Brexit discussion thread XII (Please read OP before posting)

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Jobs going to the EU can only be a good thing. As far as I can tell the only benefit to car manufacturers from staying in a no deal Brexited UK is a potential perception of regained sovereignty. I can't see that standing against tariffs, non tariff barriers and disrupted supply chains.

I just think it's interesting that that post above screams "How dare France do the thing that the UK wants to do. No fair!"

Deleted User wrote: »

It highlights the fact that Nationalism is alive and kicking in EU countries as well as the UK, if push came to shove, France will pull jobs away from another EU country.

I think it more highlights the Anti EU rhetoric which some posters subscribe to all the while enjoying all the benefits our membership has bestowed them.


There is an interesting case study in psychology there.

Deleted User wrote: »

It highlights the fact that Nationalism is alive and kicking in EU countries as well as the UK, if push came to shove, France will pull jobs away from another EU country.

Which jobs will France be able to to "pull" from other countries? Do you think the French government can order private companies to close their international operations?

Deleted User wrote: »

They don't actually need to "pull" jobs as such, but by not buying imports and increasing their own manufacturing base they replace foreign jobs with French jobs.

So you're getting testy about a hypothetical?

Deleted User wrote: »

They don't actually need to "pull" jobs as such, but by not buying imports and increasing their own manufacturing base they replace foreign jobs with French jobs.

The EU can't win on this though when it comes to criticism such as yours.

The EU don't have rules or authority to stop countries trying to maximise jobs in their countries; according to you this is a bad thing.

But if the EU did have rules or authority to stop countries trying to maximise jobs in their countries, you'd also be saying this is a bad thing.

It's the paradoxical "The EU is too strong and interferes in too many areas, yet is simultaneously weak and isn't doing enough" argument brexiters use.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It highlights the fact that Nationalism is alive and kicking in EU countries as well as the UK, if push came to shove, France will pull jobs away from another EU country.

They are tying to stimulate their economy and car manufacturing industry.

What the hell are you talking about at all? I think you have confused yourself.

Deleted User wrote: »

I see that France are now playing the "bring jobs home" game, in reality, they've always played that game by putting obstacles in the way of importers, sufficient to impair imports without breaking EU rules.

This was extensively discussed here (in France) on the radio last weekend in the context of Renault's looming financial difficulties. The consensus from all contributors was that pumping money into electric vehicles won't bring any jobs "home" because we Europeans don't own the most important part of any EV - the battery, and the (lack of) availability of batteries will severely hamper development of the industry. Putting up more barriers for the sake of national self-interest will only hand an advantage to countries/companies that don't engage in such silliness.

On that point, there's an outside chance that the UK might manage to outmanoeuvre the French, if they were to invest in - and succeed in - the development of fuel-cell technology. But, of course, they risk scuppering their best opportunity to conquer the French by shutting themselves out of the EU.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes, Electric vehicles are the future( and now).

I agree, most countries really do need to ensure that they don't outsource vital industry as we have seen that to do so risks there being shortages in times of crisis.
Too much consolidation of manufacturing in one country is dangerous, we know that smaller countries are not able to have all the industries so would need to cooperate with their neighbours, but larger countries with large populations do not need to do this and have the capacity to support such industries and the component suppliers can also be local.

You must be taking the piss.

So.. do you... Want to work together? Maybe we should form some sort of political union with a single market for trade?

First Up wrote: »

That's an advertising campaign from a private company, not a government edict.

You're right, but it has tacit government support. The point I was making was that the notion of encouraging local [read "national"] business instead of international business is nothing new.

I don't see anyone jumping up and down in faux outrage at either the message or successive Irish governments backing the message over the last few decades, and it seems a little bit hypocritical to criticise the French (or anyone else) from doing the same within the confines of what is permissible within single-market regulation.

Lemming wrote:

You're right, but it has tacit government support. The point I was making was that the notion of encouraging local [read "national"] business instead of international business is nothing new.

Government support or approval isn't remotely the same as "pulling" companies out of countries or ordering the stoppage of the purchase of foreign goods.

Yes, but this is essentially a letter to MPs more generally (or the opposition if you will) and not to the Tories, or government.

There is an established automotive industry in France. Its not nationalistic to support and certainly not going against the spirit of European integration.

Similarly, if someone from here points out that tourism is knackered in Ireland now and it'd be great if we all made an effort to holiday at home for a year or two.

That's being held up here as akin to Brexit?

J Mysterio wrote: »

Yes, but this is essentially a letter to MPs more generally (or the opposition if you will) and not to the Tories, or government.

Its a response to a letter the opposition MPs obviously wrote to Barnier.