Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

A Palestinian life is not worth less than an Israeli one—they are equal in my eyes.

Sure, In "your eyes"; but not in your (purported) Israeli friends eyes. For all your "Where is Michael D" whataboutery below; I am sure you didn't highlight this to your "friends" when they made that statement; easier to tell others off though….

However, Israel has a duty to protect its people, just as any sovereign nation does.

And what you have failed to recognise, tellingly, is that the Palestinians fall under that duty of protection umbrella but it's administered very differently. But tell me again about how equal you see them all.

The reason Palestinian civilians suffer is that their own leaders use them as human shields while targeting Israeli civilians. If you truly care about Palestinian lives, the first step would be holding Hamas accountable for its role in perpetuating their suffering.

Pathetically simplified and, unsurprisingly, inaccurate.

As I mentioned in my previous post, the execution of protesters in Gaza by Hamas has been met with silence. Where is the outrage from Micheál Martin, Michael D. Higgins, the EU, and others? If the death of a Palestinian truly matters, then why is there no condemnation of Hamas' murders over the weekend? Does a Palestinian life only have value when Israel is involved?

Absolutely there should be condemnation of what Hamas have done; but it also highlights the sheer stupidity of other posters saying the Palestinian people should simply "walk away" from Hamas. They are an abhorrent organisation and one that has come about due to successive Israeli governments rule over the region.

I think we’ll have to agree to disagree on the future of Gaza. I’m an optimist by nature and firmly believe that Gaza, without Hamas, has the potential to be a peaceful and prosperous place. I want Israel and its people to live in peace with Gaza and its residents, and I truly believe that a Hamas-free Gaza is the first step toward achieving that. Time may prove me wrong, but I’m willing to stand by this belief for the sake of peace.

Again, simplistically inaccurate to the point of trolling.

Regarding Palestinians in Jordan and the West Bank, many fled wars initiated by Arab nations. Israel didn’t force Palestinians to remain stateless—their own leadership and neighboring Arab states did.

Israel didn't force Palestinians to remain stateless……So why not allow the two state solution…..or treat them as equals (you're a fan of that word when it suits you) in the state of Israel?

If the "right of return" is so important, why is it a one-way street? Should Jews expelled from Arab nations also get their property back?

The issue of "Right of return" is simply a worry for Israel as it would tip the demographic scale; they cannot accept that.

while Israel is defending itself against terrorism and existential threats.

Threats that they created.

If you believe Hamas or the Palestinian Authority should have full sovereignty, then ask yourself why they have repeatedly rejected peace deals.

Why have Israel continously rejected peace deals and continued on with their land grab and, effectively, apartheid system….

I put it to you that it’s because their leadership is more interested in perpetuating the conflict than in actual state-building.

Ditto for Israel. Once a state engages in this multigenerational behaviour, then they are not ones I'll take seriously as wanting a peaceful outcome that benefits all.

I don’t just think all lives matter—I believe it. I’m not completely okay with anyone bombing anyone, but I understand that Israel needs to do so to protect itself and its people from an existential threat in Gaza. Like the vast majority of people in Israel, I don’t want war. War is an ugly, last-resort measure that becomes necessary in times like this. As I've said before, this war will stop if the hostages are returned, Hamas admits defeat and Hamas leaves Gaza.

No, Putin invaded Ukraine because he wanted to overthrow the pro-Western government and bring Ukraine back into Russia’s sphere of influence. There was no October 7th in the Ukraine-Russia war. Ukraine didn't attack Russia. The same can't be said for Gaza, Hamas - the aggressor - and Israel - the victim - on October 7th.

Do you think Palestinians face an existential threat?

I don't use/look at X.

But according to your own sources, you appear to be significantly exaggerating the situation.

Hamas has started executing those involved in last week’s protests

One execution, as abhorrent as that is, is not "the start" of a campaign of executions.

But no surprise - its straight out of the Israeli playbook - just like the medics killed yesterday. Hasbara and exaggeration.

The UN has said that fifteen Palestinian paramedics and rescue workers, including at least one United Nations employee, were killed by Israeli forces “one by one” and buried in a mass grave eight days ago in southern Gaza. Looks pretty much like a war crime to anyone

Just when you think this rampage can't get any worse....What a sick nation.

But of course it’s all necessary for Israel to defend itself, or something. Plus, Hamas, human shields, something, something……

Murder Most Foul -

https://www.rte.ie/news/2025/0331/1504989-gaza-red-cross/

The IDF tried to hide the bodies in a shallow grave with no dignity for people who risked their lives to ais others. Disgusting behaviour but not surprising with their record of War Crimes.

How anyone can still support Israel after this is amazing. 1060 Healthcare workers murdered by Israel in 15 months. What a record for this pariah state.

Don't you think it's a little disingenuous to refer to it as "some silly chant

Well I suppose I could just call it out as a "red herring", which is what it is.

As for the accusation that the Jews are "colonisers," if that is true, they're doing a really bad job of it.

"if"?. It is indeed true, as the Israeli state is colonising the West Bank, Arab East Jerusalem and the Golan apace.

Absolutely Hamas should release the hostages.

They have offered multiple times to do so as long as Israel ends the war in Gaza, releases Palestinian prisoners and allows humanitarian aid in. Hamas has also offered to leave Gaza entirely.

If Hamas released the hostages unconditionally, Israeli would pound what is left of Gaza firmly into the Stone Age.

Why do you think Israel keeps so many Palestinians imprisoned without charge? Even children?

Anyone watching the news reports directly out of Israel knows that Netanyahu and the Israeli Government do not want the hostages released.

1. The war must continue to appease the far right ergo the current govt. stays in power.
2. Netanyahu knows he will be excoriated when he is removed from govt - I wouldn't be surprised if Israelis took him directly to The Hague. At least, his trial for corruption will move a lot quicker
3. The far right want to cleanse Gaza, the West Bank and East Jerusalem of all Palestinians - they are massive fans of the Gaza Riviera plan.
4. "Between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty"

Whilst I wholeheartedly agree that Hamas release the hostages - I do understand why it is conditional.

Israel is well capable of perpetrating horrors that put events of the last 542 days in the ha'penny place. Hamas and the Palestinians know this. Hence conditions.

Regardless of the above - ask yourself this really simple question. Why, in 542 days, has Israel has not been able to rescue the hostages?

Not just "Rules of engagement".

They've committed equally horrific crimes against Palestinians inside the prisons in Israel.

And don't forget, "rules of engagement" apply to engaging enemy combatants. Remember that little girl in the car, surrounded by her dead family, "engaged" and shredded by a Merkava battle tank? The nuns "engaged" and sniped? The neonates in their incubators, "engaged" and left to decompose.

The IDF have no morals. At all. In any circumstances.

That 'public record' is unsubstantiated stuff that was published in newspapers.

Do you have any evidence for that claim? As far as I'm aware no official or unofficial investigation has yet concluded?

"most moral army" etc

Workers on a mission to help colleagues were buried in mass grave in southern Gaza, says humanitarian office

Fifteen Palestinian paramedics and rescue workers, including at least one United Nations employee, were killed by Israeli forces “one by one” and buried in a mass grave eight days ago in southern Gaza, the UN has said.

According to the UN humanitarian affairs office (Ocha), the Palestinian Red Crescent (PRCS) and civil defence workers were on a mission to rescue colleagues who had been shot at earlier in the day, when their clearly marked vehicles came under heavy Israeli fire in Rafah city’s Tel al-Sultan district. A Red Crescent official in Gaza said that there was evidence of at least one person being detained and killed, as the body of one of the dead had been found with his hands tied."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/mar/31/israel-killed-15-palestinian-paramedics-and-rescue-workers-one-by-one-says-un

There's 50 to 60000 people dead, more to come and you agree with Hamas that the hostage release should only be conditional?

God help the innocent palestinians.