The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

14-08-2020 07:55AM

brinty wrote: »

I don't know how he can add all the majors cost more to get away from. He can't cut players so will have to extend or restructure them.

I'm a cap geek so find this stuff fascinating

I have no idea either tbh. The fact that we brought in hargreave and slay this year would indicate that he has some plan though I just have no idea what it could be

The_Honeybadger · 14-08-2020 11:27AM

brinty wrote: »

I don't know how he can add all the majors cost more to get away from. He can't cut players so will have to extend or restructure them.

I'm a cap geek so find this stuff fascinating

Chiefs had zero cap space going in to this off season but managed to extend Mahomes, Jones and Kelce, after doing Hill last year. There is always a way.

Of course if the cap goes down that’s another story, but everyone is in trouble if that happens

14-08-2020 06:13PM

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Chiefs had zero cap space going in to this off season but managed to extend Mahomes, Jones and Kelce, after doing Hill last year. There is always a way.

Of course if the cap goes down that’s another story, but everyone is in trouble if that happens

Sure but it's easy enough to load contracts a certain way but 50 + million going into a year must be unprecedented ease tially we are likely to seeus carry over money from this year Jason Peters retire alshon and desean cut maby ertz leave and still be over 20 mil over the cap

The_Honeybadger · 14-08-2020 11:16PM

Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote: »

Sure but it's easy enough to load contracts a certain way but 50 + million going into a year must be unprecedented ease tially we are likely to seeus carry over money from this year Jason Peters retire alshon and desean cut maby ertz leave and still be over 20 mil over the cap

Yeah I had a look at Eagles on over the cap. It looks really bad right now but they can do several restructures on the big earners and cut Jeffery, Jackson and others. With the carry over from 2020 they will figure it out.

Saints are in a similar position and they’ll be carrying over $20m in dead cap assuming that Brees retires.

I know the $175m figure is being thrown around but that’s very much a worse case scenario. If they get a slate of games on Saturdays it will lessen the blow and the owners can choose to borrow from future years. They won’t want to start blowing up rosters for what is hopefully a temporary business interruption.

Foxtrol · 17-08-2020 03:13PM

'Creative' is a term that is troubling when it comes to the cap (or most types of job involving numbers), especially when it is a consistent trend.

Restructures rarely reduce the amount a team owes a players so the same number is going to hit their cap at some point. It is like relying on your credit card to supplement your income, sometimes you can just stay ahead of it but if any problems with your income (like the NFL is seeing this year) and things come crashing down quickly.

Take the Eagles, 2 names listed as potential cuts are Jeffery and Jackson. Despite being older players and 2021 being the last year of their deals, where a team usually should be able to get out easily from a deal, due to both being previously restructured they would cause more dead cap than cap savings if cut - Jeffery ~$10m dead vs ~$8m saved and Jackson ~$6m dead vs ~$5m saved. Aside from dropping Barnett before his 5th year becomes guaranteed, I don't see a clean cut of players they've had on their team for a while. Sure they can do further restructuring but that bill becomes due eventually.

People can point to the Chiefs management this offseason as an example of how things can be done but they are an outlier, as out of the 3 key players extended - 2 were already under contract for the next 2 seasons and the 3rd was already on the franchise tag. Their cap hits were already included in the cap number for 2020 prior to the deals and the players accepted contracts that didn't change it. They are another team that will be in some trouble next year if the cap falls but as they haven't been 'creative' for several years, like the Eagles, they have much more flexibility to cut for greater savings or restructure guys.

The_Honeybadger · 17-08-2020 04:34PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

'Creative' is a term that is troubling when it comes to the cap (or most types of job involving numbers), especially when it is a consistent trend.

Restructures rarely reduce the amount a team owes a players so the same number is going to hit their cap at some point. It is like relying on your credit card to supplement your income, sometimes you can just stay ahead of it but if any problems with your income (like the NFL is seeing this year) and things come crashing down quickly.

Take the Eagles, 2 names listed as potential cuts are Jeffery and Jackson. Despite being older players and 2021 being the last year of their deals, where a team usually should be able to get out easily from a deal, due to both being previously restructured they would cause more dead cap than cap savings if cut - Jeffery ~$10m dead vs ~$8m saved and Jackson ~$6m dead vs ~$5m saved. Aside from dropping Barnett before his 5th year becomes guaranteed, I don't see a clean cut of players they've had on their team for a while. Sure they can do further restructuring but that bill becomes due eventually.

People can point to the Chiefs management this offseason as an example of how things can be done but they are an outlier, as out of the 3 key players extended - 2 were already under contract for the next 2 seasons and the 3rd was already on the franchise tag. Their cap hits were already included in the cap number for 2020 prior to the deals and the players accepted contracts that didn't change it. They are another team that will be in some trouble next year if the cap falls but as they haven't been 'creative' for several years, like the Eagles, they have much more flexibility to cut for greater savings or restructure guys.

I don’t think there is any denying that the Eagles are in a very tough spot. I wasn’t trying to downplay that but you would have to assume that they are fully aware and that there is a plan, albeit it’s hard to make out what it is right now. You are right in that there is no silver bullet for them, in fact most of the big earners would have a net negative impact on the cap if cut in 2021. Cut Jackson, Jeffery, Ertz and rescind the option on Barnett along with some restructures would get them compliant or at least very close, depending if course on the final cap number for 2021. There will be a tonne of dead money on the books but so be it.

The cap was due to balloon in 2021 before Covid19 put paid to that and it seems that some teams including the Eagles made long term plans around that expected increase. My own Steelers operate a bit like the Eagles, they are not in nearly as much trouble but they have important guys like Juju Smith Schuster hitting free agency next offseason that I expect they won’t be able to keep now. I’m sure many are in the same boat.

That said, we have seen so many big extensions in recent weeks that I don’t think the teams are as worried about the cap falling as fans are. Teams would surely be a lot more conservative if they thought the cap was due for a sharp and prolonged decrease.

jack presley · 17-08-2020 05:29PM

is this the first big name to go down?

https://twitter.com/WerderEdESPN/status/1295410666904395777

eagle eye · 17-08-2020 07:10PM

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Yeah I had a look at Eagles on over the cap. It looks really bad right now but they can do several restructures on the big earners and cut Jeffery, Jackson and others. With the carry over from 2020 they will figure it out.

Saints are in a similar position and they’ll be carrying over $20m in dead cap assuming that Brees retires.

I know the $175m figure is being thrown around but that’s very much a worse case scenario. If they get a slate of games on Saturdays it will lessen the blow and the owners can choose to borrow from future years. They won’t want to start blowing up rosters for what is hopefully a temporary business interruption.

Brees is going nowhere.

The Chiefs will be in cap hell next year too. There is no way the cap doesn't go down with the year we are having. NFL has already lost out on preseason games and you can be certain that there'll be games stopped when some guy has symptons and has been in contact with other players. I don't see how the season gets finished.

The_Honeybadger · 17-08-2020 07:23PM

eagle eye wrote: »

Brees is going nowhere.

The Chiefs will be in cap hell next year too. There is no way the cap doesn't go down with the year we are having. NFL has already lost out on preseason games and you can be certain that there'll be games stopped when some guy has symptons and has been in contact with other players. I don't see how the season gets finished.

Payton has already indicated that this will be Drew Brees last year. He has a nice job waiting for him in the booth whenever he goes and looking at their cap situation and list of impending free agents 2020 looks like his last shot at the big one anyway. He may play on but I reckon he will hang it up after 2020

The league have set a floor of $175m on the cap and they can pretty much do whatever it wants after that, they can choose to keep the cap where it is and spread the deficit over 5-10 years so the impact is negligible for a lot of teams for example. As I said above the way teams are spending it doesn’t look like they are too worried about it.

You could be right about not finishing the season, depends on how disciplined the teams are and how quickly they identify cases and isolate them. Mixed results in other sports so far, some doing ok, others not so much.

Oat23 · 21-08-2020 09:44PM

This is the stuff of nightmares for Bears fans.

https://twitter.com/Zack_Pearson/status/1296863672980189185

Other important news that came out last night/this morning was Ron Rivera revealing he has cancer. Hopefully he beats it.

https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/1296791648018587649

ArmaniJeanss · 23-08-2020 12:29PM

Don't think it's been mentioned that there's a couple of fail-safes in the schedule in Weeks 2,3 & 4 if there are any problems/changes that need addressing after Week 1. Week 1 presumably a test week to see what works or not.

Whoever your opponent is in Week 2 is a team you share the bye-week with, so a postponement here can be subsequently made up in the bye-week without affecting the rest of the schedule.

Weeks 3 and 4 have been set up such that a) there are no games against a team within your division and b) every team has a home game and an away game.
So if necessary they can be cancelled and expunged from the schedule without being completely unfair (still a bit unfair as e.g., the Pats would avoid a trip to Kansas).
It gives the NFL the flexibility if needed to have a 14 game season but still have everyone playing their 6 division games and with a 7H7A schedule.

Foxtrol · 23-08-2020 12:42PM

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Don't think it's been mentioned that there's a couple of fail-safes in the schedule in Weeks 2,3 & 4 if there are any problems/changes that need addressing after Week 1. Week 1 presumably a test week to see what works or not.

Whoever your opponent is in Week 2 is a team you share the bye-week with, so a postponement here can be subsequently made up in the bye-week without affecting the rest of the schedule.

Weeks 3 and 4 have been set up such that a) there are no games against a team within your division and b) every team has a home game and an away game.
So if necessary they can be cancelled and expunged from the schedule without being completely unfair (still a bit unfair as e.g., the Pats would avoid a trip to Kansas).
It gives the NFL the flexibility if needed to have a 14 game season but still have everyone playing their 6 division games and with a 7H7A schedule.

Interesting. Given how few cases have come up during camp during the intense testing I dont see the start of the season being the problem. It'll more likely be as the season goes on and players get more exposure due to travel and become fatigued of staying in (especially for guys on teams that are out of the running).

ArmaniJeanss · 23-08-2020 01:17PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

Interesting. Given how few cases have come up during camp during the intense testing I dont see the start of the season being the problem. It'll more likely be as the season goes on and players get more exposure due to travel and become fatigued of staying in (especially for guys on teams that are out of the running).

I guess when they came up with the schedule in May it was important to have early safety nets. In hindsight the 'no division games' weeks might have been better later in the season alright.
Probably not much you can do anyway if you get a clusterfcuk situation at the tail end of the season, other than unfairly eliminate teams or extend the season.

jack presley · 23-08-2020 02:05PM

There seems to have been a few positive tests in the latest batch although the Bears ones have been changed to false positives so the testing process seems a bit messed up at that lab

https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1297532513875894274?s=21

phatkev · 23-08-2020 04:35PM

The Jets also reporting 10 false positives from the same lab, sounds like the NFL didnt like the results so decided there was something wrong with the testing process

Christy42 · 24-08-2020 08:33AM

phatkev wrote: »

The Jets also reporting 10 false positives from the same lab, sounds like the NFL didnt like the results so decided there was something wrong with the testing process

If only one lab reported positives when teams sent samples to multiple labs then odds are something went wrong in the lab.

jack presley · 24-08-2020 02:48PM

Reported now that all 77 positives were false positives. Imagine that happens during the season.

Jofspring · 24-08-2020 09:27PM

Has there been anymore word about games being played on Saturdays also? Would be great to get a few games in on a Saturday and not be hanging tired in work on a Monday.

jack presley · 24-08-2020 09:46PM

Jofspring wrote: »

Has there been anymore word about games being played on Saturdays also? Would be great to get a few games in on a Saturday and not be hanging tired in work on a Monday.

If college games go ahead, they can't. Well not until that season's over.

thomond2006 · 30-08-2020 10:53PM

Derwin James injured again. The Chargers never change.

jack presley · 03-09-2020 08:15AM

Sky Sports NFL launches today. It seems to be replacing Sky Sports Action as opposed to being a new channel.

VillaMad · 03-09-2020 10:07AM

jack presley wrote: »

Sky Sports NFL launches today. It seems to be replacing Sky Sports Action as opposed to being a new channel.

Reason being, once the season is over, it will revert back to being Sky Sports Action.

5 hour programme called Live: NFL 32 is scheduled tonight, whatever that is.

alchemist33 · 03-09-2020 10:43AM

VillaMad wrote: »

Reason being, once the season is over, it will revert back to being Sky Sports Action.

5 hour programme called Live: NFL 32 is scheduled tonight, whatever that is.

Reporters broadcasting from 32 training camps, is what they did before

Foxtrol · 03-09-2020 05:13PM

Looks like college teams that are pushing ahead with the season, ramping up this week, are really gambling with the lives of unpaid kids.

Same argument for NFL players but at least they are paid, can more easily isolate, and have better care/attention

https://twitter.com/pupadhyaya_/status/1301544819731451904?s=20

jack presley · 04-09-2020 11:58AM

I didn't see this coming

https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1301850483649392641

VillaMad · 05-09-2020 01:32PM

Channel 5 in the UK showing Monday Night Football, midnight the 14th, with the Giants v Steelers. They seem to have bought some NFL TV rights.

Can be manually added on Sky Boxes. Not sure if any other TV providers in Ireland show Channel 5.

Itssoeasy · 05-09-2020 01:37PM

VillaMad wrote: »

Channel 5 in the UK showing Monday Night Football, midnight the 14th, with the Giants v Steelers. They seem to have bought some NFL TV rights.

Can be manually added on Sky Boxes. Not sure if any other TV providers in Ireland show Channel 5.

So did sky sports announced they had MNF earlier and it changed ?

VillaMad · 05-09-2020 01:40PM

Itssoeasy wrote: »

So did sky sports announced they had MNF earlier and it changed ?

Sky are showing it also.

el Fenomeno · 05-09-2020 01:58PM

VillaMad wrote: »

Channel 5 in the UK showing Monday Night Football, midnight the 14th, with the Giants v Steelers. They seem to have bought some NFL TV rights.

Can be manually added on Sky Boxes. Not sure if any other TV providers in Ireland show Channel 5.

Is it Mike and Nat again?

VillaMad · 05-09-2020 02:17PM

el Fenomeno wrote: »

Is it Mike and Nat again?

No official announcement by Channel 5 about what they are doing. Would imagine they will just get the whole feed off ESPN as Sky do.

The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

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