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Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

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Comments

  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Can you disprove it? A quick Google reports plenty of kids identifying as animals.

    Not to mention pieces in national geographic over recent years about one lady convinced she was a lizard and adjusted her body with tattoos and surgery to match her beliefs. If memory serves, she killed herself. Then there's the guy who thinks he's an alien and has surgery on his body to remove parts of his face, fingers and toes along with dyes injected into him and metal implants.

    For the record, I agree with burkes stance on not recognising an ideology that has no scientific basis.

    Having said that, the way he went about it was unacceptable. The way he treats the courts is equally unacceptable.

    I wonder was the judge right last week in asking was he being coerced.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,784 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    For the record, I agree with burkes stance on not recognising an ideology that has no scientific basis.

    😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,548 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    For the record, I agree with burkes stance on not recognising an ideology that has no scientific basis.

    Like religion?



  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Unfortunately their behaviour contradicts their religious belief.

    We had a girl staying with us from Ukraine for a while. Despite painful periods every month which required sick leave from work, medication and doctors appointments. She told us she was neither female or male. The medical science contradicted her ideology.

    She left us to live with her boyfriend.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,959 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    I'm wondering how [often] the family communicates with Enoch while he's in prison. The rules are explicit on visits, letters, phones and chargers. https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=b901012d66eddb74JmltdHM9MTcyODg2NDAwMCZpZ3VpZD0wNGY1NWYyZi1lNDBjLTYxMDgtMTM3OS00YjlmZTU0MTYwOWUmaW5zaWQ9NTIxMg&ptn=3&ver=2&hsh=3&fclid=04f55f2f-e40c-6108-1379-4b9fe541609e&psq=What+are+the+visitation+rights+of+prisoners+in+Irish+prisons&u=a1aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY2l0aXplbnNpbmZvcm1hdGlvbi5pZS9lbi9qdXN0aWNlL3ByaXNvbi1zeXN0ZW0vdmlzaXRpbmctc29tZW9uZS1pbi1wcmlzb24v&ntb=1



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,822 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    On second thought…deleted.

    This is not the thread for it, and I'm not going down the rabbit hole of having to explain the differences between sex and gender, and orientation and attraction.

    If people want to be remain willingly ignorant, that is on them.



  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You think I'm ignorant because I disagree with it. Far from it. It's a belief.

    I believe I am am brick. Science says I'm not. My DNA says I'm not. No matter what I believe I'm not a brick. I might get shaped like a brick but I'm not a brick.

    If you want to believe I'm a brick and agree with me that's up to you but a rational person wouldn't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    That's like asking if I can disprove that God exists. YOU posted it, YOU prove it.

    What I can prove, however:

    1 - that article does not have a single checkable fact in it

    2 - you totally believe it dispite this.

    Again: there is NO evidence that ANY child in Australia EVER identified as a cat and was accepted as such by the school and allowed to use non-verbal communication. None. Nada. And yet you see fit to believe it and spread it for the sole reason that you WANT to believe it.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 43,058 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    You saw their medical details that contradicted "her ideology"?
    Why do you give a crap how your lodger describes themself as and what has it got to do with you anyhow? Surely your only concern was that they abided by the terms of the "tenancy" or did you overstep your role?
    What's the relevance of who they went to live with?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    His religious belief is not based on science.

    It's amazing how much people quote and claim science in transgender debates and then go on and defend religion.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



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  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Read my post again. I didn't defend his religious belief. I said his behaviour contradicts it. I really wish people would read what's written instead of reading their own bias into it.



  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Another one who reads their own bias into what's written.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 43,058 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    I honestly wouldn't agree with your claim that I'm the biased one!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,822 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    Again, I think you may be another who conflates sex with gender, but in this day and age, not educating yourself on the difference between the two is remaining wilfully ignorant. And doubly so, when you may be faced with it in your workplace, (as EB has discovered). That is my view.

    Unless you are personally affected, there isn't actually anything for you to agree or disagree with. In your case, your house guest's gender identity (or anyone elses) was entirely about them, and had nothing to do with you or anyone else.

    If anything is irrational, it is is making comparisons with animals, inanimate objects or anything else in a discussion on how humans identify their gender. Animals are not a gender. Inanimate objects are not a gender. So not only is it ridiculous, it is just completely immature and disingenous. In my view, of course.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,548 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    But their religious belief isn't based on science.

    You do see the hypocrisy in agreeing with them, no?

    Also I am pretty sure the person that stayed with you wouldn't be best pleased you blabbing about their medical conditions online.

    If they exist at all.

    Either way, Burke is in jail because he behaved like a dangerous creep, fúck all to do with your prejudices.



  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Another one who actually needs to read what I initially said.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,548 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Yes everyone is taking you up wrong, nothing to do with you.

    You are not posting in good faith so have a good one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    You said: For the record, I agree with burkes stance on not recognising an ideology that has no scientific basis - His stance is based entirely on his religion - and religions ARE ideologies that have no scientific basis.

    If you agree with his stance, you defend his religion. There's the contradiction.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Gender is an ideology. It's a belief system. I don't have to agree with someone's belief system . Just like you don't agree with my belief system. Just like you don't agree with burkes religious belief system.

    People here need to realise it's ok to not agree with them. Making me or anyone else agree with a belief they don't agree with just because you think it's right and they're wrong is dictatorial.

    What Burke has done is flout accepted norms of behaviour in hijacking public events to air his disagreement. Just like he broke the law by standing outside the school every day and trespassing in occasion. An action force which he is in jail for.



  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Where did I say burke being in jail wasn't to do with him breaking the law. I've made that quiet plain.



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  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I have never defended his behaviour irrespective of his religion. I'm fact I've said the opposite.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,816 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    They used to say the same about homosexuality. They used to say that either people chose it and therefore groomed young men to be gay, or that it was a perversion that they had no control over and therefore were dangerous.

    Here's the thing, we got over that based on two things. One was science. the other was gay people showing us who they were. We now accept being gay is completely natural.

    It's the same with trans people. I don't understand them. I have no idea what it would be like if my brain was telling me something different to my body when it came to my gender. My gender aligns with my birth sex and my brain can't comprehend it being any different. However i know that for some people it's not like that. How do I know? because they exist. They can tell us exactly what it's like. And all the medical professionals who work with people like them confirm this. The alternative is a massive conspiracy where every trans person and all the doctors are just pretending.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Never said you did. What was it you wrote about people actually needing to read what was initially said...?

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,548 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    It's not accepted anymore to bash gay people so the bigots have moved on to the trans people.

    It's as simple as that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,822 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    If gender is an ideaology, (which I disagree it is) why do you automatically accept "male" and "female" as such?

    Look, the bottom line for me is, what anyone's personal opinion on transgender, non-binary, or gender fluidity really doesn't matter to me.

    I don't care what anyone's opinion is, or whether they question if it is real or not. What matters to me, is how those who identify as trans or non-binary are treated. Whether that is in public, and especially in the workplace.

    If someone asks *you to use a preferred pronoun or name, accept their request. Don't be an asshole about it. Keep your opinions on their identity or mental health, to yourself. Be respectful, do your job, and go home at the end of the day. After all, at the end of the day, it doesn't impact on your life or how you live it.

    Because you can be sure, your HR, and the WRC, will not back you up if you don't. Making "a stand" on it will not end well. As EB is learning.

    *generic you.

    Post edited by Ezeoul on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,822 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    @Grayson

    Very well said.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,300 ✭✭✭hoodie6029


    This whole saga is going to end like the South Park Kanye West episode, isn’t it?
    Enoch will break and come out as trans one of these days.

    This is water. Inspiring speech by David Foster Wallace https://youtu.be/DCbGM4mqEVw?si=GS5uDvegp6Er1EOG



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,617 ✭✭✭Hamsterchops


    Well it's a belief system, and you either believe in it & go along with it, or you don't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,784 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    Ok, just to spell it out, gender dysphoria is not an ideology nor is it a belief system.

    Religion is (can be) an ideology and is a belief system.

    Gender dysphoria has a scientific basis.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,064 ✭✭✭scottser


    I'm wondering why mods aren't pulling this thread back on focus.

    It is universally accepted that Burke is not in jail for his beliefs, therefore discussion of those beliefs is wholly irrelevent to this thread. It is interesting (and not a little concerning) to note that there are a number of people who genuinely believe this is a matter of conscience, even though the courts have been explicit on the matter.



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