish politician saying the above, the backlash from media and academia the accusations of racism and xenophobia - Sweden has experienced mass immigration and huge numbers of asylum seekers and because of the experience has the above policy now. It had its lowest numbers in decades of asylum seekers last year.

https://archive.ph/RYA2r

Johan Forssell, 45, who took over the government’s migration department in September, said: “We are implementing what we describe as a paradigm shift in Swedish migration policy, and we are doing this with a very outspoken agenda that we want to limit the number of people seeking asylum here in Sweden.“This is not because we don’t like these people, or because we don’t understand that many of them might face a very difficult situation — you might want something better for yourself and your family — but because of the fact that we will never be able to manage the enormous task of integration in the right way if you continue to have such a high influx of immigrants every year. It’s impossible.”

“What happened during the refugee crisis was that all these very nice words, all this open-heart policy, met a very tough reality,” Forssell said. “The biggest challenge here is not receiving very many people — I mean, we can find housing for people coming here. The difficult thing is the integration part of it: finding schools, finding apartments, giving people the possibilities to find work.“This turned out to be much more difficult than many people had anticipated. I believe many Swedes knew this already from the beginning but in the political discussion in Sweden there was a very strong underlying force that this is the way it should be. Many of the questions regarding this were portrayed as being very small-minded.”

Australia has much tougher immigration policy than Europe.

In Germany The AFD a party linked with strict immigration policys has seen its popularity rise from 10% in 2021 to 20% in 2025 by the next election on that trajectory it will be the largest party in Germany.

France just banned La Pen from running for president - because she was top of polling in France.

True.

Do you beleive there was no political motivation for banning her from running for 2 years?

Can you explain the precedent for banning her from running?

Granted, if the details are correct she did not personally profit from any of the money - so its 100% not politically motivated we are saying that.

Crazy to think we have a former politician who gave blank cheques to his boss which were cashed for large sums that were unaccounted for, failed to have a bank account and received several "dig outs". He might be our next president though..

I think in truth, we all unfortunately know this makes her very qualified for public office 😂

Well I'm not assuming that the consequences have played out — I'm simply stating that when people talk about the likes of France and Sweden and the mistakes made in those countries, it's often accompanied with a level of alarmism that appears to ignore that every quality of life metric places those countries very high. So whether due to immigration or in spite of it, the evidential basis doesn't quite appear to demonstrate that these countries have undergone or are undergoing some form of national suicide.

Beyond that, the Swedish experience of "shifting to the right" also demonstrates that there remains plenty of scope for adjustments on policy when people feel it is necessary to adjust.

And again, it's all part of the wider problem with how immigration is discussed. Sweden can't be said to be a very successful country where its migration levels do not appear to have had any enormous impact on its status as a high quality of life country but with notable issues of migrant crime and ghettoisation — it has to instead be that Sweden has fallen, it's a disaster, a mess, has descended into hell and only now is clawing its way back. It just doesn't stack up to reality and it doesn't stack up with an argument that they have committed some form of national suicide.

A real refugee? One leaving there home because it's about to burnt out or bombed?

None. They ceased to be refugees the minute they left the first safe country they landed in.

Do you believe someone found guilty of embezzeling money should be allowed to run for public office?

If this was some pro-immigration politician and not someone whose views closely align with yours, I reckon we'd be having a very different conversation.

I'm nearly in tears reading that woman's victim-impact statement. Our government should be ashamed of themselves and I have no doubt this will get worse

Mod Edit: Warning issued for trolling

Sorry, from Jordan.

Average annual wage of about 10,000 Euro.

So conceivable that he had saved up 6 to 7k just to blow it all on his jaunt to Ireland where all he contributed was to ruin a woman's life and get himself a very lenient prison sentence.

I'm sure he'll get right on with contributing and making Ireland a better place just as soon as he gets out of prison.

It's insane that we are willing to throw innocent women and children under the bus to facilitate this utter madness.

Does the rise of "far right parties" as the only plausible and direct countenance to immigration policy not directly correlate with your evidential basis. If a party runs on its "anti - immigration" policy and then its popularity doubles would that not be direct and quantifiable evidence of unhappiness with a very specific policy presumably because people are beginning to see issues and not because they have all of a sudden become xenophobic.

Would a government policy document that I have linked above in a country as liberal as you will find in the world "Sweden" which directly references the detrimental impact that mass immigration and integration has had on many aspects of society to the point that it says we are implementing a "paradigm shift" in its policy to limit asylum.

How does Sweden fix the problem it has? It does so by limiting immigration and incentivizing those who arrive to return home. That doesn't solve the existing problems within the country caused by policies implemented years previously, how will that play out? Its literally a live experiment on multiculturism. Someone referenced earlier in the thread a link in a BBC article on the education of migrants via classes as to how you treat women. A big red flag would surely be the need for such classes.

Do you think Irish politicians have examined whats going on in the rest of Europe and planned accordingly - do you think they have a plan to integrate 33k asylum seekers currently in direct provision into a country of 5 million?