A lost farmer

Spend the next few years making the farm a one man operation. This might require investment such as fencing, roadways, sheds etc. Consider just a summer grazing system, buying stock in spring and getting rid of them in autumn. You'll make **** all on them but it's a low input system and you'll pocket the grants.

How about asking the father for advice first? no-one will know the place better and what its capable of stocking wise.

The lowest risk option is to stock your farm at the rate to qualify for the ANC payment 0.15 LU/Hectare over the calendar year and buy a topper to keep the grass down, get your Basic farm payment and Glas/Reap scheme money.

I think it all depends on your land quality. There is many different profitable systems out there. Main thing to remember when you are feeding cattle ration you are probably breaking even at best. However most system need a little bit of ration feeding.

At times it may be reducing losses to a minimum but most lads at drystock are turning a few bob. If your land is good enough buying stores and finishing following off grass is the handiest. You can buy stores from 550-1k+ that will leave a margin.

Heifer calf to beef at 10-22 months is also an option ( you could even add a few traditional breed bullocks). For more mixed land where you have some good but some poorer/ wetter type land weanling to beef would be an option.

When you are getting into poorer land you may well be at reducing losses ( having said that there are lads farming profitabley on all land types) so minimal sticking may be the order of the day.

That why until OP gives a bit more detail on land etc we are guessing on the blind

Good to think outside the box ..

But there's a reason there's very little organic free-range pork - hard to make it pay -organic pig feed is expensive..you'll get a premium for free-range - but not a second premium for organic - maybe if your land type suits -

I see plenty of Angus and Whitehead heifer weanlings for €450-500 or less, for sale at the moment, would they leave money if finished off grass in early summer 2023

150 acres of good grass land should be well able to leave a decent income off drystock. Just keep costs under control. A stocking rate of 2 LU / HA would not be high that I'd only 130 kgsN/ HA unless you mean 2 units( yearling and 2 year old would be a unit in your system)

Ideally should be no need to push in silage in the morning. However I suspect you have a pit and Are putting out one day's feed at a time.

Are you finishing at 20-24 months or off grass at 24 months. Paddocks if not in place would in tease profitability. It should be possible to run cattle as two bunches if finishing off grass at sub 30 months. Paddocking need not cost a fortune friend just put water troughs in middle of field and a couple of stakes around them. Fence back to side of fields with pigtails and string.

Keep away from suckler's. It will add extra groups to the system. New government supports will be related to traditional suckler stock numbers. As well they are tending to taper support so that bigger herds receive less

You would not be heavily stocked at them levels. I am at one finishing animal/ acre so you have leeway if you want to expand.

Maximise payments. Not sure if I would rush into organics. At present you cannot get some GLAS payments because of it. However you have the land base to grow a bit of tillage for organics. Necessity for cattle to have straw runback could be an issue.

Are you making silage in late May or is it out into mid June. On grass measuring I do not do it, but I do manage grassland. Would generally be having about 23-27 days between rotations. Never strip graze it an impediment to growth. Would not disagree with staying with weanlings to finish., But you should be able to carry 65-70 cattle to finish every year. You should be aiming for a gross average margin of 900-1k/ head and that would be a net margin of 4-500/ head if doing weanling to beef at sub 30 months off grass.

Certainly as KG says, Bass is you best man to advise on beef. On the one extreme if you wanted to full time farm would be an organic milk enterprise similar to Ahernes in East Cork. They stock full Jersey at 1.8lu/ha. You'd have 100 cows producing milk selling for 50c/litre. The best thing about that price is that it tends to be stable, not subject to the fluctuations of the general milk market.

A choice could be to put part of the farm into organics, say 20ha. You grow 10ha oats and 10ha red clover silage. You flip those every 3 years. The other 40 ha could be conventional and run a beef system.

On discussion groups be wary of any that are thinking too much on the intensive and output. This can run up costs. You often do not see the return on extra output as costs swallow up any extra output.

I think his father is the best man to mentor him. Sure get a bit of advice here but the man that will be helping him most is his father. what works on one farm won’t work on another an I’m sure his old lad is working that farm all his life.

I’m also fairly sure as he is working full time the father will be knocking about to keep an eye on stock. Be some craic telling the old lad that a lad on the internet is telling him that they are buying the wrong type of cattle.

While the father should have an input any farm needs outside advice at times( my own included). Many farmers in there 60's or 70's have never weaned themselves off the BPS especially where they were substantial payments. Many were the real hobby farmers not the part time farmers.

John Heney was reluctant to move to a paddock system but after a single year saw the advantages of it. There is profit in nearly any breeds of cattle, the trick is to build a sustainable business with them. Weanling to U30 month beef gives huge scope for making a decent margin and buying at the 4-10 month stage gives you a good choice of cattle and only limited competition around the ring.

Most significant changes in a farming system can be the way the farm.is set up. With the demands of modern life making a farm a virtual one man operation is important.

What is important for the OP is to have a set up in place where he can go to France for two weeks in the summer or Lanzarote in February for a week and the farm can function without him with minimal management.

If you have not got any he green cert do it, if you are under 35. It's important as it opens the 60% Tams to you as well as 1%farm transfer stamp duty under 35 years of age.

A lot of business is about common sense. Biggest thing get an accountant. I would advise FBD as they seemed more tuned to part time farmers. Remember you can write farm losses off against farm income. Form a partnership even if over 35 as it allows you to write off car, electricity, telecoms, farm office/heating expenses. When your children get to 14-16 start putting them.onnthe farm books cheapest way to put them through college.

I cannot stress how important an accountant is from day one...that is not to say you should overpay him or be lead by him.

Yes as long as they are different enterprises. So organic tillage and non organic livestock or visa versa would be OK