How long until we see €2 a litre and will it push more to EV's faster?

09-07-2022 11:40AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119312698#Comment_119312698

Only had a couple of experiences and we were clueless. The different payment methods meant we ended up paying at the end of one leg and then had to pay on entrance to another bit like 5 minutes later. 😅 The very last bit we did it had been ages since we'd gone through a booth and when we saw the toll were like "Oh, we've been going for the last 4 hours, this won't be good." And it wasn't 😅 I was pleasantly surprised with the Autostrada though.

LPG is available again and down towards €1 a litre again so I'm still in no hurry for an EV. 😅

Padre_Pio · 09-07-2022 12:37PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119312799#Comment_119312799

The ESB have 5 charging locations in the ring of Kerry. Each about 30-40 mins apart.

Plenty of chargers in Galway or on the Dub to Galway route so you can arrive at your friend's house with plenty of capacity.

You don't need an hour to charge. 30 mins will get you a fair distance on many chargers.

Cyrus · 09-07-2022 01:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119312799#Comment_119312799

Try putting your proposed ev and your route into a better route planner (abrp) and that will tell you exactly where you might charge, generally it’s not nearly as impossible as people imagine it to be and if you have an IONITY on the route it’s a short stop.

iColdFusion · 09-07-2022 02:03PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119310907#Comment_119310907

There is absolutely not public transport in place to bring a match day volume of people to Dublin in time for kickoff and home again from any two counties in Ireland, Croke park holds 90,000 people on top of all the people who want to use public transport for other things that day, are you mad like, maybe if Dublin and Kildare are playing 😄

The trains for todays match are already mostly sold out and we have no electric cars!

09-07-2022 02:21PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119312816#Comment_119312816

That formula was a back-of-the-envelope example of how it might work, and a zero emissions vehicle would have a correct multiplier of zero for emissions, that's the point.

By 2035 a revision would be needed again as only zero emission vehicles could be sold (new) after that date.

mikeecho · 09-07-2022 06:20PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119312799#Comment_119312799

People are being encouraged to buy an EV, even if it's not suitable for their needs. Reminds me of 2008, when we were all told to buy diesel because it was cheaper to run and cheaper to tax., And better for the environment.

Diesel did suit a lot of people, but it was also the wrong choice for many more.

With a lot of manufacturers ditching diesel, And only offering petrol , hybrid or electric, many might feel pressured into being an EV.

A friend recently bought a brand new car, and it is 100% diesel.

Horses for courses

I've had to make midnight runs from cork to Dublin for hospital emergencies, and I've horsed thru most of a tank of diesel going at well above the speed limit. I couldn't do that with a petrol, hybrid or ev, none would have the range when you're driving flat out

Seth Brundle · 09-07-2022 06:53PM

People are being encouraged to buy an EV, even if it's not suitable for their needs.

We get it - you and others are against electric because you have unusual requirements. However, despite some people needing to be able to drive long distances, the majority journeys could be made using an EV. The long distance drivers are outliers and, from a policy perspective, don't count.

Government policy will usually follow the needs of the majority. Currently an EV is deemed to be more sustainable than ICE and the policy is following that line. If you disagree with that then take it up with your TDs.

mikeecho · 09-07-2022 07:08PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119314373#Comment_119314373

I'm not against EVs , they are great for those that they suit.

Just like 2008 & diesel.

Wait a few years, and they'll be giving out about particulate pollution (tyres/brake pads) being too high due to heavy cars, and additional tax will have to added to EVs and tyres and pads.

It's known now that they are heavier on tyres and brakes, just like in 2008 it was known that diesel emitted higher amounts of Nox, but the big concern then was co2.

I've 3 cars and a motorbike, I'd buy an EV if one was suitable for my needs, but they're not just there yet for my needs, but they will get there.

(Maybe an electric motorbike would suit, as it's only for leisure.. but not worth the cost for the little use it gets)

If you doubt me, talk to an engineer who deals with lithium ion, I live with one.

Chris_5339762 · 09-07-2022 08:54PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119313248#Comment_119313248

Thats a really good website actually, will at least make me plan routes for when I eventually get an EV. Certainly my next car will be an EV (likely a second hand somethingorother) then take the petrol hybrid on longer runs.

The route was suggesting two charging stops totalling an hour between them (assumed a 40kW Leaf simply because I know no better). 10% getting home though, thats squeaky bum time I'd have thought. And 2 stops versus 0 stops for my current diesel with no worry about charging stations being full or ICEd. Still, its very useful and maybe in a few years time when I make the leap I'll be using it more.

Mr Q · 09-07-2022 09:55PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119314466#Comment_119314466

You're very wrong on the brakes. The mechanical brakes are used a lot less on an EV due to regen.

mikeecho · 09-07-2022 10:17PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119315084#Comment_119315084

I might be.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1135980_evs-emit-more-brake-dust-which-the-eu-is-stepping-up-to-regulate

Pussyhands · 09-07-2022 11:47PM

Weird now that if somehow the price came down to say 1.80 a litre, it would seem really cheap!

MightyMunster · 10-07-2022 08:36AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119315155#Comment_119315155

You are, with one pedal driving you literally never use the brakes. Maybe every 3 or 4 hours of driving you might use it once.

Also if you're concerned about weight you'd be better off looking at SUVs than EVs.

Just looked up some similar sized cars there, Tesla Model 3 1600KG, BMW 3 Series 1500kg, Audi AT 1590KG. Add another 50KG of fuel into the BMW and the Audi and they're practically the same weight so don't see what the issue is here at all. Sounds likes some more FUD to slow the transition to cleaner, better cars.

is_that_so · 10-07-2022 08:43AM

Noticed this last week or so that prices seem to have topped out in that €2.12-€2.20 range for both fuels or is that my imagination?

10-07-2022 08:55AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119315914#Comment_119315914

down to €2.06 near me now

MightyMunster · 10-07-2022 12:37PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119312799#Comment_119312799

FYI a standard Tesla model 3 would do Cork to Dursey return no problem (see below), so the bigger battery Ioniq5, EV6 etc... Should be fine too.

liamog · 10-07-2022 02:47PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119310490#Comment_119310490

The point was mainly to illustrate that ESBN are not going in to absolute meltdown every time someone builds a small apartment block, so why would do the same when someone wanted to set up a district charging hub with a number of 50kW DC chargers. There will always be some areas where grid enforcement has to occur to increase capacity in an area, but this is no different from any other commercial/industrial/residential expansion that happens around the country.

Many people seem to think that uniquely in the case of EV charging that grid operators and generators do not want the custom and the demand that they will generate. The reality is any charging network operator is going to have to pay for the grid connection and maximum import capacity just as any other customer on the electricity network. This is all priced in to the business model of the network operator and is the primary reason we see motorway charging hubs clustered around areas where the grid has spare capacity instead of in the middle of nowhere where it might be better from a transport point of view.

It should be noted that DC chargers aren't used for overnight charging, so the scenario you listed for pre-heating a vehicle don't apply. Any pre-heating will be done either from the stored energy in the traction battery or from the AC connection which is commonly 32A and is usually covered by a load sensing device which prevents exceeding a given customers import capacity.

Chris_5339762 · 10-07-2022 02:52PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119316563#Comment_119316563

Thanks. Thats the kind of range I'd be looking for at a bare minimum, before I feel my silly daytrips would be reasonably feasible with EVs though.

€55,000 for the base model though.

mikeecho · 10-07-2022 04:08PM

A neighbor works for ESBI , and I asked them a few years ago, what would happen if everyone got home and plugged in their car, could the grid manage. I was told that the chargers would have batteries in them, and those batteries would trickle charge all day. And you would be charging via a battery, thus reducing the strain on the network.

10-07-2022 04:11PM

...

MightyMunster · 10-07-2022 06:01PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119317120#Comment_119317120

52 I think, but if that's the range you'd need then you're looking at 60kwh+ battery. Plenty of options from VW, Hyundai, Kia, Skoda etc...

Also a smaller battery might only need a 5-10minute stop for that trip in Kenmare or Bantry so could be worth saving 10-15k on a car for the sake of 10 minutes, 3 or 4 times a year.

brokenangel · 10-07-2022 11:10PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119314231#Comment_119314231

What a load of waffle :-)

If diesel suits your friend then of course they should buy a diesel, if diesel isn't right for them then they are an idiot for buying it.

In terms of the trip to Dublin story, we have an ambulance system in place and if you think burning nearly a tank of diesel driving over the speed limit is something to be proud of you are sadly mistaken. I know it is internet waffle but no idea why someone would think of posting that sort of rubbish.

Also are you actually that misinformed about the other technologies that you don't under they can also do the exact same?

techman1 · 11-07-2022 09:59AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119308615#Comment_119308615

That's a good point about electric cars being able to power appliances during power cuts.

However if there was a really serious power cut lasting days are you really going to drain your car's battery because you will need your car to get to work and the shops.

Aswell as that when the power is restored there could be restrictions on recharging electric cars due to the drain on the electric grid of all those cars being put on charge at the same time and risking further power outages and grid failure. Power to domestic appliances like fridges would be much higher up the priority list than charging electric cars

MightyMunster · 11-07-2022 10:31AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119320391#Comment_119320391

Depends where you live as to whether this will ever happen. I've never lost power for more than a few hours in the last 40years in any of the dozen or so houses I've lived in. If you're living on an island where this might happen you would probably have backup batteries, solar panels etc anyway.

mikeecho · 11-07-2022 11:00AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119319594#Comment_119319594

Ambulances don't act as taxis for people that want to travel across the country.

mikeecho · 11-07-2022 11:02AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119320507#Comment_119320507

Do you have solar pv? I'm getting it installed, and it doesn't work in a power cut, not unless you set it up so it can work as an island.. how long do you think a 4k battery would last?

MightyMunster · 11-07-2022 11:07AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119320650#Comment_119320650

If you live somewhere where you have frequent days long power cuts it's worthwhile, and you'd need more batteries. For me, where I have maybe 30mins of power outages a year it's not worth while.

sonyvision · 11-07-2022 12:00PM

Had a friend telling me he is viewing new electric cars, not a lot of availability. Looking at spending €60k as the cost travelling up and down to his holiday home is "killing him". People definitely looking at the options but the entry point is high. I put 30L to travel up and down to family at the weekend, 400k round trip to the folks will be doing it ones a month. Book value of the car €2k, so I won't be buying an electric car until I'm forced to upgrade with change in circumstances. Would I like an electric car, definitely but unlikely I'll get something I want for €15k when it comes time to change with such low usage the savings won't be huge.

Padre_Pio · 11-07-2022 12:06PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119320391#Comment_119320391

Ifs and buts.

The takeaway is that your EV car battery would likely have enough juice to keep a house going for days. If your power cut is multiple days, then just drive to a charge point and charge the battery. Hey presto your power is only out when you're recharging the battery. Your petrol/diesel will never do that.

That said, most cities or towns rarely get power cuts, and rarely ever for more than a few hours. I know people who live out in the country where the power can go for up to two days, but again, that's a rare event. These are the people who buy and maintain backup generators.

How would the government restrict EV charging on a home charger?

techman1 · 11-07-2022 12:51PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119320507#Comment_119320507

Yes but these are not normal times as I said in a previous post the 1970s and 80s is when you had those long power cuts.

We are now back in the same political situation again with Russia shutting off the gas, our electricity network is heavily dependent on gas , yes we get most from UK but we don't know how they would react in a crisis. The energy problems are with gas and electricity not with oil as it is easy source that from outside Russia.

Of the 5000MW of wind power on our grid an engineer was saying a few weeks ago only 100MW was actually available and the power stations had to fill that big gap.

How long until we see €2 a litre and will it push more to EV's faster?

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