Mother and babies homes information sealed for 30 years

L1011 · 29-08-2021 04:09PM

The Golfgate tribute was to his son Mark Junior.

Cluedo Monopoly · 29-08-2021 04:17PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117819582#Comment_117819582

Anne Silke: Fostered to a Fianna Fáil TD, beaten and abused (irishexaminer.com)

The ‘Golfgate’ event last year in Galway was a dinner in honour of the late TD and MEP.

Who attended the golf dinner and what has happened to them since? (irishtimes.com)

The society’s 50th anniversary event paid tribute to the late Mark Killilea, a founding member of the group and former Fianna Fáil MEP.

29-08-2021 04:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117819566#Comment_117819566

This is old news and it’s only right that it’s brought to the public’s attention once again.

Shebean · 30-08-2021 03:37PM

It won't be old news until it's addressed by the state, honestly.

30-08-2021 04:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824041#Comment_117824041

I don’t think that the state should be blamed for the actions of one family! Though, what can be done at this stage when the accused is dead?

Shebean · 30-08-2021 04:34PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824237#Comment_117824237

The state is complicit in everything a state body or actor does, especially if they spend decades covering for it and treating victims like nothing.

This is about addressing the survivors and families with respect and giving closure, While insuring it's not repeated. None of these animals acted in a vacuum.

political analyst · 30-08-2021 06:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824237#Comment_117824237

The alleged actions of one family. The alleged victim is also dead and so whether or not her accusations are true will never be known.

31-08-2021 08:45PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824729#Comment_117824729

Indeed. Makes you wonder about the veracity of other testimonies.

Cluedo Monopoly · 01-09-2021 11:46AM

(49) Untold Secrets Trailer - YouTube

Untold Secrets is a documentary covering a series of interviews with survivors, families of survivors, and people involved in the mother and baby home scandal.

Trailer to the Untold Secrets documentary above. It was shown at the Galway Film Fleadh and got excellent feedback.

Shebean · 01-09-2021 05:18PM

We know the state allowed babies be sold often without the mothers knowledge. We know the state allowed single mothers be committed to institutions for most of their lives. We know the Garda and local priest were often complicit. We know the state and religious gulags allowed babies be used in Smith-Glaxo-Kline trials without the mothers permission/consent.

Tutting over a whitewashed cover up is not enough. The state for decades behaved like animals IMO.

The state needs to honestly own it before victims and families can achieve peace. We need outside/foreign people to carry out a full report under the attention of the UN.

01-09-2021 05:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834130#Comment_117834130

And, what part did the mothers families play? Are they totally innocent? After all, it was often the parents who brought the pregnant mothers to these institutions and abandoned them there.

Shebean · 01-09-2021 05:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834148#Comment_117834148

If you want to go after families I'm not sure where you'd start. Any families who engaged in the process were often cajoled by the state and church in many cases. Public shaming, religious pressure, escorted by a Garda. You can't send your daughter to a life of servitude and having her baby sold or experimented on without the religious orders, state and a complete disregard for human life. I'd call it criminal were it not supported by the state.

Let's concentrate on the public representatives with a duty to protect and govern for the well being of the state, engaging in selling babies and allowing clinical trials without consent.

All you are doing here is deflecting.

techdiver · 01-09-2021 05:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834148#Comment_117834148

My god this comment is so dumb it makes me dumber even reading it.

Think about what you are saying. If I bring my pregnant daughter down to the local garda station or mother and baby home because I'm a backwards idiot it absolves the state and church institutions of responsibility? Am I getting this right? I should have been told to **** off immediately and arrested for attempting such a course. That is not what happened though.

The level of immaturity in your statement is mind boggling!

uptherebels · 01-09-2021 05:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834148#Comment_117834148

Totally innocent of what? The church is responsible for their own atrocities. Your constant attempts to deflect from this doesn't change this fact.

Igotadose · 01-09-2021 05:55PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834168#Comment_117834168

That's all that poster ever does. Blame everyone except the precious RCC.

01-09-2021 06:04PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834168#Comment_117834168

I’m afraid that I don’t agree with you. Yes, I’m sure that the church influenced some families decisions, but the families often took/sent the pregnant mother to these institutions off their own bat, abandoning them to their fate. I fail to see why the families shouldn’t carry a large portion of the blame for the unmarried mothers suffering along with the church, state and the institutions.

Shebean · 01-09-2021 08:44PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117834309#Comment_117834309

You don't agree with what? Are you seriously deflecting from the state and religious orders to what some families might have done in individual cases? Would you not repeat your earlier comment "what can be done at this stage when the accused is dead?"? You have to hold the state and religious orders responsible before you can seriously go down the 'whatabout the families?' route. Otherwise your case falls apart.

If I wanted to sell a baby or let a pharmaceutical company carry out tests on a baby I'd be rightly locked up, but the state and church were allowing and assisting in such things. At worst, complete worst, families are guilty of playing along with religious orders and the state. If they didn't they'd be shamed or locked up so come off it. They should bear some responsibility, of course, but what would you suggest? They tell the Garda, Priest at their door to go **** themselves? That's not realistic now is it? I know it happened TBF.

You are happy to deflect from the state and religious orders to families, at best gullible.

The state and religious orders were monsters. I don't know why we haven't made these groups illegal based on their records. The state needs to address the experimenting on babies and not sweep it under the rug. Animals.

02-09-2021 07:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117835390#Comment_117835390

“The state and religious orders were monsters” In my opinion so are the fathers and families. All 4 deserve investigation and censure. I’m not in any way excusing the Church and State. Just wanting blame to be apportioned equally to everyone who added to these girls suffering.

02-09-2021 09:16AM

The religious orders are responsible for the behavior of their member's cruelty can never be explained away or minimised.

Families often thought they were doing the right thing for their daughter.

The absence of fathers from the story is peculiar no one got pregnant by themselves.

The refusal to look at the context in which all this took place is missing a whole part of the story through, the role poverty played in the decision many families made, which in turn flowed from a society that made a god of having a bit of land a god of 'minding a good job' or the likes of being a primary school teacher being the equivalent to winning the lotto.

Things like who went to the dispensary doctor or could pay the doctor maked families out. The role poverty played in the issue is huge.

The is a chick lit book called The Liberation of Brigid Dunne by Patricia Scanlan they very clearly explained the choice one of the characters makes set in the 1950s from a small farm, working in a shop in the village ending up as a spinster preventing her brother from getting married because no woman wants to share a kitchen she becomes a nun despite having no religious conviction as a way out there were thousands like that.

Igotadose · 02-09-2021 10:28AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117836920#Comment_117836920

And, it was the RCC forcing unwanted children that first and foremost, led to poverty. The RCC flourishes by causing misery. They continually prove this time and again. Their defenders are either cultists, or personally profit from the RCC's activities, or both.

02-09-2021 11:52AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117837285#Comment_117837285

The Catholic Church wasn't the only Church running mother and baby homes. C of I were in the news recently too.

Shebean · 02-09-2021 12:32PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117836508#Comment_117836508

Fine. Why are you unwilling to allow criticism of the religious orders and state? They created and ran the mother and baby homes. You are not apportioning blame equally. Anytime the state and religious orders are criticised you try move to the families. You need be as critical of the state and religious orders as you are families and telling tales of those who allegedly thought the homes were great, which is all you post about, to be 'equally' critical.

02-09-2021 01:10PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117837760#Comment_117837760

I seem to be the only one apportioning blame to all involved. Religious (RC & C of I), State, fathers and families. All are to blame.

Igotadose · 02-09-2021 04:42PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117837594#Comment_117837594

Granted; but they ran Fianna Fail and the Government at the same time.

Shebean · 02-09-2021 04:55PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117838003#Comment_117838003

No, you are reluctant to level blame upon the culprits, the religious orders and state. I have previously agreed, as you quoted, that yes, families who went along with it hold some blame, but and it's a very big but, it was the religious orders and state created and enabled the life sentences of servitude and selling and experimenting on babies and you might reference that but only to bring you to deflecting to individual families guilty of obeying the church and state.

Cluedo Monopoly · 02-09-2021 09:44PM

GSK have opened up their records about the vaccine trials in Mother and Baby homes.

Vomiting and fever among side effects experienced by children who took part in GSK trials (thejournal.ie)

VOMITING AND FEVER were among the side effects experienced by children who took part in trials carried out by Glaxo Laboratories (now known as GSK) in mother and baby homes and similar institutions in the 20th century.

GSK has today published information about nine trials it carried out in Irish institutions between 1934 and 1973.

Another milk trial on Ostermilk 1 was carried out on around 80 babies from Bessborough and Pelletstown (40 at each site) in 1969.

The document notes that “no information” on side effects is available. It adds: “The draft protocol is the only information GSK retains regarding this trial. No evidence could be found that this trial was conducted.”

GSK has also established “an enhanced information service” for survivors of mother and baby institutions who believe they participated in the trials.

In a statement, the pharmaceutical giant said it “recognises that many survivors are understandably seeking to access their personal information”.

Cluedo Monopoly · 23-09-2021 08:43PM

Access to mother and baby homes redress scheme to be widened (irishtimes.com)

Access to mother and baby homes redress scheme to be widened

Women who stayed less than six months and those resident after 1974 set to be includedAccess to mother and baby homes redress scheme to be widened

Women who stayed less than six months and those resident after 1974 set to be included

Although the Government has indicated it will seek a significant financial contribution from Catholic and Church of Ireland bodies that were involved in running homes, there will be no formal talks with church figures until the scheme is approved by the Cabinet.

Again this was leaked rather than officially announced.

Cluedo Monopoly · 28-09-2021 10:27AM

Good article on Catherine Corless. How many years will it take to bury those babies with some dignity.

Catherine Corless Showed The State It Couldn't Just Fob Us Off (evoke.ie)

Catherine Corless showed the State it couldn’t just fob us off

‘All I remember is, they never spoke, they were terrified looking, they were never asked anything, they shuffled in to their own seats and they were just cold looking, and just terrified.’

Older people Catherine has spoken to remember the children also arrived into class later than other pupils, and left earlier, and the clear conclusion is that this was to prevent them making friends, and perhaps revealing details of the conditions they lived in.

A staggering 798 children died in Tuam, but burial records existed for only two of them.

Cluedo Monopoly · 06-10-2021 10:12PM

Dr Maeve O'Rourke is using her experience researching Ireland's mother and baby homes and the commission/report to ensure that Northern Ireland does it right.

Mother-and-baby homes: Panel backs public inquiry - BBC News

The Truth Recovery Design Panel recommends:

Urgent appointment of a non-statutory independent panel of experts, including those with personal experience
Legislation to appoint a statutory public inquiry
New legislation to secure access to records for survivors and their families
Immediate redress payments from the beginning of the investigation

The panel, along with victims and survivors, called on "all state, religious and other institutions, agencies, organisations and individuals complicit in the processes of institutionalisation and forced labour, family separation and adoption to act without delay in issuing unqualified apologies".

They said that they should clearly state their role, "accept responsibility for harms done; demonstrate sincerity in their apology; and demonstrate the safeguards now in place to ensure there will be no repetition of the inhumanity and suffering to which they contributed".

Dr O'Rourke said that any future investigation must be accessible to everyone involved, in particular those with disabilities.

"The key priorities raised by survivors and the relatives are that funding and resources should be sufficient to ensure effective and sustainable implementation of all the panel's recommendations; that the human rights of survivors and relatives are central to the recommendations' implementation; that all of the measures recommended must ensure full access for victims, survivors and relatives of the deceased to information," she said.

Brucie Bonus · 08-10-2021 06:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117986253#Comment_117986253

It looks like FF/FG are hoping the remaining victims will die off. No justice when it's inconvenient

Mother and babies homes information sealed for 30 years

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