Upgrade advice for 7yo build, for VR spec

ProjectColossus · 26-11-2019 10:42AM #1

Hi all,

I got excellent advice here when I was I building my current machine 7 years ago, so I thought it would be a good place to ask again now that I want to pick up some upgrades.

I couple of years ago I borrowed an Oculus Rift DK1 for a few weeks and ever since I've looked forward to buying a consumer version of my own, and now is the time. Current plan is to go with the Valve Index so I want to upgrade to a spec that will comfortably drive that and Half-Life:Alyx.

So my main question is with my current build am I going to get away with keeping some of my existing components, or am I realistically looking at a complete overhaul.

I'll need a new GPU for sure, and I reckon doubling the RAM is a cheap no brainer. But do I need a new CPU, Motherboard, PSU? I think the case, monitor, storage drives should be fine, and I'm fine for peripherals.

Here's the original spec I bought (removed stuff like DVD drive, card reader etc)

ProjectColossus wrote: »

Item|Price
be quiet! Pure Power 530 Watt / BQT L7|€57.27
8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9|€27.42
Intel Core i5-3570K Box, LGA1155|€208.05
FRACTAL DESIGN Define R4 Black Pearl|€105.03
Samsung SSD 830 256GB SATA III Paper Box|€156.44
WD Caviar Blue 1TB 6Gb's|€71.15
ARCTIC COOLING CPU-Kühler Freezer i30|€28.69
ASRock Z77 Pro3, Sockel 1155, ATX|€86.09
Gigabyte GeForce GTX 670 OC, 2GB GDDR5, 2x DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort|€373.35
Dell UltraSharp U2412M|€265.00

Those links are dead, but I've recreated the build list here as best I could https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/ckghtp

So what do you think? If I spend 200/250/300 on a GPU, will I get away with that by itself or do I need to replace more parts?

Thank you for reading!

2ndcoming · 26-11-2019 10:51AM

Too truly upgrade you should be thinking of a new mobo/cpu/ram and GPU really.

Given the age of the unit as a whole you would probably only get a few hundred for the whole thing as is but that would be enough to get you started on the road to an all new build?

ProjectColossus · 26-11-2019 11:15AM

Thanks for the feedback.
I was hoping not to have to go down that road really but I guess I knew that it was probably going to be necessary. I'm getting sick thinking of the total cost!

I think if I need to replace the mobo and CPU also, I'd prefer to just swap them in the case rather than worry about selling the current build and starting over.

I'll do some research. I think I could stomach upgrading the GPU, CPU, RAM and then leaving the motherboard and PSU as is if that looks like it could be viable.

Xenoronin · 26-11-2019 11:23AM

You'll get to a very playable state with a graphics and possibly a CPU update. The i5 would run it, but you'd need to be sure to disable as much as possible from running in the background and probably overclock it a good bit. It's around 120euro for the i7 3770K which is... awful value for money at this point. So if you end up with a CPU bottleneck, this is the point at which I'd seriously consider a whole system upgrade.

For graphics, you'd probably want something like the 2060 Super or better. You need your minimum framerates to be above 90fps for VR to avoid motion sickness.

RAM... 8gb is probably enough tbh. Again, you just need to have a clean state before you start the game. No browsers running in the background. Do some reading around this though as I haven't looked into it much.

No harm making sure there are as few bottlenecks as possible, so I'd probably grab a new SSD in the sales too, and make sure any VR game is installed to it.

I run VR games on the i7 3770K and a GTX1070 without issue. I doubt I'll need to make any upgrades to get HL:Alyx working at very playable fps. They don't seem to be pushing boundaries on graphical fidelity.

2ndcoming · 26-11-2019 11:32AM

Valve have always been excellent at getting a lot out of performance out of their games with less than top spec components as well.

K.O.Kiki · 26-11-2019 11:42AM

Just start a computer savings fund now - since it's Valve, who knows how many months it's delayed! :pac:

ProjectColossus · 26-11-2019 01:43PM

Xenoronin wrote: »

You'll get to a very playable state with a graphics and possibly a CPU update. The i5 would run it, but you'd need to be sure to disable as much as possible from running in the background and probably overclock it a good bit. It's around 120euro for the i7 3770K which is... awful value for money at this point. So if you end up with a CPU bottleneck, this is the point at which I'd seriously consider a whole system upgrade.

For graphics, you'd probably want something like the 2060 Super or better. You need your minimum framerates to be above 90fps for VR to avoid motion sickness.

RAM... 8gb is probably enough tbh. Again, you just need to have a clean state before you start the game. No browsers running in the background. Do some reading around this though as I haven't looked into it much.

No harm making sure there are as few bottlenecks as possible, so I'd probably grab a new SSD in the sales too, and make sure any VR game is installed to it.

I run VR games on the i7 3770K and a GTX1070 without issue. I doubt I'll need to make any upgrades to get HL:Alyx working at very playable fps. They don't seem to be pushing boundaries on graphical fidelity.

That 2060 Super is maybe a little more expensive than I was originally planning, but worth consideration, thank you. I haven't done a huge amount of research into RTX but my gut feeling at the moment is that I could probably live without ray tracing. I'll look into it a bit more.

As for the RAM, the current 8GB probably is enough but it seems to be low hanging fruit in terms of relatively little cost to pick up another 8GB.

I've found myself getting into the habit over the last year or two of closing multiple programs if I feel the system is beginning to chug, and definitely if I want to fire up a game which has been working fine, so I'm cautiously optimistic that I would get by with the current CPU.

So, I think at the moment I'm inclined to just focus on a new GPU to start with and see how I get on with that for a while. Just have to figure out which one.

Thanks all!

Xenoronin · 26-11-2019 04:04PM

I'm probably being overly cautious going with the 2060 Super. You can probably drop to a 1660 Super without worries now that I look at some benchmarks. It's about the equivalent of my 1070.
https://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/2528?vs=2542

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/pc-components/graphics-cards/nvidia/geforce-gtx-1660-super

Homelander · 26-11-2019 06:05PM

I have seen some normal 3770 sell for pretty low prices recently, cex have them for 75 quid

https://ie.webuy.com/product-detail?id=scpuinti73770&categoryName=processors-intel&superCatName=computing&title=intel-core-i7-3770-%283.4ghz%29-lga1155

and I think the 1660 super is plenty for now, can always plan a full new build in a year or two again

nobody really uses rtx cards for ray tracing, it's just that they happen to have it, there aren't any non-rtx cards above the 1660ti, so if you want more performance, has to be rtx2060/2070/2080.

Lu Tze · 26-11-2019 07:28PM

Is there still some demand for 3770? Had one in my old computer which spontaneously died apparently in my brothers house, I would guess motherboard (previous went the same, after I had both for 5+ years with no issues). I'll sell on the parts once I get down, if im lucky it will be the PSU gone so I can test everything out when back home

ProjectColossus · 26-11-2019 08:51PM

Xenoronin wrote: »

I'm probably being overly cautious going with the 2060 Super. You can probably drop to a 1660 Super without worries now that I look at some benchmarks. It's about the equivalent of my 1070.

The 1660 Super looks like a solid suggestion to me, I'm leaning towards that at the moment.

I've noticed that the CPU requirement for Half-Life Alyx is an i5-7500 which for one thing my motherboard wouldn't support.
This comparison makes it seem like there isn't a gulf of a difference between my i5-3750k and an i5-7500 though so maybe I would get away with it, and a small overclock on the 3750k would be an option too.

Homelander wrote: »

I have seen some normal 3770 sell for pretty low prices recently, cex have them for 75 quid
https://ie.webuy.com/product-detail?id=scpuinti73770&categoryName=processors-intel&superCatName=computing&title=intel-core-i7-3770-%283.4ghz%29-lga1155

I wouldn't have thought of that. Current mobo would take an i7-3770 or a i7-3770k which CEX also has for a little more, so I'll definitely consider that. The 3770k compares ok against the 7500 I think and again, a small overclock would be an option.

Homelander · 26-11-2019 09:23PM

it depends on the games. in older games the 7500 would be a good bit better but in newer games the 3770 is actually considerably better because of the extra threads. average frames would be similar (maybe even higher on 7500) but minimum frames on 3770 much better, which makes a big difference.

for games in 2018/2019, the 3770 is generally overall better. In fact in some games in 2019 the ancient 2600 is better than say, an i5-7600, because of that minimum frame issue. for example, if an 7500 had avg 80fps, low of 40fps, vs 2600 avg 65fps, low 55fps.....the latter is better for consistent, smooth gameplay.

Homelander · 26-11-2019 10:32PM

dont disagree but the hassle aspect comes into it, some people just want to drop in a new cpu rather than have to swap out the core which is understandable, in that context the 3770 for 75 still makes sense, still a good cpu.

not recommending a 3770 over a 2600, but there is sense in it depending on your thoughts, 3770 still good for all new games at a fairly solid 60fps, the 7500 can't do that due to lack of threads

ProjectColossus · 26-11-2019 11:07PM

I think if I wasn't looking down the barrel of dropping a grand on the VR hardware very soon (hopefully to have up and running for Christmas rather than March), then normally I'd be happier to just go ahead and replace the mobo and cpu on top of the GPU.

At the moment my feeling is that I might get away with just replacing the GPU if I overclock the current CPU. And if I feel like performance is almost there but not quite, then option one is picking up a second hand 3770/3770k to drop into the current build, and option two is replacing the mobo/cpu together. There doesn't seem to be any harm in reassessing and doing another incremental upgrade once I see how the GPU is performing.

And the other possibility is that I might say fuck it and decide to just upgrade everything now particularly if there are decent deals available come Black Friday/Cyber Monday.

I've a friend working in Intel, who knows maybe he can get his hands on something cheap for me

2ndcoming · 26-11-2019 11:14PM

Just remember you'll also have to upgrade the ram if you do go all out.

The upside of sourcing a 3770k and an extra 8gb of DDR3 cheaply on Adverts is it will be easier to sell that lot down the road whenever you decide.

2ndcoming · 27-11-2019 10:35AM

For what it's worth I've a 7600k and RX480 and it's never struggled to run anything at minimum high, usually ultra 1080.

You can go down a rabbit hole with those Youtube benchmarking videos but when it actually comes down to it, unless you're an e-sports professional, the differences are barely noticeable.

Of course, those guys all make their living off promoting new tech so they aren't likely to admit that.

While games are moving slowly towards using more threads, I'm not sure it's happening that quick. By that logic the big Ryzens would pi55 all over everything.

briany · 27-11-2019 11:52AM

If the OP wants to knock 50 euro off their build, I recommend swapping out the Fractal Design case for the Sharkoon M25-V. I have this case and think it's a bit of a steal for what they're currently selling it at. Very minimal in looks, but so is the r4.

ProjectColossus · 28-11-2019 01:44AM

My last post was moved to off topic for reasons beyond me, so here are the pertinent parts again:

2ndcoming wrote: »

Just remember you'll also have to upgrade the ram if you do go all out.

Oh yeah of course. I wasn't fully considering that, thanks for the reminder.

briany wrote: »

If the OP wants to knock 50 euro off their build, I recommend swapping out the Fractal Design case for the Sharkoon M25-V. I have this case and think it's a bit of a steal for what they're currently selling it at. Very minimal in looks, but so is the r4.

Thanks, actually I have the Fractal case already, that list of components in the OP is the stuff I bought last time around. So I'm good for a case. Cheers though.

So having thought about it, it seems like to do this upgrade properly I'm going to have to replace the mobo and CPU as well as the GPU.

I've put together the following basket on Amazon which I'll probably pull the trigger on come Friday, unless some Black Friday specific deals appear.

Item|Price
Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4 3200 MHz|£67.52
AMD Ryzen 5 2600X Processor with Wraith Spire Cooler|£120.97
Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1660 SUPER GAMING OC 6G|£249.99
MSI B450M BAZOOKA V2 Motherboard mATX|£79.99
Shipping|£0
Total|£518.47 / ~€610

I'll reuse my Fractal R4 case, the PSU, and the drives.

What do you think?

K.O.Kiki · 28-11-2019 12:10PM

There's a Gigabyte 1660 Ti for £235 right now: https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Gigabyte-GeForce-GTX-1660-WINDFORCE/dp/B07NWD9VGH/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=gigabyte+1660+ti&qid=1574943030&sr=8-1

ProjectColossus · 28-11-2019 02:40PM

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

There's a Gigabyte 1660 Ti for £235 right now: https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Gigabyte-GeForce-GTX-1660-WINDFORCE/dp/B07NWD9VGH/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=gigabyte+1660+ti&qid=1574943030&sr=8-1

Oh good spot, I'll swap that into the basket. Thanks!

Upgrade advice for 7yo build, for VR spec

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