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2023 RWC Buildup, Squads, Fixtures 'etc'

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,711 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    I think if the WC shrinks it has to give Tier 2 something meaningful in return, and something aspirational to play for. Otherwise the game will collapse given Tier 1 is hardly itself in rude rugby health. Arbitrary slashing of participants won't solve the broader problems



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    I don’t really see how your preferred sport / code to watch says anything about how much you know about sport.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,711 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    An important caveat with the GAA is that the shít counties still play Dublin, Kerry etc - they're not arbitrarily shut out of competitions because of some lopsided power structure built into the governing body. They're given the same options and potential for climbing up the ladder as anyone else.

    Whither that for Georgia in rugby? At this stage theyd have to win the world cup before getting into the 6 nations .



  • Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Thurles Sars and Loughmore was a good attractive club hurling game yesterday. But their are a lot of club games, with lesser known club teams it's hard for neutrals to get invested in. A football game from Monaghan or Cavan for example.

    Many would tune in to Romania v Scotland as it's international. You still see a lot of skillful play, from the likes of Darcy Graham etc, when they're putting a minnow to the sword.

    There's also the kinda, Christian getting killed in the coliseum element, where you want to see can a team put 90 to 100 points up in 80min! Obviously it's not near as satisfying as an even tough game like SA v Ireland. But watching Swanlinbar v Cavan Gaels could be a good game but it's very parochial.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,154 ✭✭✭✭thebaz


    agree, I'd be even in favour of expaning 6 Nations by 1, allowing a promotion (and relegation) - but yeah fully agree tier 2 nations need more big games.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭robbiezero


    Why would that Japanese team not have made it into a 12 team WC?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭robbiezero


    Hard to think of a tournament where there are as many one sided games.

    3 of the last 4 games have been 50+ hidings

    And the next 4 games could well go the same way and probably should do. Worryingly for rugby, the Australia one might be the only slightly competitive game of the 4.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae


    No it's not an utterly terrible idea whatsoever. Rugby is not a competitive enough sport to have more than 12 teams in their world cup. For whatever reason , most countries don't commit enough to it at all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,020 ✭✭✭boetstark


    If its so great and competitive, and ahead of other sports , why are stadiums half empty for most gaa games apat from finals.

    Typical gaa insular comment, any other sports know f all about sport. Gaa is best field sports in the world , fact 😁😁😆



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,020 ✭✭✭boetstark


    It's a gaa mentality , big fish in a small pool attitude.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae


    You know why they aren't in the six nations. Nobody fancies a trip to tbilisi. People love Rome though.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,383 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    I'd rather go to Tbilisi than Cardiff anyway



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,908 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Japan beat South Africa at the world cup while not being in the top 12 qualified teams.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae


    So would I hahah but Wales shouldn't be in danger of being turfed out. Although it would be funny.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,908 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    They currently would, but would never have reached that level, and would never have been in the tournament they got their most famous win, if not for the world cup being more than 12 teams.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae


    Great , so you have given one example in the history of the rugby world cup? So there should just be countless boring hammerings so something like that might happen again in 30 years time?



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,908 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Fiji beat Wales and qualified for the Quarter Finals in 2007 while not being in the top 12 qualified teams.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,908 ✭✭✭Dick phelan


    What the hell have Italy done with all the funding they got? For me Japan is the most disappointing. Big population was looking like they were really going places beating us and SA in the WC. I really thought they would consolidate themselves as a top team. Any reason they haven't pushed on?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    You know Japan then went onto beat Ireland in the following World Cup after their win in 2015 vs SA, right?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae


    The Japan that can qualify yeah? That same Japan? What rank were they when they beat Ireland???



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    But surely ascending into the top 12 and then staying there is exactly the type of development you’re talking about, right?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,130 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    With so many games that even the most enthusiastic rugby fans wouldn't sit through, if they could be bothered changing channel in the first place, the last month has been a waste of time (Australia and Scotland aside). Funny thing is if the groups hadn't been messed up in the first place with the top seeds it would have been even worse. Tournament needs to be smaller.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,198 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    That one seems pretty marginal to be honest. 8 automatic qualifiers, 12 teams had to qualify. Fiji comfortably qualified through Oceania in second place with two places available. First place/second place was just separated on points difference and it's a big leap to assume all results would have been the same if first place had actually mattered.

    Of the other 12 teams who had to qualify, I think only Samoa, Argentina and possibly Italy would have been considered superior to Fiji at that time. So in a tighter qualification campaign I'd say they'd still have squeaked into a theoretical 12 team 2007 WC.

    2007 Rugby World Cup qualifying - Wikipedia



  • Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The WC will take off at the quarter finals, same for many tournaments. You just know this uneven games stuff is the thin edge of the wedge to have a go at rugby in general.

    I like all sports. There's nothing worse than an ultra in any sport. Be it GAA, Soccer, Athletics, Rugby etc.

    The club championship in GAA, bar when my own club is playing or a big clash feels hollow for me at this time of year. It has none of the colour, vibrancy, intensity of high summer intercounty.

    You can hear every voice on the sideline and many in the crowd. Dank, dreary atmosphere which even good play can't get rid of.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭lbunnae


    That's no the same for many tournaments tbh. As another poster said , a pointless month. There's no tournaments where the first full month is a waste of time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,130 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Outside of the 6 nations, Australia (for now given Union seems to be in terminal decline there), Argentina, New Zealand, South Africa and maybe Fiji - I think everyone would accept that is the real tournament. There is no competition beyond this.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,875 ✭✭✭Buddy Bubs


    What is the equivalent of an 80 point beating in other sports? As in how uncompetitive the match is? We've seen a few 70, 80 and 2 90 point matches.

    I was thinking about this yesterday compared to soccer. Soccer much more difficult to score than rugby at all levels, and setting up defensively can be seen as a clever strategy to maybe grab a draw. Can't do that in rugby.

    So I decided in my own head that tries are twice as common as goals, so a 4 try to none win is like a 2-0 soccer win. Subjective I know. And probably factually incorrect. But just the nature of rugby games on average having more scores than soccer.

    An 80 point score in rugby likely has 12 or 13 tries. Cut this in half and you're at 6 or 7. Sometimes the minnows get a try so it's like a 6-0 or 7-1 match something like that. And a 40 point win likewise would be a 3 goal win as regards how competitive the match is.

    How often does 6 or 7 goals happen in a soccer world cup? Probably once, maybe twice a tournament. 3 goal wins, probably 6 times. A guess.

    So rugby is certainly more uncompetitive at world cups. Mainly down to the bottom quarter of teams getting hammered multiple times, until Italy turned what should really be a 40 point game into almost 100.

    It's also a fact that in rugby once a game is running away from you it's nearly impossible to muster the effort required to stem the tide, you need to attack to defend, in soccer you can crowd the goal mouth and stop things getting worse.



  • Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't think NZ v Fra, Ireland v SA were pointless. I doubt England found it pointless, topping their group. Argentina and Australia, the later gone, had very meaningful games. Fiji definitely aren't finding it pointless. Also smaller nations celebrating a victory at the sport's biggest competition.



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  • Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Same as any competition, Gaelic Games, even soccer. France, Croatia, Argentina etc all the usual suspects at the quarter finals. And a surprise team. Bit like rugby, Japan, Fiji the surprise. Though in fairness the surprise team in soccer can come from anywhere. But gaelic football is a closed shop. Since 2003, 20 years, you had Cork, Dublin, Donegal, Kerry, Tyrone win the AI. In a 32/33 team competition.

    In rugby you had England, SA, NZ Since 2003. A competitive Australia up to 2015, a competitive France in 2007, 2011.



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