Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

absolutely, we have successfully set ourselves up to continually screw the squeezed middle, we have decided to effectively leave wealth untouched, but since tax needs to be paid, the default is always gonna be the middle, this is now an unsustainable situation, we have to start becoming radical, we have to engage in ideas such as perpetual deficits, and other methods of public funding, public banks etc, and we have to some how start taxing wealth, in all its forms, none of these will be easy, all fraught with problems, but....

it makes perfect sense to create public and social housing to high standards, because if we continue as is, it will be ultimately up to the squeezed middle to foot the bill again, in the future, thats you and/or your kids! new buildings should be made to long out last the lives of the original occupants, by not doing so, it just pushes on the requirements to future generations, i.e. your kids and grandkids, it has to stop somewhere. we know how to do this, there has been incredible advancements in building tech and materials etc, we currently just dont have the will, but i suspect its in the post!

1) There would be no revenue.

2) Private buyers would still compete with a limited amount of supplies.

But you have not answered my question of what about the people who purchased their houses who can't afford to bring them up to current regs that you want the council and public houses brought to.

Yet again we the squeezed middle get left behind.

They didn’t make the first move. The BOE didn’t have much of a choice but to not raise rates after US announcement yesterday. If they didn’t raise rates then strengthening dollar would just add to inflation in the UK.

Likewise all emerging markets will do similar and raise rates despite their economy’s not being robust because they will have Issued USD debt.

Interesting investors are now moving pilling into Real estate and Inflation linked bonds and commodities to hedge against inflation. This will result in upward pressure on housing prices.

.....keep living in an alternative reality! what booming economy?

who are these people, that are limiting their income?

where are these free houses?

come on lads, put your prejudices aside, and come into reality!

again, absolutely, the default towards the middle will ultimately fail, including the current retrofit program, the expectation is for the middle class to take on the bulk of the debts required to do so, i wont happen, only some that are willing and able to will, i suspect the majority wont. in order to do so, a major state grant scheme will need to be implemented, this probably wont occur under the current government, but will have to be in future governments

i suspect the process of raising rates will be stalled, if not back tracked upon, it ll certainly be very interesting to watch though

....and everyone has won from this, havent we!

HAP is too lucrative to give up for all those benefitting. For Dublin it can amount to 1250 if you have one child. The fact that 1250 is only an assistance payment and contributes to the overall rent shows just how a total crash (correction really) in the rental market isn't just a possibility (given the dislocation between 1250 pm in rent support and what average salaries are) but is a necessity.

Poolbeg now being offered back to the council on long term leases instead of offering them for sale. Investors are fleecing the tax payer with their resources to overpower the councils and the government from so many different angles from lobbying, hiring from the public sector those with connections to decision makers, threatening to starve supply etc. It's farcical.

The government have propped up the rental market making it a bubble and a bubble so large it has lifted all boats in our housing market. There is no metric where the current situation is sustainable. The question is where the chips fall when the whole thing collapses.

For example, companies creating more jobs in Ireland won't happen in the short to medium term with no where for employees to go and live. Less than 1000 rentals on Daft for the whole of Dublin for the last 5 months and people think jobs can still be created? eg tik tok claiming they can hire a couple thousand for Dublin over the next few years? Won't happen and this further growth of big comps ies is the sword on which our post-08 growth and recovery will fall.

How will the rental market crash happened with such a shortage of supply? And when will it happen?

Yeah but here we go again with a property tax. Any council owned property is exempt from property tax. Quoting the above "If it saves €1k then bring in a €1k tax to fund it" and guess who pays for it, the squeezed middle so how exactly is that fair.

All I am looking for is some form of fairness, everybody thinks retrofitting, building energy efficient state owned properties but its the squeezed middle who end up paying for the bulk of everything.

How exactly is that fair. I will ask the question again how is it fair that council housing stock is brought to a higher standard than owner occupied housing who can't afford to do our own properties but the state has no problem taxing us to pay for retrofitting council owned property.

You are missing the point. Tenants of social housing should pay something.

Great that your mother's house will be retrofitted free of charge but what about us in the middle.

If the work delivers 1k per year in savings to the owner/inhabitant in the form of reduced energy bills, then a tax of 1k constitutes 0 cost to the government and the owner/inhabitant

The current property tax is exempt on council houses, bring it in as universal environment tax. We don't have to continously repeat mistakes of the past

Throw all the carbon tax at the project also to speed it up

Self build or contractor?