Harry and Meghan

lrushe · 10-06-2021 07:08PM

JoChervil wrote: »

Actually this can be stronger used against Harry, because he was aware of her state and didn't help her.

Doesn't he have the emails to prove he did try seek help?
When that wasn't forthcoming didn't he effectively quit his job and move her to another country to help her.

JoChervil · 10-06-2021 07:09PM

lrushe wrote: »

So is it just people who are anti m&h that have the luxury of examing the evidence and making there own mind up?
Is that privilege only held if you think one way.

No, it is a privilege of any independently thinking person. But if you prefer to overlook inconsistencies, contradictions, accusing innocent people, lies etc, so it is up to you, but then your conclusions might not be accurate.

JoChervil · 10-06-2021 07:15PM

lrushe wrote: »

Doesn't he have the emails to prove he did try seek help?
When that wasn't forthcoming didn't he effectively quit his job and move her to another country to help her.

I don't know about any emails. In such situations people just grab the phone and seek help. And he had many professionals on call being involved with mental health charities and undergoing his own therapy.

They said during this interview that hearing it he made her attend another official meeting. When you deal with a suicidal person, you act at once, not wait few months.

lrushe · 10-06-2021 07:16PM

JoChervil wrote: »

No, it is a privilege of any independently thinking person. But if you prefer to overlook inconsistencies, contradictions, accusing innocent people, lies etc, so it is up to you, but then your conclusions might not be accurate.

Phew, thankfully I am an independently thinking person and my conclusions have as much ability to be true as yours.

valoren · 10-06-2021 07:24PM

Don't forget that the suicide ideation was happening when they were setting up their charity foundation along with all the admin work and extensive effort involved with that but a quick discreet private phonecall to arrange a session with a therapist was simply beyond the both of them. The staff assisting with their charity set up were quite happy to facilitate that work but when Meghan reached out for help they wouldn't help with that, they wouldn't even make a phone call or google a therapist. That just doesn't pass the smell test.

lrushe · 10-06-2021 07:44PM

JoChervil wrote: »

I don't know about any emails. In such situations people just grab the phone and seek help. And he had many professionals on call being involved with mental health charities and undergoing his own therapy.

They said during this interview that hearing it he made her attend another official meeting. When you deal with a suicidal person, you act at once, not wait few months.

Isn't everyone an expert on what someone else should do when they are on the outside looking in.

retro:electro · 10-06-2021 07:57PM

valoren wrote: »

Don't forget that the suicide ideation was happening when they were setting up their charity foundation along with all the admin work and extensive effort involved with that but a quick discreet private phonecall to arrange a session with a therapist was simply beyond the both of them. The staff assisting with their charity set up were quite happy to facilitate that work but when Meghan reached out for help they wouldn't help with that, they wouldn't even make a phone call or google a therapist. That just doesn't pass the smell test.

Not to mention that she was pregnant at the time and almost all prenatal appointments start with assessing your mood and asking how you’re feeling. And that’s just with bog standard care, not to mention having your own team of private doctors flown in to attend to your every whim. But yeah let’s blame HR who had no power to help and conveniently skip past everyone else, including her husband, who had plenty of power and access to help.

Be right back · 10-06-2021 07:58PM

As seen on Instagram. Obviously I have no idea if there is any truth in it.

ceadaoin. · 10-06-2021 08:23PM

Be right back wrote: »

As seen on Instagram. Obviously I have no idea if there is any truth in it.

Hmm..started out plausible enough, I could see them getting let go for not fulfilling their contractual obligations because they don't actually seem to have done anything. But the surrogate stuff is a hard no for me and throws the whole thing into doubt!

10-06-2021 08:36PM

valoren wrote: »

Don't forget that the suicide ideation was happening when they were setting up their charity foundation along with all the admin work and extensive effort involved with that but a quick discreet private phonecall to arrange a session with a therapist was simply beyond the both of them. The staff assisting with their charity set up were quite happy to facilitate that work but when Meghan reached out for help they wouldn't help with that, they wouldn't even make a phone call or google a therapist. That just doesn't pass the smell test.

In fairness, a pregnant woman isn’t always the most rational! I’m speaking as someone who has been there! Raging hormones. Tears just below the surface. Irrational thoughts and feelings.......

Then again, I’m well able to seek any help I may need!

retro:electro · 10-06-2021 08:36PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Hmm..started out plausible enough, I could see them getting let go for not fulfilling their contractual obligations because they don't actually seem to have done anything. But the surrogate stuff is a hard no for me and throws the whole thing into doubt!

There is huge buy in online into the belief that she had a surrogate pregnancy. I don’t believe it myself. She was clearly pregnant both times, you can even tell by her facial features

Be right back · 10-06-2021 08:41PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Hmm..started out plausible enough, I could see them getting let go for not fulfilling their contractual obligations because they don't actually seem to have done anything. But the surrogate stuff is a hard no for me and throws the whole thing into doubt!

I know that there were rumours that she used a surrogate and faked her first pregnancy. I don't think so or don't care if she did or not. Enough pressure on royal women to produce heirs etc!!

Itssoeasy · 10-06-2021 09:07PM

Be right back wrote: »

As seen on Instagram. Obviously I have no idea if there is any truth in it.

Take with a silo of salt.

Leg End Reject · 10-06-2021 09:39PM

retro:electro wrote: »

There is huge buy in online into the belief that she had a surrogate pregnancy. I don’t believe it myself. She was clearly pregnant both times, you can even tell by her facial features

Yep, she was clearly pregnant and looked very radiant, you can't fake the facial and bodily changes.

There's disliking someone's personality and there's making ridiculous claims!

JoChervil · 10-06-2021 09:41PM

lrushe wrote: »

Phew, thankfully I am an independently thinking person and my conclusions have as much ability to be true as yours.

Not necessarily, if your conclusions are based on lies, contradictions (so only one statement can be true, so another must be untrue) and inconsisnencies

JoChervil · 10-06-2021 09:44PM

lrushe wrote: »

Isn't everyone an expert on what someone else should do when they are on the outside looking in.

You don't need to be the expert to know, that if someone needs help and reach out for it to you, you should simply help.

lrushe · 11-06-2021 06:44AM

JoChervil wrote: »

Not necessarily, if your conclusions are based on lies, contradictions (so only one statement can be true, so another must be untrue) and inconsisnencies

But what you could see as a intentional lie, I could see as apossible misunderstanding or even inconsequential.

Multipass · 11-06-2021 06:57AM

valoren wrote: »

Don't forget that the suicide ideation was happening when they were setting up their charity foundation along with all the admin work and extensive effort involved with that but a quick discreet private phonecall to arrange a session with a therapist was simply beyond the both of them. The staff assisting with their charity set up were quite happy to facilitate that work but when Meghan reached out for help they wouldn't help with that, they wouldn't even make a phone call or google a therapist. That just doesn't pass the smell test.

Not forgetting that she was pregnant at the time and would have been under quite intensive medical care. One mention to her doctor and she would have been referred immediately.

lrushe · 11-06-2021 07:16AM

JoChervil wrote: »

You don't need to be the expert to know, that if someone needs help and reach out for it to you, you should simply help.

I would assume that if you're spouse of 70 odd years were in hospital dying you would be there every waking hour, holding their hand, making last memories etc. after all that is what an ordinary person would do.
How often did the queen visit Philip when he was dying in hospital, not once. Duty or protocol or whatever prevented her from doing what you would assume would be the most obvious reaction to an ordinary person.
My point being, comparing how you or I or any other ordinary person living an ordinary life would react in a situation verus how a member of the rf would react is like comparing apples with oranges, we live in completely different worlds.

tara73 · 11-06-2021 07:38AM

lrushe wrote: »

o.
How often did the queen visit Philip when he was dying in hospital, not once.

and how do you know that???

JoChervil · 11-06-2021 07:42AM

lrushe wrote: »

But what you could see as a intentional lie, I could see as apossible misunderstanding or even inconsequential.

So what about the most consequential statements about racist remarks? Meghan claimed there were many, while she was pregnant, while Harry claimed it happened once way before they got married.

JoChervil · 11-06-2021 07:45AM

lrushe wrote: »

I would assume that if you're spouse of 70 odd years were in hospital dying you would be there every waking hour, holding their hand, making last memories etc. after all that is what an ordinary person would do.
How often did the queen visit Philip when he was dying in hospital, not once. Duty or protocol or whatever prevented her from doing what you would assume would be the most obvious reaction to an ordinary person.
My point being, comparing how you or I or any other ordinary person living an ordinary life would react in a situation verus how a member of the rf would react is like comparing apples with oranges, we live in completely different worlds.

Well, I see that it is you, who are comparing apples with oranges. What the Queen's visits (during extraordinary times) have to do with a direct conversation Meghan had with Harry about her being suicidal? Behind all this protocol, privately they are just people like any of us.

dogbert27 · 11-06-2021 07:51AM

lrushe wrote: »

I would assume that if you're spouse of 70 odd years were in hospital dying you would be there every waking hour, holding their hand, making last memories etc. after all that is what an ordinary person would do.
How often did the queen visit Philip when he was dying in hospital, not once. Duty or protocol or whatever prevented her from doing what you would assume would be the most obvious reaction to an ordinary person.
My point being, comparing how you or I or any other ordinary person living an ordinary life would react in a situation verus how a member of the rf would react is like comparing apples with oranges, we live in completely different worlds.

That's actually a very cruel take considering she is 95 years old and there are Covid 19 restrictions on visitors to hospitals.

It has been reported he spent his last dying days at Windsor with the Queen by his side.

iamwhoiam · 11-06-2021 08:00AM

lrushe wrote: »

I would assume that if you're spouse of 70 odd years were in hospital dying you would be there every waking hour, holding their hand, making last memories etc. after all that is what an ordinary person would do.
How often did the queen visit Philip when he was dying in hospital, not once. Duty or protocol or whatever prevented her from doing what you would assume would be the most obvious reaction to an ordinary person.
.

Prince Philip died at home with his wife by his side . ?

lrushe · 11-06-2021 08:02AM

JoChervil wrote: »

So what about the most consequential statements about racist remarks? Meghan claimed there were many, while she was pregnant, while Harry claimed it happened once way before they got married.

I didn't hear harry disputes it either

lrushe · 11-06-2021 08:07AM

JoChervil wrote: »

Well, I see that it is you, who are comparing apples with oranges. What the Queen's visits (during extraordinary times) have to do with a direct conversation Meghan had with Harry about her being suicidal? Behind all this protocol, privately they are just people like any of us.

They are not just like us, they have a different set of rules to live by.

dogbert27 wrote: »

That's actually a very cruel take considering she is 95 years old and there are Covid 19 restrictions on visitors to hospitals.

It has been reported he spent his last dying days at Windsor with the Queen by his side.

It's about as cruel as accusing a husband of not getting his sick wife help.
Plus you're missing the point, the queen (even without covid) can't just rock up to a hospital like a normal person, she has rules she must follow, rules we don't have so measuring their handling of situations the same as us is not an equal comparison.

lrushe · 11-06-2021 08:10AM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Prince Philip died at home with his wife by his side . ?

My point is nothing to do with where he died but more with how the queen had to act in the weeks leading to his death. Its not a criticism of her It's to show that they can't just do what they want when they want.

iamwhoiam · 11-06-2021 08:14AM

lrushe wrote: »

My point is nothing to do with where he died but more with how the queen had to act in the weeks leading to his death. Its not a criticism of her It's to show that they can't just do what they want when they want.

I think Covid was a huge issue to be fair .

valoren · 11-06-2021 08:27AM

Multipass wrote: »

Not forgetting that she was pregnant at the time and would have been under quite intensive medical care. One mention to her doctor and she would have been referred immediately.

Exactly. I wouldn't doubt that Meghan was engaging in suicide ideation, it's the idea of her reaching out for help and getting shunned by the Palace that strikes me as disingenuous, narrative building and agenda driven. It would be far more credible if she went along the lines of saying she was suicidal, that the doctors always asked about her mental health, that she had the best resources available but she felt embarrassed or even felt compelled by "duty" to keep silent about it because of the bad PR of a suicidal Royal. It would be more in line with an agenda of promoting the importance of speaking out no matter your situation or status instead of trying to throw the HR/Palace under the bus as a bunch of callous and indifferent people more interested in PR optics than getting someone help.

11-06-2021 08:40AM

A good explanation of why the Sussexes use of Lilibet is so wrong.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-9674707/JAN-MOIR-not-just-Harry-stolen-Queens-crown-jewel.html

“It's not just a name... Harry has stolen the Queen's crown jewel
During a life devoted to public service and being on almost permanent display, Lilibet was the one thing the Queen had that was entirely her own.

It was hers, and hers alone.

Spoken aloud, it was the affectionate nickname first bestowed upon her by her grandfather, King George V, adopted by her beloved father and mother, and an echo of the past that she must still hear, whispered down the hallways and by the firesides of Balmoral and Sandringham.

It was also a private endearment uttered throughout more than 70 years of marriage by her husband who, may I remind certain parties, is recently deceased.

Elizabeth may Regina, but Lilibet was something more sublime.

No, it does not appear on patents or seals or official documents, but it was her signature on the most personal of correspondences. It was the cipher that spoke of the bonds of family and also of the flesh and blood woman behind the throne, under the crown, beyond the castle moat.

Its use was restricted. It was a tender diminutive spoken only by those who knew and loved her.

Lilibet was as much a part of the Queen’s personal identity as her Sunday hats and buckled shoes, her tweeds in the country and her cornflakes in Tupperware.

And now it is no longer hers, its emotional exclusivity shattered; targeted and then blown apart like a clay pigeon. If we all instinctively understand its importance to HM, if even Noel Gallagher gets it — someone who is hardly a poster boy for the delicacies of family unity himself — why can’t Meghan and Harry understand the enormity of what they have done?”

Harry and Meghan

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