Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

The German/Israeli likely dead woman that was paraded naked through Gaza was at a festival for peace.

Her bank card was used afterwards in Gaza.

Interview with her parents

https://archive.ph/WgXp5 (German)

Off your chops on disco biscuits and they laid that **** on you! Awful.

Two state solution was the only solution to this whole thing. Both states would have thrived and Palestine would have just been another bordering country that hated Israel.

I presume the red sea ports are why a two state solution never materialised.

As with seemingly everything nowadays, the culture wars destroy everything. So much of the internet discussion and indeed wider offline discussion on this is driven by idiots who refuse to see beyond their own internet "tribe". Everything is either black or white, there is no nuance.

Thus we get people who are openly defending the mass slaughter which was perpetrated by Hamas yesterday, because to say otherwise is to give some succour to the other "tribe". If you say that it's wrong and it's sick and it's grotesque to parade the dead, raped body of a woman on the back of a pick up truck, somehow, you are "selling out".

We then get people calling for the wiping out of Gaza. If you say that's wrong, those people round on you, because somehow then you're apparently giving succour to the murderers yesterday.

If you say that the murders yesterday did not happen in a vacuum, that they are a tragically inevitable outcome of seven decades of systematic Israeli oppression against Palestinians, you're apparently "condoning terrorism".

If you make the point that western media don't care about Israel's systematic oppression, war crimes, demolition of communities and colonial expansion, you're apparently "with the terrorists".

If you make the point that you greatly sympathise with the plight of the Palestinian people but you reject Hamas and you fear what Hamas is, you're classed as being "with the war criminals of Israel".

If you make the point that many people who support the plight of Ukraine are being total hypocrites by supporting Israel, woe betide you.

If you make the point that many people who support the plight of Palestine are being total hypocrites by supporting Putin's Russia, woe betide you.

It is remarkable and almost impressive how stupid public discourse on so many issues has become. Thank you INTERNET and INTERNET TRIBES.

Not everything is a conspiracy.

This attack massively weakens the far right as they are the ones in charge at the minute and this has happened on their watch. It’s the governments failure to prevent this and half of the messaging from them for years has been “you need us to stop these things happening”.

If I was daft enough to think there was a conspiracy afoot I’d assume it was actually coming from the left in this case.

As an aside I find the Russia thread a good way of keeping up to date with events but unsurprisingly this thread is a mess of people screaming either ‘anti-Semite’ or ‘glory to Palestine’ at each other.

I’m always fascinated at the massive support Palestine gets from Irish people considering morally they are polar opposites to us and if they were in the Israelis shoes they would make it a goal to cause as much misery and suffering for us westerners as possible. You may dislike it but Isreal shares our values to the extent that they are the same as us bar which deity they happen to pray to. The primary difference is the Israeli society has been extremely hardened by generations of siege mentality considering every single neighbour has explicitly stated the goal of completely annihilating them and have actively pursued this goal for decades.

Irish people empathise with the Palestinian people in a general sense for very understandable reasons - the fact they were ethnically cleansed off the land they lived on by an invader. Because they are penned into small parcels of that land, are under siege, regularly have their homes demolished, see family members slaughtered by IDF bullets, because Gaza has regularly come under the fire of Israeli fighter jets with massive loss of civilian life. Because what Israel has imposed on Palestinians is barbaric.

That the Jewish people suffered the greatest historical outrage humanity has ever seen doesn't change the fact that what Israel has done over the last seven decades has been barbaric.

To acknowledge this does not mean you support Islamism. It doesn't mean you support Hamas, no more than sympathising greatly with the plight of Catholics in Northern Ireland meant people supported the Provos. It doesn't mean you support slitting the throats of civilians. It doesn't mean you support parading dead, raped bodies of women on pick up trucks.

I don't share the values of either the Israeli government or Hamas. Both are repulsive. Political Islamism, of which hatred of Jews is a central part, thrives throughout the Arab world now because of hardship, because of oppression, because of naked propaganda. Israeli society has become radicalised into fanatical hatred of Palestinians because of suicide bombings, also because of historical echoes, also because of naked propaganda, in a state which has never had a real desire for a fair and just peace.

No i dont hate the jewish religion or its believers. I hate isreal the state as it is apartheid treating some within its territory as sub human.

Nice way of arguing. Trying shuting down criticism of a terroist country by labeling it as an ism to critcise it.

Not sure. I dont think russians see Ukrainians as below them or sub human like the wsy isreal see palestinians. I think the Russian state sees the Ukrainian state as subordinate as smaller and and should play to its tune. But the nstion of people themselves dont.

Except you are

is that in reply to my post? If so, explain how I condoned murder or rape.

Israeli media reports 400 dead and 2000 injured

I condemn hamas/Iran both want and celebrate this as gaza is a fermenting ground it needs to be levelled

Lots of Palestinians enjoy a quality life in Israel only those brainwashed want to continue the fight despite been offered supports from the west.

They have used a new level of brutality in this invasion so may they reap as they sow

Once the battle enters destroyed built up areas the tanks and modern equipment will be less effective. Hamas could do a lot of damage then.

It is undeniably distressing and morally reprehensible when any group, such as Hamas, chooses to engage in the kidnapping and killing of innocent civilians. These actions not only violate basic principles of humanity but also undermine any legitimate cause or grievance that may be raised.

Palestinian children have grown up in an environment marred by violence and instability, witnessing the loss of their loved ones and the destruction of their communities. They went wild when they got a chance to enter Southern Israel.

The Russian/Ukraine conflict has demonstrated the significant impact of drone technology on modern warfare.Considering the advancements made by Iran in this field, it is intriguing to ponder the potential damage they could inflict on the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF). It is indeed perplexing that Israel would miss an attack of this magnitude. One can't help but wonder if their intelligence capabilities are truly lacking or if there is another underlying reason behind their oversight.