General Premier League Thread 2023-24 Mod Note in op 27/6/23 And 21/05/24

~Rebel~ · 06-11-2023 05:03AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121330555#Comment_121330555

ah ffs, its actual meaning and intention is very clear, and always has been. There's no place for it in football, or society.

kowloonkev · 06-11-2023 06:49AM

Post removed by mod.

~Rebel~ · 06-11-2023 07:18AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121330615#Comment_121330615

I think if you ask random football fans what's the first thing that comes to mind with that chant, 95%+ will say Hillsborough. And much more importantly, if you ask any of the families of the 97 victims what's the first thing that comes to mind when they hear that chant, they'll say the same thing.

The "well the name of the disaster is not specifically stated" thing is just a cynical get out that's used in an attempt at plausible deniability. Everybody knows what it's invoking.

stesaurus · 06-11-2023 08:44AM

Post removed by mod

eagle eye · 06-11-2023 08:54AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121330632#Comment_121330632

In today's social media society it is. Brainless and quick to find guilty, that's what we are dealing with these days.

It doesn't matter about the truth.

I'm not sure about it but usually the chants are a dig at the opposition and not as awful as is being suggested here. Obviously there are some horrible racist and homophobic chants out there.

Thing is with this one, it's like it's encrypted or something if you want to decide it's a direct attack on what happened at Hillsborough.

It's a bit like how that awful newspaper acted at the time of those awful deaths. That's accuse and ask questions later.

If it is an attack on Hillsborough then it should be punished and all those instigating it should be banned for life from all football grounds.

I hope it's not and Luton fans were never like this back in the late eighties and early nineties. Times move on though and things change.

Augme · 06-11-2023 09:08AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121330814#Comment_121330814

No, it not just about Hillsborough but that is the main driver behind it. The fact you know it's about Hillsborough and you still try and justify how it's legitimate to sing it says it all about you.

noodler · 06-11-2023 09:35AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121330814#Comment_121330814

Amazing.

On so many levels.

Man City apologized when their fans sang it earlier in the year And Carra had to call it out yesterday.

Have you even read what you said? Even if it "wasn't just about Hillsborough"?

McFly85 · 06-11-2023 09:38AM

Aside from the fact that the song is obviously connected to Hillsborough, the idea that millions of fans of one club have some sort of collective victim mentality is one of the most ridiculous things I’ve ever heard.

NITRO95 · 06-11-2023 09:40AM

You can take issue with Liverpool and their fans re the way they respond to footballing decisions. I certainly do

BUT

Always the victim undoubtedly stems from the Hillsborough tragedy. Its tragedy chanting and has no place in modern society

irelandrover · 06-11-2023 09:49AM

When I first heard the chant I assumed it was about Liverpools reaction to the Diaz offside decision.

When I saw that it got such a response I looked it up and it is now clearly about Hillsborough. Even if that wasn't how it started out, that's what its about now. Anyone caught should be banned.

kowloonkev · 06-11-2023 09:54AM

Post removed

artanevilla · 06-11-2023 10:03AM

Whether the chant is partly or wholly about Hillsborough, it's unacceptable. Everyone (well not everyone it seems) knows the origin and connotation of the chant and referring to Liverpool fans a "victims", the Luton fans knew well what they were doing, I don't think there can be any doubt about that.

Augme · 06-11-2023 10:04AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121331083#Comment_121331083

So you admit the song is related to Hillborough but think singing it is perfectly fine and that Liverpool fans shouldn't be complaing about a song that's related to Hillsborough being sung.

Very classy of you. If dickheads wanted to sign songs about Hillborough they can just signing "Always the victim" as everyone know, and you've even admitted yourself, that song relates to Hillborough.

golfball37 · 06-11-2023 10:34AM

The victim mentality thing is a Tory construct aimed at the people of Liverpool as a whole not just the soccer team. When you consider what happened in April 1989 it’s pretty disgusting.

Opposing fans sing feed the scousers to Everton fans too.

TitianGerm · 06-11-2023 10:35AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121331127#Comment_121331127

It says a lot about someone to say something like that and try justify tragedy chanting. I'm not shocked though to be honest.

K-9 · 06-11-2023 10:40AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121331083#Comment_121331083

It's about as subtle as a sledgehammer in the face.

Being charitable, always the victim means Liverpool fans were the victims of Hillsborough so are always the victims, or some cutting edge socioeconomic satire like that.

Why would people use the deaths of 97 people to make a point?

noodler · 06-11-2023 10:58AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121331083#Comment_121331083

Your interpretation is fucked tbh

DM_7 · 06-11-2023 11:28AM

Mod note - couple of warnings applied and posts removed. Please move on from the meaning of the chant as it is clear what it means, what it means to those it was aimed at and the intent of such chants.

jacool · 06-11-2023 12:35PM

The beautiful game, has, sadly, always and continuing, a less than beautiful fan base.

noodler · 06-11-2023 12:54PM

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/nov/06/premier-league-10-talking-points-from-the-weekends-action

Nice to see.

Jinglejangle69 · 06-11-2023 01:30PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121326807#Comment_121326807

Arteta and Arsenal have been calling the PGMOL out for months and asked for a meeting months ago after bad decisions.

I didn’t see anyone back him then.

https://www.tntsports.co.uk/football/premier-league/2022-2023/mikel-arteta-unhappy-with-pgmol-apology-after-var-error-only-be-satisfied-if-they-give-me-the-two-po_sto9393557/story.shtml

This is from February.

McFly85 · 06-11-2023 01:51PM

I do think it’s unrealistic for managers to call out injustices on behalf of other teams publicly.

Everything they say is said with a view to being beneficial for their own team. Arteta will say he’s unhappy with something that happens to Arsenal one week to put it in refs minds to stop it from happening again, and he’ll be more diplomatic about other things not affecting Arsenal so it doesn’t sound like he has an issue with the quality of refereeing overall.

Privately though, the clubs themselves should be holding PGMOL to account for every obvious wrong call/apology throughout the season to ensure they don’t happen again.

Mitch Connor · 06-11-2023 02:24PM

I think Havertz should have been sent off, but I also think Newcastle got very lucky. Bruno G should absolutely have seen red.

It also annoys me that Ten Hag is so passive about the poor decisions United have got this season.

The Spurs penalty decision is so frustratingly bad, and he says nothing. Arsenal/Arteta know what they are doing, at the least they are putting pressure on the refs to give the subjective calls their way. While no one cares if United have decisions against them.

SlickRic · 06-11-2023 03:54PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121332132#Comment_121332132

Yet he said this about referees after the Diaz debacle: “I think they are trying to make the best decisions, they are trying to protect the game, they are trying to get as much support and be ruthless when they need to be."

So yes, it's tribalism. People have an issue when it happens to their team, not before.

Having said all that, anyone genuinely equating the Arsenal decision to the Diaz one are insane. The Arsenal one was 3 subjective calls where the referees all deliberated on each individual decision and came to a conclusion. You can have an issue with the end result, but the system at least worked and you got a decision they all agreed on, and it was implemented. The Diaz one had the referees agreeing that it was a goal, but confusion meant the goal wasn’t awarded. That is complete and utter incompetence and objective failure, with no subjective argument against it as a fúck up.

Yes, the common denominator is bad officiating. But the Diaz one is the one that really should’ve brought about change, but the likes of Arteta essentially ignored it. If you can’t force change on the back of that one, then it won’t happen. Whether we like it or not, on pretty much every decision they can always argue a bit of subjectivity. They couldn’t with the Diaz one.

So Arteta can do all the moaning he wants because he had his chance to help affect change, and he blew it, because in reality, he doesn’t actually care about the integrity of the game. Not one bit. He cares about HIS team, and that is it. If he cared about the game, Diaz’s goal was the chance to press it home.

tayto lover · 06-11-2023 07:29PM

There would be no discussion on this if Raya had just caught the ball as he should have done. It was an easy catch. However that was a foul on Gabriel every day of the week. VAR is badly broken or even worse.