Introducing the Current Affairs/IMHO forum

nkl12xtw5goz70 · 02-03-2020 11:28am

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

The fact that threads, like the “Peterson” one, are left open to descend into some pretty vicious “attacks” on trans people just invites these weirdos, and creeps, to hang around and then they start seep into other threads.

Do you have examples of "vicious attacks on trans people" from that thread? I'd love to see them. Because from my reading, people have expressed opinions such as these:

Because male-bodied athletes have innate physiological advantages that persist even after testosterone levels are reduced, it's unfair (and, in contact sports, dangerous) to permit them to compete against natural-born female athletes;
That a male-bodied sex offender is currently incarcerated in an Irish women's prison, because they possess a gender-recognition certificate that obliges the state to recognize them legally as female, sets a wrong-headed and dangerous precedent;
An unregulated system of gender self-identification can easily permit male sex offenders to pose as women, and thus gain access to female-only spaces such as bathrooms and changing facilities;
Puberty-blockers should not be prescribed to ten-year-old children, or double mastectomies performed on 14-year-old girls, because over-eager parents or clinicians believe that they "identify" as the opposite gender.

Far from constituting "hatred," "bigotry," or "vicious attacks," per your hand-waving above, such concerns are rational, defensible, and legitimate. A female MMA fighter suffered a fractured skull in a bout with a male-bodied opponent. Female athletes in some US states are losing out on college scholarships, pushed off the podium by male-bodied competitors. Confused and vulnerable adolescents are being prescribed medications and surgeries that have irreversible effects on their future lives. Convicted male-bodied rapists are being housed in women's prisons on the basis that they have decided to self-identify as female. These are the real-world consequences of trans activism. People are entitled to be concerned about such issues without being labeled as transphobic bigots.

Attacking other Boards.ie posters whose opinion you don't share as "weirdos and creeps" is far more of a problem than anything posted on that thread.

osarusan · 03-03-2020 3:50pm

osarusan wrote: »

Far, far too much leniency given to posters whose intent to do nothing other than post in bad faith and spew shyte is obvious after just a few posts.

6 months later, this remains a real problem.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 05-03-2020 3:34am

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

I want to “engage” with them as little as possible, B. That’s why I wish they’d stay in CA.

The fact that threads, like the “Peterson” one, are left open to descend into some pretty vicious “attacks” on trans people just invites these weirdos, and creeps, to hang around and then they start seep into other threads.

It’s just a shame, that’s all.

As somebody who was very vocal about trans issues in the Peterson thread, I’m pleasantly surprised at the AH mods for allowing the discussion to unfold and not shutting it down. I was sure it would be. Maybe what was being said wasn’t all that objectionable?

05-03-2020 5:12am

This came up before in this very thread I believe. One poster ages ago linked to a genuine hateful post claiming the thread was full of them.. Like every second post you'd be led to believe. The post they linked to was something like post #161 in the thread and the rest of the thread was fine.

There is absolutely no point in even trying to explain the concept of a public forum to some people. boards.ie has the strictest posting guidelines I've ever come across and yet it's nowhere near strict enough for those who work themselves into a tizzy seeing red everywhere.

nkl12xtw5goz70 · 05-03-2020 8:46am

I note that when EmmetSpiceland was asked to back up his claims about "vicious attacks on trans people" in that thread, he vanished faster than a cupcake at a kids' birthday party.

There's been a pronounced tendency lately for the self-appointed righteous to declare that Boards is full of right-wing hatred and bigotry, and that threads or even entire forums (especially CA) are populated by "creeps and weirdos." When asked to substantiate such claims, they disappear — but it's 100% guaranteed that they'll pop up somewhere else repeating the same nonsense.

Why are staff/admins allowing these baseless allegations to continue, when they're damaging to the reputation and standing of the site? Anyone accusing posters of spreading bigotry, or Boards.ie of hosting hate, is making serious allegations that run counter to the site's reputation as a well-moderated and well-run forum for open discussion. If allegations of hatred and bigotry are found to be baseless, per those above, cards and bans should be handed out.

end of the road · 05-03-2020 3:47pm

Adeline Dead Firefly wrote: »

I note that when EmmetSpiceland was asked to back up his claims about "vicious attacks on trans people" in that thread, he vanished faster than a cupcake at a kids' birthday party.

There's been a pronounced tendency lately for the self-appointed righteous to declare that Boards is full of right-wing hatred and bigotry, and that threads or even entire forums (especially CA) are populated by "creeps and weirdos." When asked to substantiate such claims, they disappear — but it's 100% guaranteed that they'll pop up somewhere else repeating the same nonsense.

Why are staff/admins allowing these baseless allegations to continue, when they're damaging to the reputation and standing of the site? Anyone accusing posters of spreading bigotry, or Boards.ie of hosting hate, is making serious allegations that run counter to the site's reputation as a well-moderated and well-run forum for open discussion. If allegations of hatred and bigotry are found to be baseless, per those above, cards and bans should be handed out.

to be fair the problem with such allegations is that they are subjective.
they are not like other allegations which can easily be disproved, because the allegations about the CA forum and individuals within it are opinion based, which are based on what views and opinions people find acceptable or not. essentially they are opinions held in good faith, even if i would not share such a view on a whole
the people expressing such views could provide lots of examples to show why they think the CA forum is full of whatever, but given others do not share the same views as them, no amount of proof could be enough.
i'm not seeing what staff here can really do in this situation to be honest.
personally i think the CA forum is a great success and addition to the sight, and if people do not like what is posted within it, they should either pop in and challenge views or just ignore.

05-03-2020 4:54pm

anyone posting "cesspit" can be safely ignored, I've found.

A real giveaway that one, the typed equivalent of a hanky held up to the nose.

EmmetSpiceland · 05-03-2020 5:50pm

Adeline Dead Firefly wrote: »

I note that when EmmetSpiceland was asked to back up his claims about "vicious attacks on trans people" in that thread, he vanished faster than a cupcake at a kids' birthday party.

There's been a pronounced tendency lately for the self-appointed righteous to declare that Boards is full of right-wing hatred and bigotry, and that threads or even entire forums (especially CA) are populated by "creeps and weirdos." When asked to substantiate such claims, they disappear — but it's 100% guaranteed that they'll pop up somewhere else repeating the same nonsense.

Why are staff/admins allowing these baseless allegations to continue, when they're damaging to the reputation and standing of the site? Anyone accusing posters of spreading bigotry, or Boards.ie of hosting hate, is making serious allegations that run counter to the site's reputation as a well-moderated and well-run forum for open discussion. If allegations of hatred and bigotry are found to be baseless, per those above, cards and bans should be handed out.

I’m still here, Prof. Apologies, some of us do have busy lives outside of this online message board and can’t be posting 24/7.

I didn’t “backup my claims” because I wasn’t going to go “combing” back over that massive thread for examples. But I would encourage the mods to take a look, whenever the thread diverts onto the topic of “trans” people. As for what lures kids away from parties, I’ll bow to superior knowledge on that front.

No one is saying “Boards is full of right wing hate and bigotry”. I do, however, believe that the “Current Affairs” forum is. I don’t, honestly, know how anyone could argue otherwise.

I have said countless times, at this stage, that I think the mods in CA are doing an amazing job. The forum has to have a more relaxed attitude to certain opinions to ensure that the usual “cohort” stay in there as long as possible. Can you imagine if those animals were wandering across into normal forums? I salute both the mods and the brave good souls who keep them occupied in their pen.

I am aware that the poster above has closed their account but I felt that, considering I was “called out” personally, a reply was required. Apologies again for the delay, I do hope it was satisfactory.

Gatling · 05-03-2020 6:51pm

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

I didn’t “backup my claims” because I wasn’t going to go “combing” back over that massive thread for examples. But I would encourage the mods to take a look, whenever the thread diverts onto the topic of “trans” people.

Why .

There seems to be minority group of people who are demanding control over who and when people can discuss the topic of trans /people suffering gender dismorphia ,
And anyone that doesn't agree with certain opinions are bigots or right wing head cases ,

Blueshoe · 05-03-2020 7:26pm

Gatling wrote: »

Why .

There seems to be minority group of people who are demanding control over who and when people can discuss the topic of trans /people suffering gender dismorphia ,
And anyone that doesn't agree with certain opinions are bigots or right wing head cases ,

Literally Adolf Hitler reincarnated

Outlaw Pete · 05-03-2020 7:45pm

Gatling wrote: »

And anyone that doesn't agree with certain opinions are bigots or right wing head cases ,

Aye, and on a forum were the vast vast majority of users express predominantly liberal views too. Makes no sense.

Never understood how even with the numbers on their side, where their posts get backslapped as a matter of course, such users will still freak out and claim right wingers are ruining the place when some opinions are expressed which they don't happen to agree with.

I can only assume it's because what they really want is an echo chamber of sorts.

EmmetSpiceland · 05-03-2020 7:49pm

Gatling wrote: »

Why .

There seems to be minority group of people who are demanding control over who and when people can discuss the topic of trans /people suffering gender dismorphia ,
And anyone that doesn't agree with certain opinions are bigots or right wing head cases ,

Why what?

I don’t have any issue with people “discussing” anything. Whether you’re a bigot, homophobe, oddball, racist, creep, misogynist, crank, TERF or any of the assorted -isms our there, that is your “business”.

Where I do have an “issue” is when any of that nonsense is spouted in “After Hours”. All of that stuff is at home in CA.

And, yes, it really does “bother“ me to see CA threads staying in AH for far too long. When that happens you see posts about ‘crooked Hillary’, ‘Epstein was murdered’ and random pops at FG around insurance premiums.

Now, if there is a thread about a celebrity telling about a past sexual assault, that’s when they have a field day. Posts claiming ‘regret isn’t rape’ and calling into question the character of the victim. Well, unless the perpetrator turns out to be black, Muslim/Arab or of Asian Indian origin.

As long as that “carry on” is kept in CA it’s really not a big deal, par for the course in there. But all the mouth breathing really does start to stink up AH and takes away from the general “fun” of the place.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 05-03-2020 8:38pm

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Why what?

I don’t have any issue with people “discussing” anything. Whether you’re a bigot, homophobe, oddball, racist, creep, misogynist, crank, TERF or any of the assorted -isms our there, that is your “business”.

Where I do have an “issue” is when any of that nonsense is spouted in “After Hours”. All of that stuff is at home in CA.

And, yes, it really does “bother“ me to see CA threads staying in AH for far too long. When that happens you see posts about ‘crooked Hillary’, ‘Epstein was murdered’ and random pops at FG around insurance premiums.

Now, if there is a thread about a celebrity telling about a past sexual assault, that’s when they have a field day. Posts claiming ‘regret isn’t rape’ and calling into question the character of the victim. Well, unless the perpetrator turns out to be black, Muslim/Arab or of Asian Indian origin.

As long as that “carry on” is kept in CA it’s really not a big deal, par for the course in there. But all the mouth breathing really does start to stink up AH and takes away from the general “fun” of the place.

What’s with all the inverted commas? It makes for confusing reading.

Omackeral · 06-03-2020 12:42am

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

What’s with all the inverted commas? It makes for confusing reading.

Emmet is a ''whacky'' online ''character''.

EmmetSpiceland · 06-03-2020 10:20am

Omackeral wrote: »

Emmet is a ''whacky'' online ''character''.

You should really just stick to “tournament” threads, unfunny “jokes” and threatening old men.

This is a feedback thread, not a place for taking “potshots” at people. If you have any feedback around the “Current Affairs” forum we’d all love to hear it. Otherwise keep your beak out of it.

Mr E · 06-03-2020 10:30am

Admin: Get "back" on "topic" please and stop the stupid "bickering".

Raconteuse · 07-03-2020 5:53pm

Holding conservative/right-wing views does not make someone hate-filled or nasty. And some with liberal/left-wing views can come across as very hate-filled and nasty.

osarusan wrote: »

6 months later, this remains a real problem.

Yeah being a dick - whatever your persuasion - seems to be the problem at times. E.g. in the thread about the recent RTE documentary Redress, a person who has form for dismissing abuse survivors - their only contribution was "Slap bang in "Bart's People" territory from the off I thought" in relation to very traumatised survivors of sexual abuse and extreme physical abuse telling their stories. That's not discussion - that's just a spiteful pot shot.

You've then people who just go around being a nuisance and winding people up/spamming - one (who has been driving people mad for months) on the thread about Darndale et al saying "So you're saying xyz? Really? You're saying that? Lol" (when they're not). You've another who claims over and over that false allegations of rape are at saturation point yet won't give examples (nobody is saying it doesn't happen, but it's not the epidemic he claims), is continuously hostile re women and will mostly engage via sneering and passive aggressive smilies.

What value does their m.o. bring to the place? They're clearly being dicks and still carrying on. I don't get it. Not saying ban them but a change in their debating style?

08-03-2020 2:46am

Raconteuse wrote: »

Holding conservative/right-wing views does not make someone hate-filled or nasty. And some with liberal/left-wing views can come across as very hate-filled and nasty.

Yeah being a dick - whatever your persuasion - seems to be the problem at times. E.g. in the thread about the recent RTE documentary Redress, a person who has form for dismissing abuse survivors - their only contribution was "Slap bang in "Bart's People" territory from the off I thought" in relation to very traumatised survivors of sexual abuse and extreme physical abuse telling their stories. That's not discussion - that's just a spiteful pot shot.

You've then people who just go around being a nuisance and winding people up/spamming - one (who has been driving people mad for months) on the thread about Darndale et al saying "So you're saying xyz? Really? You're saying that? Lol" (when they're not). You've another who claims over and over that false allegations of rape are at saturation point yet won't give examples (nobody is saying it doesn't happen, but it's not the epidemic he claims), is continuously hostile re women and will mostly engage via sneering and passive aggressive smilies.

What value does their m.o. bring to the place? They're clearly being dicks and still carrying on. I don't get it. Not saying ban them but a change in their debating style?

The type of people your describing won't change their debating style, because it means not being a dick and that's why they post to be a dick, and that doesn't even include the trolls/rereg accounts.

There are a few who seem to have real issues, such as a poster who seems to be so triggered (hate this phrase but it's the most polite one I can use) regarding any report of someone being raped/sexually abused that sometimes I've actually wondered if they were involved in a case as the accused, due to the way they dismiss claims and actual case verdicts. They more than likely weren't but they sure as hell post like they were.

Then you have the posters who defend a know convicted criminal and post about how they donate to them because well he dislikes muslims and immigrants as much as they do. Well a fool and his money are easily parted as they say but they have a habit of trying to make out that anyone who points out that their hero is actually no one to be looked up to (again being as polite as possible) and has issued anti Irish sentiments, is either a paedophile or sympathies with them.

Your not going to get anyone like this to change their debating style because facts don't hold any meaning to them.

Muahahaha · 08-03-2020 3:28am

Mr E wrote: »

Admin: Get "back" on "topic" please and stop the stupid "bickering".

Well I must say that the "modding" on the CA forum has been "not too shabby".

Though I do "wonder" why "Beasty" always gets to hand out all the "cards and bans". Other "Mods" dont get a "look in". Maybe we need more "ban hammerers" matched with a bit of "diversity" to achieve a "Boards Utopia".

"Amirite?"

Beasty · 08-03-2020 4:38pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

Though I do "wonder" why "Beasty" always gets to hand out all the "cards and bans".

Just to be "clear", I've handed out less than 700 "cards and bans" in the forum since it was created

I've handed out a lot more sitebans in that period.....

osarusan · 08-03-2020 5:58pm

Raconteuse wrote: »

What value does their m.o. bring to the place? They're clearly being dicks and still carrying on. I don't get it. Not saying ban them but a change in their debating style?

I am saying ban them.

They never engage, simply drone on about the same topics over and over and over again in thread after thread after thread. Their presence on threads make the threads worse. Their presence in CA lowers the quality of CA.

They contribute nothing positive or worthwhile whatsoever. The threads, CA, and boards overall would be better off if they were simply not there.

Beasty · 08-03-2020 7:43pm

osarusan wrote: »

I am saying ban them.

They never engage, simply drone on about the same topics over and over and over again in thread after thread after thread. Their presence on threads make the threads worse. Their presence in CA lowers the quality of CA.

They contribute nothing positive or worthwhile whatsoever. The threads, CA, and boards overall would be better off if they were simply not there.

This is down to your interpretation of poster intentions. Now in due course some of those posters may be dealt with and banned, but equally yours in not the only view that counts. What you may consider to be posts in bad faith may be interpreted differently by others. We see both extremes of views expressed on a variety of topics, but we will still find people at those extremes considering their views to be "mainstream"

Now I do try and read all the reports, but at present that is not very easy when I come back after a family event to find dozens more reports, some of which may have been dealt with. We will deal with persistent troublemakers, but will not ban people without building a case. Hence if we see reports and posters don't respond positively to sanctions being handed out they will find those sanctions escalating

biko · 08-03-2020 9:26pm

I must say since the inception of the CA forum the mods have done a very good job of managing it. I wouldn't agree with every decision I come across but in all they do great work under such pressure.

Beasty · 08-03-2020 10:39pm

biko wrote: »

I must say since the inception of the CA forum the mods have done a very good job of managing it. I wouldn't agree with every decision I come across but in all they do great work under such pressure.

No-one can get everything right. Hopefully we get quite a lot more right than we get wrong. Equally a lot of judgement is required to work out the genuine intent behind some things being posted, and often it cannot be black and white.

Some people simply post without thinking how it can be interpreted, some look to be contrary for the sake of it, and some are out and out trolls. Of course the vast majority are entirely reasonable and never much of a bother. The extreme posters get the headlines around here (ie Feedback) in particular, but a lot more positively contribute to discussion in the forum

KyussB · 09-03-2020 3:08am

Beasty wrote: »

Just to be "clear", I've handed out less than 700 "cards and bans" in the forum since it was created

I've handed out a lot more sitebans in that period.....

JFC...I do think CA is unusually well moderated for Boards, despite my own run ins - and fair play on that, it seems to be close to the right balance of moderation - but Boards must hold some kind of world record for mod-actions/bans, for that to be considered a modest number...

Beasty · 09-03-2020 2:03pm

KyussB wrote: »

JFC...I do think CA is unusually well moderated for Boards, despite my own run ins - and fair play on that, it seems to be close to the right balance of moderation - but Boards must hold some kind of world record for mod-actions/bans, for that to be considered a modest number...

Nah! just shows I am more likely to siteban you than issue you with a yellow in CA:pac:

Raconteuse · 22-03-2020 4:09pm

Glad there is a dedicated covid19 forum and it must be a lot of work.

There is a cohort of narcissistic folk though who are using it to spread absurd conspiracy theories, to ridicule and insult people who are rigidly complying with WHO guidelines to stem the spread, to spread dangerous misinformation that it's over hyped, to be the opposite also - scaremongering, stating various stuff "will" happen, to spread misinformation in general, to just go on a wind-up, and to push a political agenda of e.g. reams and reams of anti FG stuff based on little to nothing (just their obsession with finding fault on a non stop basis - the government is clearly doing a good job) and anyone who disagrees is a shill, not merely disagreeing.

The topic isn't the place for "just muh opinion" and "free speeeeech (that I agree with)". It's a devastating health crisis with huge knock-on effects and not the place for such poison.

Disagreement and debate and questioning can go on quite easily without that muck. Can there be a blanket redirection to the CT forum of these vindictive types? They are just gleefully making a worrying issue worse.

Some clearly do not care one bit about others and seem to lack empathy, like psychopaths.

Discodog · 22-03-2020 4:32pm

And something serious that we should worry about gets hidden in the dross.

Muahahaha · 22-03-2020 4:32pm

From what Im seeing anyone who posts disinformation or is on the wind up is getting called out by all the other posters. If they sustain it a Mod comes in and says Do not post in the thread again and thats the end of that. I think it is running like clockwork, especially given the volume of posts.

Discodog · 22-03-2020 4:50pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

From what Im seeing anyone who posts disinformation or is on the wind up is getting called out by all the other posters. If they sustain it a Mod comes in and says Do not post in the thread again and thats the end of that. I think it is running like clockwork, especially given the volume of posts.

I think it's getting better as the volume reduces.

Introducing the Current Affairs/IMHO forum

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