US and Nato withdrawal from Afghanistan...- threadbanned users in OP

That might make Reeling in the Years 2021 so I guess I'll watch.

Is there any examples of orderly retreats/ evacuations from losing sides? I wonder if they rewrite history like in Vietnam to say they achieved their strategic even if their allies were defeated.

Binden is right about what are we supposed to do if Afghans Don't fight for themselves ,I'd don't agree how they went about the withdrawal and trump's negotiations which got us to this point,

They could have easily held on to bagram airbase and litterally gave the afgans airsupport and extra help with NATO special forces to back up the ANA ,

its simplifying the issue though and passing the buck. its the implementation - the plan that has gone astray. NATO is made up of many members there should have been more communication between the lot of them and looping in the UN, international aid agencies and NGOs etc, to make sure they could maximise the amount of people who could get out. seem like alot of people blindsided.

yeah interesting point and i think it would require a thesis level amount of research. so if they didnt think they could do it orderly as perhaps doesnt work that way then they should have at least acknowledged that at the beginning.

So the spin on this from the UK media is: There's a group of fake male Muslim terrorists taking over the country where one of their aims in to subjugate woman. I find it quite repulsive that some would turn this current crisis into an issue of misogyny.

I think when the intention is to leave Afghanistan altogether that a Taliban takeover would inevitably ensue whether a sudden withdrawal or a staggered one. The end result is always going to be the same.

We all know exactly what the problem is and there is no way we can fix it. It might fix itself in a few hundred years is about the best we can hope for. What truly democratic Islamic country's are there in the world anyway? There's isn't one so the idea we could turn Afghanistan into one is delusional.

Biden is coming under a lot of criticism for this but I'm behind him on this on. I wouldn't dream of sending Irish soldiers to Afghanistan to fix their underlying problems risking their lives for objectives that can't be fixed in the first place. It is not a matter of simply defeating a terrorist organization and that's it job done all sorted now. Wish it were but there it is.

Hard for rioting to change stuff that's already happened...

Meet the next leader of Afghanistan: Abdul Ghani Baradar is veteran resistance fighter who saw off the Russians and was FREED from a Pakistani jail by Donald Trump as part of deal with Taliban

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9898321/Freed-jail-help-Donald-Trump-Abdul-Ghani-Baradar-head-Afghanistan.html

Might shock you but we had troops over there.

Best hope is to get the likes of the powerful Islamic countries to influence taliban to behave somewhat responsibly going forward.

I don’t have much confidence though.

I wouldn’t hold my breath on that one. I mean the support was there for the full withdrawal if you believe opinion polls but the way it was done was an utter mess.

I hope the terrible pictures of today are kept on file for the next time the US and UK are putting together a “coalition of the willing” to invade some other country.

Shure the head of the British army was quoted as saying "we will police Basra like we policed Belfast" and meant as a boast about how good they were at policing. So I don't think the big boys ever learn from their mistakes

Post war Germany was a very different state to most of German history.

It helped that the local population was utterly shamed into not resisting change after what they had done

And with hindsight, in Iraq, that was one major mistake that was made there. In their eagerness to remove all traces of Saddam, they also removed all Bathist members of the administration, or any position of power, but these people knew how to run the Country ( not mention that most of them feared and hated Saddam, ) So you had basically a rudderless administration,,,and the Country devolved into out of control power blocks, same as Libya is now.

The problem with Afghanistan is that its divided into tribal areas and groups, which in the rural areas are poorly ( if at all ) educated, Its not uncommon to find people whose Family name is taken from the district they were born in, and as for birthdays? Forget it. And these different districts and Families have often been at war with each other. The Haqqani network for example. So I guess that at the time, the US thought it best to leave the existing setup in place.Very hard to roll back a system that has been in place for hundreds of years.