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Key Bridge in Baltimore collapses after being hit by a container ship

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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,559 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    As others have said on the thread, anyone visiting the US and spending time there often notices the decaying infrastructure. It's bad in the east coast cities and worse in the mid-west.

    We often joke about the US being a 3rd world country wearing a Gucci belt. It's perhaps not the best analogy, but incidents such as this one? Hammer home the disparity apparent that the richest country in the world and it's infrastructure seems to have.

    From railway derailments, bridge collapses, many state & local govt funded roads & infrastructure creaking from age, & lack of maintenance. This latest collapse is a symptom of disjointed and chaotic funding and responsibilities.

    On the topic of this collapse, yes it was initiated by the collision of a ship. Yet, no mitigation or protection was in place around the piers, and the piers in a busy shipping lane are an immediately obvious point of failure. I don't know what the weight of the ship involved was, but imagine 40000 tons moving at 8/9 knots impacting the pier of a cantilevered bridge is a recipe for disaster.

    My thoughts are with the victims and I hope that if nothing else? This latest collapse focuses minds and funding on US infrastructure issues.



  • Registered Users Posts: 39,689 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    They don't.

    They declare it so they can get federal resources and funding.

    Specialist federal rescue teams, etc.

    A major piece of infrastructure has collapsed, Billy Bob with an angle grinder isn't going to suffice.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,493 ✭✭✭monkeybutter


    imagine if this happened in ireland, it would be the story of the year



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,597 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    There doesn't seem to be a bridge left to repair.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,920 ✭✭✭circadian


    While a ship strike caused the collapse there is no denying the atrocious state of infrastructure in America. After the Oroville incident there was a paper released stating that some insane number of dams are in poor condition. I believe something like 200 have collapsed since 200. Bridges, roads and railyways are in the same sorry state.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,493 ✭✭✭monkeybutter



    1. did you see the size of the ship, now look at the size of the bridge
    2. if they are 3rd world, where are we? a country that struggled to build one spaghetti junction on our busiest motorway and instead put in a round about
    3. have you seen the rail infra here?


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,169 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    I was just about to say the same thing. There’s very little to repair, what remains will have to dismantled and they’ll have to start from scratch.

    15,000 people employed at the port of Baltimore aren’t going to have much work for a while.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,614 ✭✭✭Feisar


    I answered the question you were hell bent on getting an answer on but instead of saying oh, fair enough, instead I've underlying issues! You could also have used other common boards speak, give yer head a wobble, take a good hard look at yourself.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,881 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    I can't see any excuse for the US's infrastructure maintainace issues.

    They spend twice as much on law and order than on welfare. If they want to reduce spending in some areas to increase the available budget for infrastructure maintainance, I can make a suggestion.

    That said, it looks more likely to be a ship maintainance issue than anything to do with the bridge.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    Some of the MAGA brigade on various websites appear to be trying to exploit this tragedy and blame Biden, saying there's money going to Ukraine but nothing for infrastructure in the US.

    Truth is about 90% of money for Ukraine actually stays in the US, a lot of what was sent there was old stock the US would actually have to pay to destroy such as cluster munitions, the bridge was being fixed, and its not Biden's fault the captain of the ship couldn't steer it properly.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,169 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    The ship completely demolished one of the supporting columns, after that a total collapse was probably inevitable regardless of the bridge’s condition.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,812 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    isn't a large part of the problem that the Republicans have become infested with libertarian types who hate any form of government spending, so every second administration the budgets get slashed.,

    "You want a bridge over that river, work hard and build your own bridge, don't expect other people to do it for you! And if you want to build it to shoddy safety standards, that's entirely up to you, the market will decide whether people want to use it."



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,162 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    How do you know it was “the captains” fault?

    There were two pilots who know the waters on board guiding the ship to or from the port.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,881 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    The Republicans and the support for them is beyond my comprehension; they are literally anti-democracy. What's even more toe curling is they are the serial offenders when it comes to budget deficits. The usual pattern is the Republicans wreck the economy and finances and then Democrat governments come in and work like dogs to try and repair the damage, though that pattern has broken down a bit in more recent times as it all seems out of control since interest rates went to zero and negative.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,493 ✭✭✭monkeybutter


    it seems to be more of a ship maint problem than a bridge one



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,559 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    1.did you see the size of the ship, now look at the size of the bridge

    A bridge over a busy shipping channel was left with single point of failure on each pier. Yet, no mitigation or protection of the piers appears to have been in place.

    if they are 3rd world, where are we? a country that struggled to build one spaghetti junction on our busiest motorway and instead put in a round about

    I've spent a lot of time stateside, much of it spread over the east coast and Texas. Once you move off the interstates? The roads quickly become a lottery unless using turnpikes. It becomes rapidly akin to driving the 1990's N7 or N20. Our infrastructure here has improved massively since 1990, whereas in the US it has stagnated and in many places, honestly regressed.

    Our roundabout if it's the Dunkettle you mean? Could and should have been a spaghetti junction. Light gated roundabouts are a pain in the hole and we should have done better.

    .have you seen the rail infra here?

    Yep, I have, I have the misfortune of needing to change in Limerick junction if I'm heading towards Dublin or Cork. It's still a journey I prefer to the Amtrak Boston - Baltimore corridor.

    When was the last derailment here? Or the last fatal accident (not including suicide)?

    The US rail system has about 1300 a year. Granted that's down from a peak of 9400 in 1978. Further to that, when was the last rail derailment in Ireland, even in the EU that resulted in damage such as that in East Palestine last year? That was just 1 Norfolk southern's many.

    Safety in the US, despite the efforts of OSHA is still seen as a negative cost.




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    Fair enough. That was actually my next question, was there not a pilot on board.

    These ships have such mass and momentum that unfortunately they cannot be stopped or corrected quickly once they head off course. Surprised there isn't more incidents like this.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,162 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Sounds like this ship might have had issues:

    CCTV and marine tracking data shows the container ship lost power for around 60 seconds about four minutes before it hit the bridge. It appeared to adjust its course and start smoking before impact.

    The vessel's individual incident response service has been mobilised, Synergy added.

    According to ship tracking website VesselFinder, Dali had been involved in a 2016 collision at the Port of Antwerp as it tried to leave the port.

    It said the vessel had "substantial stern momentum" causing the collision with a stone wall of the quay.

    The berth where the ship had been docked was "seriously damaged and closed for cargo handling operations due to safety reasons", the website said.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,597 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    Not relevant to the immediate incident, but this is a decent summary of one example of some of the other infrastructure issues the US faces.




  • Registered Users Posts: 81,922 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Takes years from law to repair of a massive bridge



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  • Registered Users Posts: 81,922 ✭✭✭✭Overheal




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,730 ✭✭✭aidanodr


    Here is a video of a drive across this bridge when it was intact. Thats some bridge ..




  • Registered Users Posts: 24,742 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Looking beyond the immediate tragedy that bridge looks like it is a massive part of the cities transport infrastructure and is gonna cause a lot of headaches until it is eventually replaced.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,912 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    it's no wonder some people have a phobia of going over long bridges.

    My first thought was a row between the two pilots. Who was boss, one didn't agree with the other and the eye went off the ball. Just a theory in my head, and I am in no doubt that maintenance, infrastructure, and so on both re the ship and bridge could factor too. As you can see I have zero knowledge of bridges or ships, so I'll be following with interest to see. Sad loss of life, but it would have been quick I'd imagine, not that that is any comfort if you are plunging into the Patapsco River. RIP.

    We shall see.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,169 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    It was before my time. I just remember it from textbooks. I think I saw the video afterwards more recently.



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,922 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Days until a passage is cleared for ships but after postmortem, reopening the shipping lane is the next top priority to the port. Will disrupt traffic in the Baltimore area for years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,169 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    That might be the Bay bridge. Which is massive. I drove across it years ago myself and it is a sight. Actually, after looking at that video in full, I think its too small. You'd have been a couple on mins driving across the Bay bridge



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,559 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Before your time🤨 If only you had pulled your finger out and actually had an infrastructure week when you were Top dog 😉



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,169 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    There were no bridge collapses in my time. Only before and after.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,099 ✭✭✭✭2smiggy


    as I find myself amongst new bridge engineers , no amount of maintenance would have made a difference. A different design where a section would have collapsed rather than the massive section that did ?



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