Formula 1 2021 - General Discussion Thread (Read 1st post rules)

Frank Bullitt · 04-09-2021 05:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845925#Comment_117845925

It is all new next year though, so I don't think the rate of improvement this year will be a factor.

06-09-2021 08:40AM

If with the completely new cars next year Verstappen still dominates someone by the kind of gaps he's had so far then he's the best driver ever. I very much doubt that will be the case though.

El_Duderino 09 · 06-09-2021 09:05AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117852329#Comment_117852329

I don't think that follows. He hasn't had a top tier teammate since Ric. Albon and Gasley as rookies and Perez is only alright and he's in a run of poor performance. Nobody is seriously suggesting any of those are top tier. Gasley has improved since leaving RB so that would be interesting to see him back in the RB to see if he could challenge Max. But he's still probably not top tier.

Max isn't beating the likes of Leclerc and Norris, he's beating Perez and he should beat a decent midfielder like Perez.

Burkie1203 · 06-09-2021 11:37AM

Bottas to alfa romeo confirmed

https://twitter.com/F1/status/1434841673897553923?s=20

Cool_CM · 06-09-2021 11:45AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117853165#Comment_117853165

I really hope it does for Bottas what Seb's move to Aston Martin did for him

recyclebin · 06-09-2021 12:41PM

Going by Bottas announcement it looks like Alfa Romeo will be continuing there marketing agreement with Sauber.

SeeMoreBut · 06-09-2021 12:45PM

How has f1 turned into that Toto, Red Bull and Ferrari have literally control over who gets on the grid and where

AMKC · 06-09-2021 12:51PM

So thats Bottas to Alfa, Russell to Mercedes. DE Vries to Williams is it. Anything else.

El_Duderino 09 · 06-09-2021 12:56PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117853564#Comment_117853564

The second Alfa seat is still up for grabs. If they stay with the Alfa branding then they're more likely to try to sell the seat to Ferrari and stay with Gio. There was talk of them switching to Mercedes and then they'd probably want a Mercedes driver in that seat. But that seemed unlikely. Most likely scenario is status quo, I'd say.

muckwarrior · 06-09-2021 01:49PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117852451#Comment_117852451

He's not just beating them though, he's thrashing them. His recent team mates may not be elite level, but they're not bad either. IMO Verstappen right now is driving at the level of Alonso a decade ago, i.e. the best on the grid.

El_Duderino 09 · 06-09-2021 02:08PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117853880#Comment_117853880

Yeah I don't disagree with that. He's on great form and he's doing a great job. I disagreed that beating Perez like a rented mule again next year would mean Max is the best ever (that was said in the post i responded to) I don't like to compare drivers form different eras or get into discussions of who is the greatest. But anyone could agree that Max is in the elite group of drivers on this grid (probably only himself and Hamilton with some drivers liek Leclerc, Noris close behind).

Albon and Gasley were rookies though. That has to be kept in mind. And Gasley has improved since being dropped by RB which i think shows he was promoted too early. Perez is grand, his early season form was much better than the last few races and his quali times have gone form bad to worse. He's having about the right level of performance for him. Inconsistent and usually miles off a top driver like max. I doubt we'll ever see max with a top teammate. If you have max (and are paying his wages) then you're backing him to win the championship so you hire a second driver like a Perez or a Bottas as Mercedes have done. Bottas is much better at keeping in touch with the leaders than Perez has been of late. But they've both been picked because they're ok, not bad but not too good either.

06-09-2021 02:50PM

For someone to beat a competent driver by the amount Verstappen has beaten everyone since Ricciardo suggests something more than just being a bit better.

Hamilton was only a rookie but could match Alonso. Button could match Hamilton more or less. Rookies usually come in and aside from pure pay drivers are up to speed within the first weekend.

A quick look at 2008 and Hamilton regularly beat Kovalainen, found a handy comparison tool showing that it wasn't always an absolute beating and varied over the season. And despite my intense dislike of Hamilton there's no denying he's one of the greatest ever. Kovalainen isn't at the top of anyone's list but in his rookie year he beat Fisichella.

image_2021-09-06_154503.png

For Verstappen to consistently destroy (not just beat) everyone has to be down to something exceptional going on. The only two real options are the car being completely suited to him or he's that much better than everyone else.

El_Duderino 09 · 06-09-2021 02:59PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117854192#Comment_117854192

The third option is that he's just much better than the teammates he's had. He should beat the stuffing out of Perez. There would be something wrong if he didn't.

Anyone could agree that Max is excellent and on great form. Perez is only ok and has typically mixed form. Max should hammer Perez, and he does. Max is much better than Perez and Gasley and Albon as rookies. I don't think there's anything else to be gleaned from it.

flazio · 06-09-2021 03:03PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117853529#Comment_117853529

It used to be just Bernie who told everyone who to sign and when.

duploelabs · 06-09-2021 05:25PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117854192#Comment_117854192

Your final point should be accentuated more. It's clear that the RB is designed to match Verstappen's nuances as a driver and RB's drivers just have to deal with what their given, there has been a long history of this in F1 with a preferential main driver in a team, who would have more influence with the design team, gets a car suited to them. The classic example of this would be Alonso's championship winning car, F1 test driver Scott Mansell describes it here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4Dv0Ja6HQU

artanevilla · 06-09-2021 05:52PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117853529#Comment_117853529

They who control the engines, control the seats.

flazio · 06-09-2021 06:08PM

What's the regulation around Raikonnen? Is he definitely out for Monza or will he be allowed if he tests negative during the week?

Joeface · 06-09-2021 06:32PM

I wish they were only allowed do these drivers swaps in the off season. The amount of ink and audio time that has been wasted on questions about Bottas and Russell has sweet f all to do with this season . That's next year's news and all the fake drama and dragging it out . I was waiting for then to do rock paper scissors at a driver's press conference to end it .

It least it's half over but they won't shut up about it after either .

flazio · 07-09-2021 06:44AM

In answer to my own earlier inquiry, once Kimi returns 2 negative results mid week he's free to race according to Ted in the Notebook

Speaking of media, it would appear that Andrew Benson has switched allegiance.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/58457663?at_medium=custom7&at_custom2=facebook_page&at_campaign=64&at_custom3=BBC+Sport&at_custom4=49A685F2-0E7D-11EC-B393-D8B9923C408C&at_custom1=%5Bpost+type%5D

Harika · 07-09-2021 07:27AM

Gasly and Tsunoda have been confirmed at AT for next year.

Gasly kept warm for a top seat and Tsunoda make or break

El_Duderino 09 · 07-09-2021 07:59AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117856750#Comment_117856750

I know it's a couple of years out, but where do you see a top seat opening up for him?

Maybe Red Bull from 2023 to replace Perez.

Maybe Alpine from 2024 (has alonso signed for another year or 2 years?)

Maybe Mclaren from 2023 if Ric can't improve. Maybe Mercedes from 2024 of Hamilton retires.

Maybe Aston in 2024/5 if Vettel retires.

Ferrari seem very happy with their drivers at the moment.

It's actually very hard to see him get a top drive. The RB lads tend not to have many bug sponsors because their sponsorship is taken care of by RB. I think that's been given as an explanation for why they tend to drop out of the sport when they are dropped by RB. I think he's good enough to stay in the sport on merit, but it's hard to see where he will go.

klose · 07-09-2021 08:32AM

I'm guessing Alpine would like Gasly to replace alonso in 2023 (I'm assuming he's retiring then) but isn't the word that him and Ocon don't get on too well? Two French drivers for a French team and all that.

Vettels contract is up then too at Aston if they want a new driver but they're about as competitive as alpha tauri at the moment so not sure if he'd go for that.

Personally I think red bull would be insane not to give him a second go replacing perez in 2023 if gasly keeps up this form between now and then?

I think mclaren and Mercedes would definitely consider him too if ricciardo dosnt get going by then or if Hamilton calls it a day. Think there will be quite a bit of movement in the next couple years driver wise.

namloc1980 · 07-09-2021 09:04AM

Russell to Merc officially announced:

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.mercedes-announce-george-russell-will-partner-lewis-hamilton-in-2022.jtndbCmN3CR8Lm9s54e4T.html

artanevilla · 07-09-2021 09:08AM

Didn't see that coming!

Busi_Girl08 · 07-09-2021 09:43AM

Best kept secret in F1!

recyclebin · 07-09-2021 09:47AM

Who's this Russell guy, never heard of him :p

namloc1980 · 07-09-2021 10:46AM

How many races will it take next season before there's a "George, it's James....." team order?

El_Duderino 09 · 07-09-2021 11:42AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117857651#Comment_117857651

Part of me would be surprised if they need to send such a message. They had him over a barrel during the contract negotiations. He might be an explicit no.2 in his contract until Hamilton retires.

O they might go with the Ferrari model when they had Vettel and Leclerc. Vettel was the default no.1 at the start but when Leclerc proved he is faster they switched to an equal footing. Naturally that would lead to the driver who drops from no.1 to equal status to feel aggrieved and we saw how Vettel fell apart under that circumstance. SO it would be interesting to see how Hamilton reacts if George is genuinely competitive.

George has great Quali pace in the Williams and it appears to be a strong part of his game, and Hamilton isn't particularly strong in quali compared to his race pace. So George might have the upper hand on Lewis in quali at least. So Mercedes would have to decide how to handle things if George is starting races in front of Hamilton.

muckwarrior · 07-09-2021 01:50PM

So Toto wasn't lying when he said "none of those" when asked if Russell would be announced on Thursday, Friday, Saturday or Sunday.

artanevilla · 07-09-2021 01:57PM

So that leave four seats left, the two Williams, one at Alfa and one at Aston Martin.

Williams - Albon & de Vries? Is Latiffi expected to stay? He brings cash but he's probably not quick enough for them if they want to start getting back to former glories.

Alfa - Gio staying? I'd be interested to see him race with Bottas as we could see how fast he is, was Kimi still fast or were they both slow. Albon another one but I think Williams probably the better option if he is leaving RB.

Aston Martin - Assume Stroll keeps his seat?

Formula 1 2021 - General Discussion Thread (Read 1st post rules)

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