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Cold Case Review of Sophie Tuscan du Plantier murder to proceed. **Threadbans lifted - see OP**

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,234 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN


    All too easily shot down- and that’s been the problem for the last nearly 30 years now - just on one of those pieces of so called evidence - “did he know her?”- not one person is 100% certain they even met once no less “knew her”- not one person.
    And that makes it just all so unbelievable that he would march up to her door at stupid o clock looking for sex- it’s not even a feicing theory it’s so bad - it’s just balderdash 😀

    I quoted a case in America previously on this thread where a loner man was found guilty of multiple murders of women over a period of time and states - he singled them out from a distance and murdered each one in a similar fashion - so it’s possible this murder could have happened that way- but it’s so bloody unlikely it was Bailey that did it in that way - unless he was a serial murderer- but that would then need the assistance of the UK police



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    It is a balderdash theory that "he marched up to her door looking for sex"

    The only people saying it are the pro bailey mob

    Total red herring



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Rooks


    He was so horny, he marched across the countryside in total darkness and murdered someone with a giant rock, leaving no trace of physical evidence.

    But apparently his libido dropped massively after that night and he never did it again.

    Is that the theory?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 42,846 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Do you have an issue with circumstancial evidence

    You've replied twice without answering this time with 😌 whatever that means



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,270 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    Leaving no trace of physical evidence?…no one did and she was still murdered by someone…

    I already got shot down once on this but he was also clearly a malignant narcissist. She was someone of relative notoriety for the area at the time. A narcissist could want to hang around in the rarefied air. She was an artist, he fancied himself an artist. He knew she was there alone. I was shot down on the notion that she was of relative notoriety with suggestions the locals didn't know who she was but thats not true. There were locals interviewed in the documentary who talked about her and for Bailey's faults, the man was a journalist, he would have been in the know more than most. Not to mention it was suggested that Alfie told Bailey about her.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Id say bailey knew plenty about Sophie . Fancied himself as someone who would be of interest to her

    As you say he had an inflated view of himself and drink taken

    No suggestion or evidence that he went looking specifically for the ride that nite



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 42,846 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Do you have an issue with circumstancial evidence

    Nope but the DPP clearly does with what they were given in order to bring Bailey to trial.

    The "evidence" collated by AGS was a massive load of crap and pointed only towards a shoddy investigation. You were the one to introduce Lucy Letby, who was convicted in a completely different jurisdiction with stronger circumstantial evidence (despite its flaws) but please don't let that stop you posting your nonsense!

    You've replied twice without answering this time with 😌 whatever that means

    I didn't! I responded with 🙄 because if I didn't know better, you're trying to troll anyone who claims that it should be wholly an evidence based approach (without dodgy police practices) unlike the original investigation which appears tonbe completely based on target fixation! But as trolling is against the rules, I presume this is not the case

    Post edited by Seth Brundle on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Finally got there

    You're saying you don't have an issue with CE

    It wasn't at all clear up to now



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 42,846 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    I'm unsure why you'd think that. Many murder cases have seen convictions based on circumstancial evidence.

    However, the circumstantial evidence put forward by AGS to support their belief that Bailey murdered Sophie was unbelievably poor to the point that the DPP's office made the unprecedented point of publishing their rubbishing of every piece of evidence put forwards in a manner that took a scathing blow at the entire AGS case.

    So I'm at a loss as to why you think you've scored a point by me saying how I may not have an issue with circumstancial evidence



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Jaysus this was my query on this if you have an issue with circumstancial evidence or not



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Rooks


    There was physical evidence. We've been over this. But no evidence that Bailey murdered her. That's the part that ye just can't get into your minds. It's just impossible for some reason.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,635 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    He said he murdered Sophie on a number of occasions. He lied about his whereabouts on the night of the murder. His whereabouts can't be backed up by anyone for a number of hours on the night. He gained new injuries on the night of the murder. He burnt a number of items behind his house soon after the murder. He had a history of being extremely physically abusive and sexually inappropriate to women. He stated a believable motive for the murder.

    For the reasons above and others, Bailey has been the leading suspect in this case and it looks like the cold case team also see him as the leading suspect. But for some reason you think you know better?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Rooks


    All I know is:

    1. I don't know who did it (neither do you)
    2. No evidence ties Bailey to the scene

    Can you change either of those statements?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,635 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    You ignored this part of my post:

    He said he murdered Sophie on a number of occasions. He lied about his whereabouts on the night of the murder. His whereabouts can't be backed up by anyone for a number of hours on the night. He gained new injuries on the night of the murder. He burnt a number of items behind his house soon after the murder. He had a history of being extremely physically abusive and sexually inappropriate to women. He stated a believable motive for the murder.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Rooks




  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 42,846 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,635 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    Why do you refuse to counteract any of the below?

    He said he murdered Sophie on a number of occasions. He lied about his whereabouts on the night of the murder. His whereabouts can't be backed up by anyone for a number of hours on the night. He gained new injuries on the night of the murder. He burnt a number of items behind his house soon after the murder. He had a history of being extremely physically abusive and sexually inappropriate to women. He stated a believable motive for the murder.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,270 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    Maybe I am mistaken then but from what I read in the Irish Times, they were unable to get a proper sample off the gate or rocks - or at least a proper sample for the technology used for analyzing the samples at the time. Their DNA testing was inconclusive as a result but they were hoping to reanalyze again with more advanced technology as part of the latest investigation.

    Bailey claimed there was DNA found that was not his or Sophie's but that was not stated by the investigators or confirmed, it was just stated by Bailey. All of that to say, it does not suggest the DNA evidence definitively said it was not Bailey just that it could not be used at the time to identify anyone. There was physical evidence but none that could be used to identify any culprit at the time.

    What is definitively true - the Gardaí made an absolute shite of the investigation and of preserving the crime scene. The state pathologist also had a lot to answer for.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Rooks


    All I know is:

    1. I don't know who did it (neither do you)
    2. No evidence ties Bailey to the scene

    Can you change either of those statements?

    (You clearly can't, I'll leave it there as you just don't seem to get it.)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Rooks




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,270 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    He seemed to intentionally put himself in the frame and keep himself there…because he was a malignant narcissist. Plenty of circumstantial evidence but need more than that to convict. I can understand why the DPP didn't bring a case forward.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,270 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    Yes, never said there was DNA evidence but also not daft enough to suggest Bailey definitely did not murder her just due to an absence of conviction by the Irish justice system that fluffed the investigation. I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out he had nothing to do with it but also wouldn't be surprised if it turns out, he was the murderer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,635 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    Oh yes and hopefully the new team are sorting that out but the circumstantial evidence pointing in his direction can't be disputed and it's why he has always been the leading suspect, rightfully.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    According to Maloney the bailey case wasn't wasn't handled by the DPP himself but an aggressive jobsworth type who had beef with the DPP office

    Apparently this is the way the office worked .Cases were shared out and this helps explain why the case was dismissed in the manner it was

    Anecdotal but as worthy of mention as most of the rubbish that gets posted here

    Mod Edit: Poster warned for trolling and baiting

    Post edited by Necro on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 962 ✭✭✭flanna01


    Covered this a thousand times already.. Do please try and keep up with the thread:

    1. He said he murdered her a number of times - You purposely left out the context of them statements, and you know it. Very poor example of circumstantial evidence (if that's what you are angling at?).
    2. He lied about his whereabouts on the night - He was asked to fill out a questionaire several weeks after the murder, could you recall what you did a couple of weekends ago with precise information? (Maybe you could?)
    3. His whereabouts can't be backed up for the night of the murder - Why should anybody need backing up when retiring to bed for the night?? Silly statement. In fact, a very silly statement.
    4. What new injuries..?? Are you referring to the nick on the hairline? Was that not explained with killing turkeys & cutting down Xmas tree's? Maybe that's a little too mundane for the Hang Bailey Brigade?
    5. He burnt items out the back - No way!! Half the population of Ireland were doing the same at that time.
    6. He has an abusive history… - Ah, that old chestnut. I suggest you google the percentage of men in Ireland that have indulged in domestic violence, and follow that by the percentage of them that went on to brutally murder a female stranger.

    There is a reason why the DPP threw the case against Bailey out. Basically, it's because there is not one iota of evidence against him to back it up - It really is that simple.

    I haven't a clue if Bailey killed her or not? He might well have done for all I know? However, the evidence is not there to support such a conclusion.

    There is more circumstantial evidence against Alfie Lyons being the murderer than it being Ian Bailey, and I don't think it was him either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    All debatable on memory loss

    Was it actually several weeks before he was quizzed on his whereabouts . I thought it was sooner

    Bailey was allegedly too drunk to stumble over to Sophie's , if in fact he walked

    Yet he was well fit to remember his pressing newspaper article and get up to write it that nite

    Article conveniently left on kitchen table for his alibi with Jules that morning

    So that nite of the murder he was up writing and then I believe discussed the murder with Jules that morning with the new scratch on his head

    Then he was off to the crime scene and a busy day ahead

    Yet he somehow forgets all this and these events shortly after



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Everything with Bailey is supposedly easily explained away if you choose to do so

    The accounts of them having met

    Ah alfie sure he was only 90% sure in court !

    The confessions, sure he didn't mean it !



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,635 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    1. He said he murdered her and the people he told thought he was fully serious.
    2. He lied about his whereabouts, we know this because he changed his story.
    3. He has no alibi, that's far from a silly statement, far, far from it.
    4. The mad turkey and the dangerous Christmas tree sounds like a fairytale. You believe in Christmas fairytales?
    5. He burnt items that a forensic expert noted included items of clothing soon after the murder. Why did he lie about the fire if it was nothing?
    6. He battered his partner a few months before a woman was battered to death a few kilometres down the road.

    You're trying to minimise all of the above but you're failing miserably. As we saw in the McGregor case recently, the DPP are not infallible. The cold case team are assessing everything, they have looked at Alfie Lyons, they have looked at all the other conspiracy theories and it looks like they have come to the conclusion that it most likely was Bailey who committed the murder. Maybe you should send them a link to this thread and tell them to keep up.



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