Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

14-09-2023 09:18AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107640#Comment_121107640

How do you know we don’t do that? Has there been anyone other than Enoch who was put in prison for civil contempt and was let go, without purging, after a period?

Your biggest problem is you’re living in a fantasy whereby he can carry on wasting court time and make inroads back to employment.

I won’t bother correcting the fallacy any further as I’ve realised long ago there is no point at all.

If you have a case of civil contempt with release sub purge though let me know. As far as the Christmas release last year I believe the judge at the time stated it was largely due to burke exploiting his contempt and prison time for his own ends.

ohnonotgmail · 14-09-2023 09:29AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107383#Comment_121107383

He was sacked for his behaviour not his beliefs.

Quin_Dub · 14-09-2023 09:29AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107383#Comment_121107383

All utterly irrelevant due to his behaviour.

He doesn't get to seek the defence of the law when he has refused to recognise its existence at any stage in the process.

Any attempt at claiming discrimination will go something like this.

Enoch - Your Honour , I was discriminated against based on my Religious beliefs.

Judge - Did you lodge a formal complaint and raise this issue though the appropriate channels and then fail to get a satisfactory response?

Enoch - No your Honour , I never raised a formal complaint at all , instead I chased my employer around the room at a public event shouting at her and had to be restrained by other Staff members so that she could leave. I then ignored my official suspension and refused to leave the school resulting in over a year of court cases and fines that I have refused to pay. Oh I also called all the other Judges names and refused to purge my contempt, but I was discriminated against your Honour.

Judge - F*ck off Enoch (I'm paraphrasing here)

14-09-2023 09:36AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107383#Comment_121107383

There is no avenue for appeal on human rights as there is no right that allows for being a tool.

Boggles · 14-09-2023 09:37AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107795#Comment_121107795

Has there been anyone other than Enoch who was put in prison for civil contempt and was let go, without purging, after a period?

Yes, civil contempt as you pointed out is supposed to be coercive not punative.

As far as the Christmas release last year I believe the judge at the time stated it was largely due to burke exploiting his contempt and prison time for his own ends.

And what do you think he is doing now?

Your biggest problem is you’re living in a fantasy whereby he can carry on wasting court time and make inroads back to employment.

Where did I say that? On the contrary.

The game doesn't change.

Burke has no intention of getting his job back, this is about Martyrdom and the grift that comes with it.

Maybe worth reading what posters are saying instead of diving straight in with illogical accusations.

Annasopra · 14-09-2023 10:09AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107383#Comment_121107383

So what.

ECHR won't entertain him.

14-09-2023 10:36AM

European Court of Human Rights???

Ah here would ye ever listen to yourselves 😂

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 14-09-2023 10:39AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108087#Comment_121108087

It's Enoch. I wouldn't put trying past him. The exposure would be too good to turn down.

ohnonotgmail · 14-09-2023 10:42AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108105#Comment_121108105

There is no route to the ECHR for him. he is not being sacked for his beliefs. Appeals to labour court decisions can only be made on points of law.

tayto lover · 14-09-2023 10:46AM

Imagine if he actually got back to teaching in that school and on the first day he could hear children singing '' Happy Birthday to Them ''. I'd say it would drive him even more bonkers than he already is.

L1011 · 14-09-2023 10:56AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107383#Comment_121107383

There is no route for an appeal based on religious freedom to be taken in a case that never involved it.

Burke cannot make a case about being fired for abusive behaviour towards a superior in to a religious freedom case no matter how much he or Mammy thinks they can.

Quin_Dub · 14-09-2023 11:11AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108185#Comment_121108185

Exactly - His complete lack of engagement with the process from the start shuts off pretty much every single appeals pathway.

He can't "appeal" something that never happened.

He never formally challenged the request to use Pro-nouns etc. - He went straight to roaring at his boss leading to his suspension for unprofessional behaviour etc.

So his religious rights have never been impinged because he never gave the employer the opportunity to "impinge" them.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 14-09-2023 11:15AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108120#Comment_121108120

Yeah, I know - and I think he knows his job is gone at this stage - but he could challenge on it being an infringement of his rights to express his religion. Even if his belief was nothing to do with his sacking.

Hotblack Desiato · 14-09-2023 11:19AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107220#Comment_121107220

Not going to happen

The State actively supports and protects in law the 'right' of religious ethos schools to discriminate in the hiring / retention of staff on religious grounds, the enrolment of pupils on religious grounds, and discrimination during the school day on religious grounds

They will not take a case which risks bringing the whole rotten system down

Donald Trump · 14-09-2023 11:47AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121099999#Comment_121099999

I don’t think anyone should effectively have to serve a life sentence for contempt of court.

Contempt continues until you purge it. So if he was let out and continued on, he would be still committing it.

An analogy would be a person who is given 6 months for assault going out and continuing to assault people and thinking "Ah sure, I've already served my time for assault"

ohnonotgmail · 14-09-2023 11:51AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108261#Comment_121108261

but it isn't about that. his sacking was never about that. you can't appeal on something that was not part of the decision to sack you.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 14-09-2023 12:24PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108399#Comment_121108399

I'm not talking about the sacking

ohnonotgmail · 14-09-2023 12:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108535#Comment_121108535

but that is what his court cases are about.

Boggles · 14-09-2023 01:42PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108553#Comment_121108553

No they aren't because he technically hasn't been sacked.

Assuming he gets sacked a whole new range of legal redress opens to him.

14-09-2023 01:43PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108105#Comment_121108105

I don’t think you understand how the ECHR works? Do you seriously think you can claim discrimination without ANY evidence and they’ll give you a hearing date?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 14-09-2023 02:04PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108851#Comment_121108851

I'm saying I wouldn't put it past him trying.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108105#Comment_121108105

I never said he'd succeed, I never said he'd get a hearing and I never said he's do it to get his job back. HE believes it's about his rights which is why I wouldn't put it past him.

L1011 · 14-09-2023 02:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108990#Comment_121108990

You don't get to even try without a coherent basis. That's the point

ohnonotgmail · 14-09-2023 02:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121108843#Comment_121108843

a whole new range doesn't open up for him. he gets to appeal to the labour court. the labour court will decide if a legal mistake was made by the WRC. it is not a relitigation of the case.

Boggles · 14-09-2023 02:34PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109129#Comment_121109129

That's 2 more mechanisms to keep him in the news at least.

You can only appeal a labour court ruling on a point of law.

The WRC may find he is entitled to compensation for instance, it could be the school that appeals it to the labour court and so on.

So yes wants we assume he gets fired then yes this circus could go on for another year or 2 at least.

Like I said if an employer does not follow the process exactly the WRC will flag it.

https://www.ibec.ie/employer-hub/hr-management-guide/employment-equality/case-law/wrc-awards-almost-40000-to-manager-with-alcohol-dependency-who-was-dismissed-for-being-intoxicated

It is very hard sack someone in this country.

Quin_Dub · 14-09-2023 02:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109165#Comment_121109165

Given that he has been in receipt of a full salary this whole time , even if there was some procedural error he's not going to get compensation for it.

The school might get a tut-tut from the WRC and Enoch will be told to go away.

thesandeman · 14-09-2023 03:03PM

There's a half hour statement from mammy and one of his siblings recorded outside Mountjoy on his Twitter account now.

I haven't watched it myself yet.

Boggles · 14-09-2023 03:06PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109229#Comment_121109229

The WRC don't do "Tut-Tuts". They don't relitigate the case.

If they find Burke was sacked without proper procedure they can award him his salary post sacking up to nearly 40K. Now the school may be happy to pay or they may appeal it to the labour court.

Again I am playing devils advocate here, I have read enough WRC judgements over the past 8 years to know that you don't pre determine what their outcome might be. The case I highlighted above was not a one off incident.

But like I said the most likely outcome will be his entire family get hauled out of the room by the guards if it indeed does go to WRC.

14-09-2023 03:29PM

the mental gymnastics at play here to make the point burke can go legal is astounding..

for the record also he HAS been fired. His employment is terminated. The fact there’s an appeal hearing due does not change that fact.

this isn’t like if you’re charged with a crime where you have a presumption of innocence. The appeal panel is there to determine whether or not the due process was followed & they will no doubt use his behaviour throughout all of this when forming a decision.

How anyone thinks he has a hope left is beyond me. He’s finished, he knows it and he’s throwing an adult tantrum about it.

Try to remember also his sister tried this exact same crap with Arthur Cox and she never made it beyond WRC

Edit: that is she tried to claim her sacking was due to her religion, this was very quickly proven wrong. It will be the same for enoch. Just because he shouts loudly about his religion does not mean anyone with two brain cells to run together can’t see it’s a diversionary tactic.

European Court of Human rights.. give me strength lads

Boggles · 14-09-2023 03:50PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109468#Comment_121109468

make the point burke can go legal is astounding.

You do realise he was successful in halting his own appeal against his dismissal?

It is currently held up in the high court.

He is still technically suspended on full pay.

So yeah the reality is Burke can and is going legal, that's what these cretins tend to do, because they have the will and the finance.

Try to remember also his sister tried this exact same crap with Arthur Cox and she never made it beyond WRC

Edit: that is she tried to claim her sacking was due to her religion, this was very quickly proven wrong

It's been a while since I read about that case but I don't think there was a religious angle to it.

Hotblack Desiato · 14-09-2023 04:12PM

It's the Burkes. Everything has a religious angle.

Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

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